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zigzagger
2013-10-25, 06:17 AM
Transformers: Dark Cybertron Volume 1 contains Dark Cybetron #1, More Than Meets The Eye #23-25 and Robots In Disguise #23-24.

-- ziggy

----

The Transformers title-spanning crossover begins here.

Transformers: Dark Cybertron #1 three-page preview @ Full Metal Hero (http://www.fullmetalhero.com/content/transformers-dark-cybertron-1-3-page-preview-7704/)

Full preview due sometime closer to the release date. Stay tuned.

zigzagger
2013-10-25, 06:20 AM
Sure, it's only a 3-page preview and all, but... mmmm, I dunno.

Unicron
2013-10-25, 10:20 AM
Yeah... I'm not sure either. Wait and see, I suppose.

Also, only page 2 and they've retconned something (originally Galvatron sent the ship into the anomaly on his own, now it's on Nova's order). Think that's a record.

Red Dave Prime
2013-10-25, 02:17 PM
Well spotted Unicron.

That was always made to be a thing for Galvatron - he sacrificed the crew to follow his lure to the Darkness. I think. May need to check, but I know what you're saying is right.

Warcry
2013-10-25, 02:54 PM
I still don't understand the allure that the Dead Universe has for writers. It turned out badly the first two times we visited it. Why in the world are they making it three? It was better off dead and buried, IMO.

That was always made to be a thing for Galvatron - he sacrificed the crew to follow his lure to the Darkness. I think. May need to check, but I know what you're saying is right.
You're absolutely right. Galvatron flew them into the anomaly was because he lusted for the power of the Darkness that called out to him. His spotlight made a big deal about how all the people aboard the Ark (all ten of them, if that tiny cockpit is any indication...) were dead by his hands.

inflatable dalek
2013-10-25, 08:00 PM
Don't worry, in 2015 Barber will write a 20 issue mini-series explaining the difference.





It's down to a gestalt.

Warcry
2013-10-25, 08:03 PM
Don't be silly.

It's a Titan fuelled by that time-travel ore.

inflatable dalek
2013-10-25, 08:11 PM
John Barber: Answering all the questions you never knew you had.


As long as you don't mind them all having one of three answers.

Terome
2013-10-25, 10:10 PM
Mm. It's a very forgivable retcon. Galvatron doesn't seem to be the kind of guy who'd remember a reasonable discussion if there was a chance he could confabulate things into some mad, personal quest. He's a robot Calvin.

zigzagger
2013-11-05, 04:40 AM
... And here's the rest of the preview, once again courtesy of Full Metal Hero (http://www.fullmetalhero.com/content/dark-cybertron-1-preview-7737/).

Skyquake87
2013-11-05, 08:37 AM
Why does Shockwave sound like a cackling loon?

He's about this far from saying "Muhahahahaa My evil plan nears fruition!" He sounds like Stan Lee is writing him.

Perhaps because I've not been reading RID or I missed something...but that panel with Cyclonus (back to us) in Shockwave's lab came out of nowhere. No idea what's going on with Waspinator and Metroplex (if its Metroplex - and not, ooh Brian the nameless Titan). I am sure all will become clear.

So basically, Dark Cybertron is Shockwave's big experiment goes awry, wackiness ensues.

Rack 'n Ruin
2013-11-05, 12:43 PM
Perhaps because I've not been reading RID or I missed something...but that panel with Cyclonus (back to us) in Shockwave's lab came out of nowhere.

That's not Cyclonus. That's Shockwave in his FOC toy body, which he has had for a while in RID.

Terome
2013-11-05, 01:32 PM
Hard to get a grip on anything just yet - this is all just laying the table.

Why does Shockwave sound like a cackling loon?

He's about this far from saying "Muhahahahaa My evil plan nears fruition!" He sounds like Stan Lee is writing him.

From this it looks like his evil plan is to undo the war entirely. That's... remarkably nice of him. If someone built up a stack of quasi-magical bobbins to undo World War One and World War Two then I suppose the only ethical thing would be to let that person get on with it. Though I guess it would mean we would all die.

