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Cliffjumper
2013-04-09, 12:13 PM
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Bit surprised no-one thought of doing that before. Bit goofy how they gun down Devastator then run off when the little Structies get their pop guns out. Or entirely in keeping with Devastator's prowess in the series. Right on the cusp.

inflatable dalek
2013-04-09, 12:49 PM
There's an interesting argument in the description as to why the poster thinks this might have been animated, though I'm not entirely convinced (I suspect most of the score was compossed from the script than finished animation).

Certainly I've always thought the final edit would be pretty much locked before they started full on animation just to save them the cost of doing something they wouldn't actually use. I think a very brief trim is all that's shown up to date.

Conversely though, I've always thought it likely they voice recorded the whole script just to cover all their bases without needing to rehire (in some cases more expensive than usual) actors if they changed their minds on something.

I do like how that scene uses things like their missiles and Magnus' trailer. Though I suspect Red Alert's year two status would have saved him in the final footage.

Cyberstrike nTo
2013-04-09, 03:14 PM
There's an interesting argument in the description as to why the poster thinks this might have been animated, though I'm not entirely convinced (I suspect most of the score was compossed from the script than finished animation).

In an interview on the Rhino DVD version of TF:TM Vince DiCola claimed he wrote the score to the storyboards.

Summerhayes
2013-04-09, 05:22 PM
I was under the impression there was reams and reams of unusec footage everybody knew about?

Cliffjumper
2013-04-09, 10:59 PM
Certainly I've always thought the final edit would be pretty much locked before they started full on animation just to save them the cost of doing something they wouldn't actually use. I think a very brief trim is all that's shown up to date.

Basically. This is true of pretty much any cel-animated film; things are cut if there's a bad reaction in previews or if there are serious, serious post-production issues and that's it; if they're not 99.9% sure it's going to make the film it is not animated. I mean, how many pre-DVD Disney films have director's cuts or extended versions (bearing in mind that Disney would also have taken incredible care of this material)? How many anime films? I think now that DVD and Bluray are here it's more likely for an animation team to throw stuff together for the media releases but back then you only made what you were 99% sure you'd need.

The other thing with TF:TM is you have to ask why stuff would be cut. The film is, what, 84 minutes long - so there's five, six minutes before it's over an hour and a half and possibly too long. Nothing we've seen posited is mind-numbingly violent; apart from possibly the Dirge head-smash there's nothing more explicit than Starscream's disintegration. And the sequence shown above is basically a great advert for Magnus.

Vin Ghostal
2013-04-15, 11:55 PM
It's hard to understand why they'd cut this one in particular, since it's a perfect representation of the capabilities of the Ultra Magnus toy. If I recall correctly, the only time the movie shows his truck mode is for less than a second during the initial assault on Autobot City.

Wasn't he the biggest and most expensive toy introduced during the movie? Wouldn't you like to show off his alternate mode? Christ, Ironhide, the guy who's about to be brutally murdered because he isn't for sale in 1986, gets more screen time in vehicular mode than Magnus. Screw that, Arcee, who DOESN'T EVEN HAVE A TOY, gets tons of screen time in both modes. Sure, that makes sense.

Cliffjumper
2013-04-16, 01:32 AM
Galvatron would've been the same price I guess, but yeh. Magnus gets the shit end of the stick in general in the film - he's bugger-all use at any point; the script goes out of its' way to make him look like a moron. He could at least have done something in, say, the battle at Autobot City. TBH, Hot Rod, Kup and Galvatron are the only new guys who come out of the film with much credit... Springer's just sort-of there making quips but doing ****-all, Blurr's a joke character, Scourge and Cyclonus could be anyone, Arcee turns into a blubbing extra after a respectable start...

