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relak
2012-07-12, 01:15 AM
How does the "Prime Name Change" work? Does it work differently in different continuities?

Orion Pax got renamed Optimus Prime upon becoming a Prime (whether acquiring the matrix or being appointed one)

If that were the case, shoudnt Hot Rod have been renamed "Hotimus Prime"?

Why wasnt Ultra MAgnus called "Magnus Prime" when he was appointed leader?? (or actually "Ultramus Prime" if we were to go with the Orion Pax style name change)

Also makes you wonder what Sentinel Prime, Nominus Prime and Nova Prime's original non-Prime names were eh?

Thunderwave
2012-07-12, 02:48 AM
How does the "Prime Name Change" work? Does it work differently in different continuities?

I'd assume so.

In Animated it was just a rank. Optimus became Optimus Prime when he assumed the rank of Prime. Ultra Magnus was just Ultra (I'm assuming here) before he took charge.

In the Movies it looks like it's some kind of hereditary thing. Something passed down from the original 13, or at least that's the way it was made to sound by The Fallen.

In G1 I think it's more then just being the leader. I think the Matrix has to accept you as it's bearer. If the Matrix had accepted Magnus he'd of changed form and gotten a new name like Hot Rod did. As for why the name changes the way it does? Who knows. Maybe the Matrix picks it out.

relak
2012-07-12, 04:02 AM
I'd assume so.

In Animated it was just a rank. Optimus became Optimus Prime when he assumed the rank of Prime. Ultra Magnus was just Ultra (I'm assuming here) before he took charge.

In the Movies it looks like it's some kind of hereditary thing. Something passed down from the original 13, or at least that's the way it was made to sound by The Fallen.

In G1 I think it's more then just being the leader. I think the Matrix has to accept you as it's bearer. If the Matrix had accepted Magnus he'd of changed form and gotten a new name like Hot Rod did. As for why the name changes the way it does? Who knows. Maybe the Matrix picks it out.

hmm.......then if Megatron is Optimus Prime's brother in the movies, why isnt he "Megatronus Prime"???

Kinda makes me wonder for G1 cartoon how Magnus Prime would have upgraded. I mean, Ultra Magnus already is a truck with a trailer. What would he have become? A giant 18 Wheeler dragging a massiver battle platform?

What about the IDW comics?

Notabot
2012-07-12, 05:11 AM
Maybe it's more like the papal name change, or the Roman emperors. It can be an homage to someone from the past, or just something that sounds wicked awesome.

relak
2012-07-12, 07:16 AM
Maybe it's more like the papal name change, or the Roman emperors. It can be an homage to someone from the past, or just something that sounds wicked awesome.

hmm could be.

Cos before i watched season 3, i always thought Orion Pax was renamed Optimus Prime as a play on the word "Optimise". He was remade in a new form that is specifically suited to deal the oncoming conflict.

Until i started thinking of "Rodimus" hence i was trying to place a pattern to the whole Prime name changing thing.

Thunderwave
2012-07-12, 10:16 AM
Until i started thinking of "Rodimus" hence i was trying to place a pattern to the whole Prime name changing thing.

80's cartoons scoff at logic!

Red Dave Prime
2012-07-12, 01:14 PM
It started off with Latin for the toys though didnt it?

Optimus Prime - Best First
Orion Pax - Hunter Peace
Omega Supreme - Last/ Final Best (or something like that)

Rodimus though? just a play on his name. I think (not sure) but Magnus in Latin means great king or great royalty so that may be the thinking behind that (always thought his head had a regal look to it)

I've always thought the prime heritage thing just evolved from the various fictions but was never set in stone by Hasbro from the start.

After all, he is called Convoy in Japan.

And that just means a fleet or group of vehicles.

Cliffjumper
2012-07-12, 04:59 PM
Early on in the 1980s stuff it just happens that the coolest guy has the coolest name and that's it, hence the flashback stories in the UK comic where he's got the name when he's an athlete. Even Rodimus was more of a homage than anything else - Optimus is Hot Rod's hero he's grown up to replace. Unless my thinking's wrong it's the Matrix Quest read-out that really puts the idea of it being some sort of heriditary title out there, and since then it's become more and more tied in with the leadership too (whereas taking the Marvel comics at face value, Optimus had the Matrix long before he was Autobot leader).