Red Dave Prime
2013-11-05, 06:46 PM
Perhaps because I've not been reading RID or I missed something...but that panel with Cyclonus (back to us) in Shockwave's lab came out of nowhere. No idea what's going on with Waspinator and Metroplex (if its Metroplex - and not, ooh Brian the nameless Titan). I am sure all will become clear.


Bit mean to pick on it if you havent been following the preludes bit at least. Waspinator and the metro titan (dont think its plex but it might be brian) have all been explained already.

Denyer
2013-11-05, 07:19 PM
They're trying to bring in readers, so it needs some background. Seems okay to me in terms of setup though.

that panel with Cyclonus (back to us) in Shockwave's lab came out of nowhere.

AFAICT that's FoC Shockwave, with the wings...

Skyquake87
2013-11-05, 08:15 PM
Fair enough,just didn't look like shockers :) i think i would prefer the not metroplex titans to be coloured differently (they were in those annual flashback scenes) as i am too dim to be able to tell them apart.

I gave up on rid around the time prowl got turned into devastator.the book jumped the shark for me at that point and thats pretty much coloured my judgement,sadly.

Rack 'n Ruin
2013-11-05, 08:23 PM
Yeah, I've been buying the RID trades, and really don't feel the urge to keep going. Dark Cybertron needs to provide the impetus for a MASSIVE improvement in RID, or I'm out and following MTMTE only. Sad that Prowl, Wheeljack and Starscream have all had good moments, but have ultimately been wasted. :(

Knightdramon
2013-11-06, 06:31 PM
aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaand my speculation [or at least one of them] was correct.

Nova's back and it's his plan all along

Terome
2013-11-06, 07:35 PM
The thread title hasn't been spoilered yet so I'll do this:

Seems like a perfectly functional introduction. It felt a lot like my experience of watching Prime - it's underwhelming but if I imagine myself being the target audience age then I can see it possibly being the greatest thing ever. I got a real Sonic The Comic feeling off the set-up. It's supposed to be packed in with a toy, right? I think it's a good fit - being dropped feet-first into all this madness after getting a Skids for Christmas would probably be a great feeling.

I liked Shockwave getting kind of giddy. He's been working very hard at this for a long time so I think he's earned the right to get an attack of the vapours. Starscream was on good form but that 'Starscream The First' business was kind of against the grain.

The art is really impressive too. I really like the layouts - they've been kind of perfunctory of late so it is nice to see some style put into them.

All in all, while I don't find stories like this to be exactly to my tastes, this is very competently put together and a canny piece of marketing.

Oh and hey, there's Kup.

inflatable dalek
2013-11-06, 09:09 PM
OUT NOW AND SPOILEREISED PEEPs.



















Agred with Terome pretty much completely, a set up issue that's mainly about explaining the rather convoluted backstory to anyone who has joined up for the crossover, which is exactly what it needs to be.

It was still nice and readable though, with lots of nice little moments (Rodimus' reaction to Magnus asking if Pax is taking over being a highlight). Whilst I'm still not remotely excited about the Dead Universe, at least Shockwave was actually interesting in his glee and servitude.

I did however think the writing for Starscream was terrible, there's all the subtlety gone out the window there.

Terome
2013-11-07, 12:14 AM
I did however think the writing for Starscream was terrible, there's all the subtlety gone out the window there.

I'd put that in the category of 'had to go in order to get everything crammed in there' along with the kill-switch follow up. We needed to know that Starscream is

A baddie
The mayor
Has a shiny new body
Is crafty but also blinkered


Which was accomplished.

Though I thought the full page spread reveal of his new body could have been better spent. Call me French but I get quite irritated by the superhero convention of lavishing space on costume changes. We'll see plenty of him later and there are covers that show off the new design quite adequately.

That lovely double spread of the Titan coming through the surface was enough splash for one issue, in my opinion.

zigzagger
2013-11-07, 05:12 AM
Eeeeh... still not entirely sold on this, set-up or not.

I am a little curious how this is going to carry over into MTMTE #23 -- or rather, how that title's cast will respond to the situation. Hopefully Roberts can work some magic.

Soooo, at very least I'll stick around for that before panning the whole thing.