Mind, I personally think all the various gloriously gory scenes scripted and/or storyboarded for Autobot City should have made it in; the S1/2 cast were largely ignored for S3 so why not wipe all of them out in a hugely traumatic way? I want to see Gears sliced in half by Cyclonus, damnit! They could have cut Quintessa and Junk; the plot wouldn't have suffered (they collect two ships from those adventures, which they only need because they go to Quintessa and Junk) and the film's so preposterously front-heavy anyway that shifting the balance more wouldn't do any actual harm.

inflatable dalek
2013-04-16, 07:02 AM
Pure speculation, but two thoughts on why Magnus might be surprisingly underused in the film and why his big scene (which otherwise only features old characters) was cut:

1: He's the only "Money for old rope" character introduced in the film. Even discounting the various Diaclone era uses it's a good bet the previous two years of Optimus Prime sales had already left the basic toy very much in profit, even accounting for the fancy new trailer. Shifting more is nice for Hasbro, but there'd be more need to focus on bigging up the entirely new toys.

Tangential to this, Sunbow seem to have had pretty much a free-or as free as you ever get with a toy property- hand with the new characters. Hence the character designs being basically impossible to turn into toys with a decent likeness using the tech of the time, amusingly they'd struggle with the Bay designs two decades later for similar reasons. It's understandable human nature they'd be more invested in the characters created by them from the ground up and give them more time and effort than the reuse.

2: The main role of Magnus in the film is to be a red herring, to fool the kids into thinking he's the new permanent replacement for Optimus and thus ensuing a surprise ending (which probably explains the reuse in the first place, being the same basic toy emphasises that). And that's an area the film fails in because no thought has been put into him beyond that basic function of just being there.

Vin Ghostal
2013-04-16, 09:41 PM
Hot Rod, Kup and Galvatron are the only new guys who come out of the film with much credit...

Agreed, though I actually think Wreck-Gar should be included in that list. He's the leader of a brand new race of Transformers, he gets the best of Springer, he leads the resurrection of Ultra Magnus, he enthusiastically pilots an assault on Unicron, and he generally looks good without ever getting bitched out by anyone except, well, Daniel of all people. I think he emerged from the film looking at least as strong and credible as Kup.

Terome
2013-04-16, 09:57 PM
Gnaw gets a good showing as a unit of cannon fodder. Was a bit obsessed with him as a kid. Never have seen the toy in the petrocarbon.

Terome
2013-04-16, 10:06 PM
Remember that awful TF:TM comics adaptation that IDW had Budiansky do for some reason? No? Don't blame you.

What would have been mildly amusing would have been to do as Cliffjumper says - Get rid of everything after Prime's death and have a big old Battle Of Autobot City ruck with all the ludicrous cyber-gore and extra smashed heads and what have you. Would people have liked that?

Cliffjumper
2013-04-16, 10:51 PM
That is basically what I thought the comic would be for - jamming in all the scripted stuff, covering a few plot holes, toning down the Crazy Alien Travelogue that makes up the second half of the film... Still probably the most amazingly wrongheaded thing IDW ever did, up against some serious competition. Until they topped it by slinging out extra pages that did exactly that for the TPB.

Agreed, though I actually think Wreck-Gar should be included in that list.

Agreed! I always forget he was a toy...

inflatable dalek
2013-04-17, 06:56 PM
Even if the intent with the IDW movie book had been a straightforward adaptation (which isn't how it was pimped) it still fails. Just about every line is worse than in the film (which was hardly Shakespeare) and the visual storytelling is often very poor, frequently coming off as copies of screengrabs with no thought put into how it works on the page (the transformation of Autobot city being a great example, if you want to know why Springer and Arcee are running down a trench for one panel you have to go watch the movie).

Was I the only one who, as a kid, had no idea what the hell Wreck Gar was saying?

Skyquake87
2013-04-17, 08:21 PM
Nope, there's quite a few lines of his that even now i can't really make out, because they've over done the 'tuning a telly' effects on the vocal processing.

Notabot
2013-04-17, 09:49 PM
I still get a kick out of the fact that the movie stops for a commercial break when Wreck-Gar is introduced. Even as a kid I thought that was weird for a big screen movie.