I'm more than a little bored with the Prime dynasty-type stuff now, though, especially as "new" takes tend to be "Here's [random space-y type noun] Prime, he's a complete prick". I always liked the 1980s take of Rodimus/Hot Rod being a bit of a special case - chosen one, complete one-off. Since then it's been a bit devalued (I liked Sentinel in DotM, don't get me wrong, but having him called Ultra Magnus wouldn't have hurt things - in fact, considering Sentinel Prime is now an Official Prick name, it would have worked better and probably upset a whole load of people).

And it ties into the ****ing Thirteen, which surely no-one real cares about?

Hound
2012-07-12, 05:29 PM
I don't have any ideas about how an Autobot's name changes when he gets the matrix and I don't really care, but past leaders and who they were does interest me.

I'd like to see a couple of stories told that give some character to some of these old Autobot leaders. Something more than "OMG, Whosis Prime just got killed by Megatron!" just before Optimus gets made leader.

Cliffjumper
2012-07-12, 06:33 PM
Yeh, I'd be interested if there was a bit more to them... The only ones we've had in any depth have been gits one way or another; it'd nice to see some stories that didn't revolve around them being prats or done with Optimus Not Prime as the central figure.

I'd love to see something done about the early stages of the war - maybe something with an all-new main cast with the likes of Young Optimus, Megatron, Grimlock etc. in barely glimpsed cameos - giving briefings, mentioned in passing, random panel fillers. A little bit like MS 08th.

Knightdramon
2012-07-12, 07:26 PM
I'll chalk it up to James Roberts\Nick Roche to shed some light on those past days.

As for the names, we've only glimpsed Optimus, Rodimus and Sentinel [IDW G1] before they became Primes, and only Sentinel had his name not changed.

I try not to think about it too much. There's adequate backstory on all [named] Primes before Optimus in the IDW universe so far. Even Nominus, who has two panels in two different comics so far, is painted as a dark and bastardy character.

Somehow though, it makes sense, doesn't it? If all leaders were as good\pure as Optimus is, in times of peace, there wouldn't be a need for Megatron to rise.

zigzagger
2012-07-12, 07:47 PM
As for the names, we've only glimpsed Optimus, Rodimus and Sentinel [IDW G1] before they became Primes, and only Sentinel had his name not changed.


I did like how Rodimus' name started off as being nothing more than a nickname in the IDW-verse, rather than being a title 'officially' given to him. It's a unique take on the whole Autobot Leader naming process.

The name 'Rodimus' just ended up sticking, the way Costa and Roberts played it off (with the 'Prime' ultimately being dropped -- probably at the behest of Hasbro, I'm guessing).

Knightdramon
2012-07-12, 07:51 PM
And that's probably due to the whole mishap with copyrights and all that on the toy itself.

In Japan, Hot Rod was Hot Rodimus which in turn became Rodimus Convoy. Not that drastic a change.

inflatable dalek
2012-07-14, 04:12 PM
Optimus Prime being called Optimus Prime before even getting the Matrix in Marvel is easily explained by him doing a Sir Hugo Rune and changing his name by deep pool to include the title in order to save everyone else the time and bother of bestowing it upon him as would inevitably happen because of his innate awesomeness. "It is an honorary title. I bestowed it upon myself in honour of myself".

Whilst shades of grey are nice I do think that most recent media, and especially IDW, have gone too far in the direction of "Christ, they're all pricks and/or useless!". It's starfleet Admiral syndrome.










And it's basically going to be impossible to use the phrase "Shades of grey" in conversation now without thinking of that bloody book isn't it?

Paul053
2012-07-16, 03:16 PM
Maybe coincident or intentional by the producers I don't know.

Was reading the Bible last week and suddenly noticed the name change thing. God changed Agraham's name from Abram, Sarah's name from Sarai, and Israel's name from Jacob. All these name change also mean the change of their lives and spirits that invoke to a different and higher level. So Optimus and Rodimus name change kind of tie into this. Maybe I think too much.

Anyway, I love the name "Optimus Prime" which I always dislike his foreign names (especially Japanese and Chinese). I know it's almost impossible to translate his name to those languages but that also lost that name meaning and feeling, too.

inflatable dalek
2012-07-16, 03:46 PM
I'm sure "Convoy" sounds more exotic and foreign to someone who only speaks Japanese. After all, "Best First" is actually a pretty crap name (no one ever claims the suspiciously close "Leader One" is awesome), it only gets away with it because nobody speaks Latin anymore.