And, hey, it's Kup! That's gotta count for something. I'll have to strike that one off the wishlist.

inflatable dalek
2013-11-07, 08:25 AM
I'd put that in the category of 'had to go in order to get everything crammed in there' along with the kill-switch follow up. We needed to know that Starscream is

A baddie
The mayor
Has a shiny new body
Is crafty but also blinkered


Which was accomplished.

Yeah, I could see what they were aiming for, it was just a bit on the nose (and didn't feel very Barber-ey, are the two authors swapping characters?).

Though I thought the full page spread reveal of his new body could have been better spent. Call me French but I get quite irritated by the superhero convention of lavishing space on costume changes. We'll see plenty of him later and there are covers that show off the new design quite adequately.

Good point, I don't think it stood out as a waste of space initially because the far more pointless Soundwave spread from RID21 is still so fresh in my mind. This scores over that in a few ways (it's a character in a form we've not seen before; they're saying something and moving a bit), but it's still a long way from being essential.

I do feel sorry for Unicron Trilogy fans (both of them) that the one toy representing that franchise in the 30th anniversary toyline is going to be released as G1 Starscream instead (I suppose the profile might still be UT-ey, but that would be confusing with the pack in comic being all G1-ey). At least Rattrap and Waspinator are effectively the Beast Wars characters brought into G1.

I'm not sure about the idea of flashforwards, with solicitations and covers promoted months in advance anyway (Nova and Galvatron was the least surprising cliffhanger ever in that regard) I'm not sure the comic itself needed to spoil the surprise return of Kup as well.

Plus, if Shockwave can see the future, his inevitable defeat will make him look really, really stupid.

[And it had a bit of that Zero space bobbins from Reg about it as well].

And Slog? Really? That had better not bloody well make it into the comic.

More positives:

The "Previously on..." being made up of old art was a nice touch, emphasising the TV feel all this talk of "Seasons" create.

Having done nothing for months (though in comic time, it's minutes... boy did the last five issues of RID really piss it's pace all up the wall) the Cybertronian Autobots deciding to go into action was very welcome and the bits of interaction were very well done, especially Arcee's constant "It's Jhiaxus!". I like to think she just makes that claim everytime she stubs her toe or uses all the loo roll in a day as well.

Terome
2013-11-08, 10:28 AM
Here's a review from someone who hasn't been overly involved in Transformers output for more years than are strictly necessary:

http://www.geekedoutnation.com/comic-book-reviews/review-transformers-dark-cybertron-1/

"It just about makes sense to me, but I did have to read through the book a few times to get the gist of it all. It’s not simple, and this book certainly doesn’t make it easy to understand what is going on.

Perhaps it’s just going to be a period of reaclimatising myself to this world of giant robots, because I really enjoyed this book, difficult though it was to fully understand every subtle nuance and reference point that was contained within.
It had a nice touch of humour about it as well with the robots ribbing each other like football players in a locker room. The art was very clear, very bright and very large, bold and dramatic when it needed to be."

Going by that review and the comic's own merits (an introduction and assembly point), I'd call Dark Cybertron a partial success.

Red Dave Prime
2013-11-08, 02:15 PM
I enjoyed this issue. While it has its poor bits (yep, starscream just didnt work) it also had some good bits too.

The overall vibe I got was similar to when a tv show moves to a movie (star trek and firefly spring to mind)- it has to try and introduce all these characters while maintaining some flow of narrative. It doesn't quite succeed but it does a pretty good job all the same.

I liked the artwork too, nice mix of styles and flow. The titan double splash was worth it. Overall it was a good issue to kick things off because it looks like all the pre-amble is finally done with and we are straight to the heart of the matter.

There's a few niggles other than starscream that let it down - the "dont call me prime" thing has worn well thin now, as has Barbers use of monologues. Also, Prime is still a bit too navel gazey for me. I want the take-charge prime from Shadowplay. Anything else is done to death and boring.

The final page is also a bit of a head scratcher. Maybe I'm reading it wrong but Galvatron is alive along with Nova Prime and they are the ones behind everything with Shockwave being somewhat loyal to Galvatron? Hmm...

inflatable dalek
2013-11-08, 03:21 PM
Oddly, Galvatron being behind this all along would actually fit in better with the original take on their entry into the Dark Universe where it was his choice to do so rather than acting on orders.

I had forgotten this (mainly because the confusion in my mind caused by previous DU stuff can only be calmed by going to look at a picture of Kelly Brook for half an hour) till it was pointed out elsewhere, but the last time Galvatron met a non-possessed by D-Ream (or whatever actually happened in Heart of Darkness) Nova/Nemesis (Novais?) he tried to kill his former boss. Which was of course, right before Galvatron was chucked in the famous Solar Pool.

Considering Barber is so hot on continuity I doubt this has been forgotten, so it'll be interesting to see how they patched things up.

zigzagger
2013-11-17, 07:43 AM
Transformers: Robots In Disguise #23: Dark Cybertron Part 3 (of 12) preview courtesy of Full Metal Hero (http://www.fullmetalhero.com/t14609/).

Full preview due sometime closer to the release date. Stay Tuned.

zigzagger
2013-11-17, 07:45 AM
Transformers: More Than Meets The Eye #23: Dark Cybertron Part 2 (of 12) preview courtesy of Seibertron (http://www.seibertron.com/transformers/news/idw-transformers-more-than-meets-the-eye-23-dark-cybertron-2-of-12/28790/).

zigzagger
2013-11-17, 07:51 AM
Not as much MTMTE in this preview than I would prefer (razzin' frazzin' crossover :(), but Brainstorm is always good value.

Terome
2013-11-17, 02:33 PM
Yes, and Raiz is a lot better when he's not cutting and pasting body parts around like he's making a Flash cartoon.

I am getting the feeling that fears about MTMTE being jostled about with by the necessities of the crossover are slowly but surely becoming true.

Denyer
2013-11-17, 03:45 PM
Not hating it so far... apart from whichever idiot put their site logo over panel text...

Auntie Slag
2013-11-17, 03:46 PM
This is a right bunch of arse. I fancy sitting this whole Dark Cybertron thing out, I don't want to buy preludes and RID just to get the full story. I'll come back when MTMTE is properly MTMTE again.

Terome
2013-11-17, 03:53 PM
I think the preludes make up about half of the Dark Cybertron story. If we count the Spotlights, MTMTE 22 and the last three issues of RID and Dark Cybertron 1 we get something like ten issues.

Auntie Slag
2013-11-17, 04:45 PM
But doesn't Dark Cybertron carry on unbroken within the pages of MTMTE from issues 22 through to 27?

Terome
2013-11-17, 05:10 PM
Oh yes, it does that. I was talking about the stuff we've already seen, Spotlight Orion Pax through to Dark Cybertron #1 (the Wiki includes the RID Syndromica stories too) to bolster your case that you'd have to buy a lot of comics in order to follow MTMTE for the next six months.

From the Wiki, the prelude consists of:

"Syndromica"

Syndromica (1)
Syndromica (2)

"Dark Prelude"

Orion Pax
Thundercracker
Megatron
Bumblebee
Trailcutter
Hoist

"Dark Cybertron Prelude"

Robots in Disguise #17
#18
#19
#20
#21
#22
More than Meets the Eye #22

Though to be honest that's all guff to me - Dark Cybertron #1 is really all you need to get the gist if you're feeling brave.

inflatable dalek
2013-11-17, 07:01 PM
That really does put into context how much of the leg work Barber has had to do (though who knows what other bits of MTMTE will turn out to be directly important? Presumably that Titan graveyard from Remain in Light will have a part to play...), no wonder RID went off the rails a tad in the last six months.

Denyer
2013-11-17, 07:52 PM
It's primarily his story. Which explains why Gorlam Prime has been squandered as a concept (pissing over work by a previous writer and with no regard for the story possibilities) and the Dark Cybertron concept comes across as pseudo-science nonsense.

Terome
2013-11-17, 11:05 PM
Mmm, it does seem that way. Is Gorlam Prime kersplat though? We did see it begin to blow up but those magic ores could fix it in a jiffy. It's not any worse than when Heart Of Darkness killed off the entire population for yuks.

Denyer
2013-11-17, 11:57 PM
Galvatron being stripped to the skeleton appeared to be a dream sequence... most of the rest of HoD could be put down to bad acid as well.

inflatable dalek
2013-11-20, 07:45 PM
OUT NOW AND SPOILERS TO FOLLOW.

















Oh look, Nightbeat. Now, there's a shock. I'd have left him in the preserve of flashbacks myself (especially as it feels as if Roberts- and apologies if that's unfair and I've picked on the wrong author- is determined to take his "Head shots aren't leathel" idea to comics that were written before he was onboard), but lets see how it goes. Wouldn't it be amazing if this ends with any situation other than the character being on the Lost Light?

Otherwise, much like the last issue it was surprisingly solid despite having to fight my misgivings on the EPIC EVENT as a whole. I don't think I'm ever going to love this, as Terome put it better than me with the first part it's just not designed to push my buttons which isn't really the fault of the story, but if it keeps up this rough level (but maybe sorted out things like the really odd way Barber continues to write- and apologies to Barber if that's unfair and I've picked on the wrong author- Starscream without any of the subtlety or shades he had for most of RID) it will be readable rather than something to endure.

Rack 'n Ruin
2013-11-20, 08:28 PM
I'll wait to see what people think of Dark Cybertron after it has got going properly, but currently I feel no urge to buy it. In fact, I'm hoping that it leaves MTMTE largely unaffected so I can ignore DC and when it is over I can simply pick up MTMTE again. I think RID is for the chop (for me). How can a comic featuring Prowl, Wheeljack, Soundwave & Shockwave be SO dull? Unbelievable. :(

Knightdramon
2013-11-20, 08:54 PM
Not a bad issue. Outside of the guy who did the RID segments, who draws in a very, very basic manner, I *LOVED* the art in this issue.

I liked Raiz way before it became "cool" to criticize him. His Magnus is possibly my favourite rendition. Yes, his drawing style isn't for everybody, as it makes the bots ridiculously big, brawny and menacing, but for the bots it goes well with, its amazing.

A bit miffed about Nightbeat--it's only one panel or something and we have no clue what it means, but it certainly seems like a "hasbro is making a nightbeat toy finally, and they want it in the comics NOW".

Which is odd---pretty much every character that had a cameo or was mentionned in the RID and MTMTE flashbacks turns up alive and well later on.

Terome
2013-11-20, 11:24 PM
I'm souring. Aside from the scene in Swerve's there's not much to like. Though I quite like Scoop's character, the cod-Bible verses from The Covenant of Primes was bottom of the barrel material.

What on earth was the point of another big chunk of space being devoted to Starscream walking through a door?

I guess the time-travel angle on Nova Prime was off.

Did I miss something on the 'forcefield generator in one hand and THAT in the other' line? He didn't have anything, right?

I can't muster up much of an opinion on Nightbeat. It's dumb as hell but as Dalek says he will end up on the Lost Light and once Dark Cybertron is a distant memory he will probably be a good character to have around. As there's a chance that Cyclonus will not be surviving this, Nightbeat may serve as the resident Dead Universe Guy after him.

As an aside, the casting of David Sobolov as Shockwave in Transformers: Prime was pretty canny, to my mind. I don't 'hear' many characters in any particular voice but his Shockwave fits quite nicely for all of his lines.

Red Dave Prime
2013-11-20, 11:43 PM
I'm ok with most of this, but there still isn't a hook for the story just yet. Its possible that they have left it too long in the set-up and there will be no big reveal or event to really grab me in. At present, until Shockwaves / novas full plan is clearly revealed its hard to feel any major urge to see how this all plays out. All I know is Shockwave is doing... something. And it involves the Dead Universe.... somehow. And there is a big Titan standing around on Cybertron doing nothing. (Just out of curiosity, remember at the end of issue 18 or 19, Bumblebee and his Crew say Shockwave against a blazing sun on the horizon and Arcee was all Jhiaxus crazy? What happened to that? )

That said, its an ok read. There's just a lack of excitement for my part at the moment I'm really just looking forward to MTMTE getting back to what it does best - irrelevant scenes in swerves bar.

inflatable dalek
2013-11-21, 07:02 AM
I'm souring. Aside from the scene in Swerve's there's not much to like. Though I quite like Scoop's character, the cod-Bible verses from The Covenant of Primes was bottom of the barrel material.

I found the CoP thing slightly odd (not in a bad way as such as it's such a small thing) in that they bring in a big honking reference from the past but slightly change the name for no readily apparent reason, The Covenant of Primes brings back memories of Eremite Xeon from The War Within.

The wiki suggests they didn't go for Primus as he's not widely worshipped in the IDW Universe, but considering this is established as an obscure cult I don't see what difference that would have made (especially as Primus is namechecked in the same scene).

What is odd is that the third cover suggests this is going to be the the pack in toy with Scoop, I'd have thought his previous issue would have been the better one to go for, "Hey kids, your new toy is robot Ian Paisley!" isn't the biggest sell.

What might be nice, is if Shockwave's head (and by extension all victims of the big E) was deliberately designed to look like the Evil One from this old prophecy as part making him look like a freak to the rest of society. So it's a self fulfilling thing.

What on earth was the point of another big chunk of space being devoted to Starscream walking through a door?

Hey, for the second issue in a row that didn't even click until you said it, perhaps I just have a Armada Starscream Splash Page Blind Spot?

I guess the time-travel angle on Nova Prime was off.

I did like the "Oh no, we're good friends really... shut up shit face!" bit, if they're going to sweep all that under the carpet at least they did it with a nice gag (which rings enough of a bell to feel like a direct homage to something but I can't place it...).

It did mean I totally misread the end of the last issue though as I thought Galvatron was supposed to be in charge and Shockwave was expecting both of them.


I can't muster up much of an opinion on Nightbeat. It's dumb as hell but as Dalek says he will end up on the Lost Light and once Dark Cybertron is a distant memory he will probably be a good character to have around. As there's a chance that Cyclonus will not be surviving this, Nightbeat may serve as the resident Dead Universe Guy after him.

I think what didn't help was that if not for the distinctive chest and colours (well, and the fact it was inevitable. Why do they call this place the Dead Universe anyway? Between Nightbeat, Hardhead, Kup [apparently], Nova Prime, Galvatron and Jhiaxus it's more like the Life Universe) I'd have not recognised that as Nightbeat.

I do like Livio's stuff, and he did have good fun with Optimus Prime vs. SPACE SLUGS, but his Hardhead was a bit odd as well.

(Just out of curiosity, remember at the end of issue 18 or 19, Bumblebee and his Crew say Shockwave against a blazing sun on the horizon and Arcee was all Jhiaxus crazy? What happened to that? )

Well, the obvious explanation for that is




SHUT UP AND DON'T QUESTION.

Terome
2013-11-21, 10:23 AM
Dalek: What might be nice, is if Shockwave's head (and by extension all victims of the big E) was deliberately designed to look like the Evil One from this old prophecy as part making him look like a freak to the rest of society. So it's a self fulfilling thing.

Mmm, like giving someone devil horns or making them wear a scold. I'd also think that someone like Starscream would have deliberately chosen his name from the robot equivalent of Revelations. Like those dozens of street kid gangs from the 70s calling themselves 'Little Satan.' (http://wearesupervision.blogspot.co.uk/2009/03/chicago-lesser-known-arts-history.html)

Would have been neat for it to be The Covenant of Primacron just to mess with people.

It did mean I totally misread the end of the last issue though as I thought Galvatron was supposed to be in charge and Shockwave was expecting both of them.

I've seen that misreading in a few places. It was quite a mealy-mouthed speech bubble.

the third cover suggests this is going to be the the pack in toy with Scoop, I'd have thought his previous issue would have been the better one to go for, "Hey kids, your new toy is robot Ian Paisley!" isn't the biggest sell.


I'd have thought that Three Monologues story where Scoop fixes the blackout would be the best bet for a pack-in. I reread that issue the other day, thought it was pretty good on its own merits. Would work as a Rattrap issue too. Is the idea then for all pack-in comics this year to be Dark Cybertron ones?

Red Dave Prime: (Just out of curiosity, remember at the end of issue 18 or 19, Bumblebee and his Crew say Shockwave against a blazing sun on the horizon and Arcee was all Jhiaxus crazy? What happened to that? )

Ooooh yeah. Shockwave was walking out of the sunset wasn't he? Maybe that is Yet To Come?

All I know is Shockwave is doing... something. And it involves the Dead Universe.... somehow.

Yeah. And we've known that Shockwave is doing... something since that quite embarrassing issue of Robots In Disguise which must have come out at least twenty years ago. We've known that it must involve a Titan since Spotlight: Trailcutter. We've not known that Nova Prime was directly involved for long but there's no forward motion on that here.

Summerhayes
2013-11-22, 12:59 AM
Did I miss something on the 'forcefield generator in one hand and THAT in the other' line? He didn't have anything, right?
.

I think that's what he meant; he didn't have anything special that makes him a leader.

Overall- not terrible, but it's definitely a case of this dragging MTMTE down rather than lifting RiD up.

Red Dave Prime
2013-11-22, 03:15 PM
Glad I wasnt to only one to misread the speecg at the end of issue 1 - genuinely thought galvatron was the one shockers was calling leader.

Terome
2013-11-22, 04:55 PM
Summerhayes: I think that's what he meant; he didn't have anything special that makes him a leader.

Overall- not terrible, but it's definitely a case of this dragging MTMTE down rather than lifting RiD up.

Ah okay. Figure of speech and such. Have to say that Riaz's choice of angle there was less than ideal.

Terome
2013-11-26, 05:17 PM
Full preview up. (http://www.fullmetalhero.com/content/transformers-robots-disguise-23-full-preview-7814/)

Along with a full preview of Regeneration One 96. (http://www.fullmetalhero.com/content/transformers-regeneration-one-96-full-preview-7813/)

Quite like Soundwave calmly shooting the piss out of Slag while telling Bumblebee that he is worthless. That's how you parlay.
Small niggle - between Arcee, Ironhide and the Dinobots shouldn't the Autobots be wiping the floor with the Decepticons? I know, I know.

We get a weird repeat of Starscream's Issue of Monologuing to People In Various States of Distress. The stunning reveal is that you could have covered all that ground in two pages. I kid, I quite liked that issue.

If Regeneration One had started off with that scene I think we'd all be a lot warmer to it. Guido is absolutely slaughtering it and between the art and the suddenly effective dialogue it really does seem like they have genuinely all gone to hell. Think I'll give it a look in this week.

inflatable dalek
2013-11-27, 09:06 PM
OUT NOW AND READ SPOILERS FOLLOW















As there actually are some potential spoilers this week as, after all the set up, the plot finally kicks into gear. It's still slightly sluggish but it feels like we're going somewhere now and the advantage of two years in Iacon is seeing it totally wrecked is actually quite affecting.

It was also finally nice to see someone snap at Bumblebee's leadership, it's a shame it was the one guy with an ulterior motive and in the end it's inevitable Bee will be vindicated (and fair enough, "Shoot first" isn't a very Autobot philosophy), but hopefully after this is all over the other Autobots will drop him down a deep dark hole somewhere and put someone more competent in charge.

Pleanty to chose from there.

And also: THUMB QUEST. I nice subversion of expectations over who the "Old friend" mentioned in the solicitations would be, and there's some interesting potential in the underwater-robot-action stuff. If there's a small niggle, is Magnus really not used to taking charge of things? He never seemed to be indecisive back in Wreckers when he was giving orders and sending folks on missions.

Scoop continues to be of interest, and the idea of Starscream having his own Starscream now he's leader is also a good one. But Screamer himself continues to be odd, "Yeah, I'll just go chat to this giant monster without any of the guns I picked up last issue, what can go wrong?"

I now await Terome pointing out the 50 pointless Starscream splash pages I've managed to miss.

Oh look, Metalhawk. Can't anyone just stay dead in this series? It'll be interesting to see if the Ore EVIL has possessed him or if he's genuinely thought "Ah **** it". He did seem remarkably well informed on events he's missed so it's presumably the former.

On a more general note, DC seems to have lost us a fair few of our regular readers, at least on this site. Is the crossover shaping up to be a bad idea? Even if it's brought in new readers that might not make up for the ones it's lost.

Skyquake87
2013-11-27, 09:45 PM
i'm following DC! Its just i usually get my TF comics a few days to a week after release, by which time better minds have pretty much said things i've been thinking.

Today is one of those rare occasions where I'm up to speed.

My problem is, this is just not interesting. The Dead Universe stuff is just shite. I'm sorry, it was a f**king awful idea and the only reason Furman trotted it out for Transformers was 'cos no one read Necrowar and he seems very fond of reusing great ideas that were a) used for other sources that no one read and he feels need to give 'wider exposure' to or b) from things that got cancelled (much as it pains me to admit it, Death's Head's origin story 'The Body In Question' was originally intended for #11 - 12 of his own series. See also Beast Wars). IDW really should have learnt from Heart Of Darkness and the D-Void crap at the end of the Costa run that its a big steaming heap of poo. Why they thought this would be a good idea to bring in new readers when no one has a good word to say about it first time around is just perplexing.

I just can't get into it and why is Universal entopy or whatever so appealing to a logical mind like Shockwave's - or bad guys in general? Is this really what he's been working towards? Really? All that science and scheming and mucking about so everything will turn to dust? Why, what's the point? So he can be the ruler of blackened ball of ash? Whats so glorious about everyone having a 'living death'? or whatever?

On top of that, I can't stand the 'pimp the new toy' change to character designs. Hasbro mandated or not, its distracting and unnecessary. Its like the Doctor regenerating every time he shows up. Goldbumblebugbee looks terrible, a piss poor mish mash of three different versions of an insufferable character whom really didn't need another sodding toy.

And the Beast Wars characters. Sigh. What is Rattrap there for? He just asks questions and seems to be around so Starscream doesn't have to monologue.



I think I've remembered why I stopped buying RID. It just makes me angry, and worst of all, sad.

I'm sure Transformers comics were once better than this. Even Roberts seems to be struggling to bring any enthusiasm to this 'event'. The last issue of MTMTE wasn't up to his usual standards, and honestly, it just feels like he's putting words to a Barber plot.

Using three different artists with wildly contrasting styles in the space of one 22 page comic isn't helpful either. Were one being charitable, you could put it down to a smart editorial decision to signpost which bit of the story you're reading now. But it just seems a bit patronising.

The sooner we get back to regular hijinks amongst the Lost Light, the better. RID can f**k off and carry on exploring the complexities of its own arsehole and appealing to the sort of navel gazers that enjoy having everything spelled out for them.

My, I am very sweary today.


In other news, I read Rick Remender's first issue of Black Science which is bloody ace and cheery silly oddball sci-fi and I recommend this to you all. its better than this rubbish by a country mile.

Warcry
2013-11-27, 09:48 PM
On a more general note, DC seems to have lost us a fair few of our regular readers, at least on this site. Is the crossover shaping up to be a bad idea? Even if it's brought in new readers that might not make up for the ones it's lost.
The impression I get from reading multiple boards it doesn't seem like anyone is actually enthusiastic about the crossover. Optimistic people seem to be treating it as something to be ignored and maybe, if it has good feedback, read in one go once it's done. Pessimistic ones seem to be saying "I just hope this crap doesn't kill off/write out anyone interesting from MTMTE". The general indifference toward it seems to be more like what you'd expect for Infestation or Heart of Darkness than the main book.

I find myself somewhere in between. I read the first two issues and couldn't even think of a smart-assed remark to post about them here, because I forgot what was in them as soon as I'd finished reading. I'm not even going to bother reading this one, because I don't care about IDW Shockwave or the Dead Universe and have no interest at all in seeing old territory retreated for the third time in a decade.

I might read it at the end if it sounds interesting, and I'll probably pick up MTMTE after this is over with if the entire premise hasn't been undermined by a silly crossover to tie up loose ends that nobody but John Barber cares about, but for Dark Cybertron itself I'm out.

Terome
2013-11-27, 10:04 PM
Dalek: I now await Terome pointing out the 50 pointless Starscream splash pages I've managed to miss.

They've helpfully put one on the cover for you to spot.

Unicron
2013-11-28, 01:07 AM
On a more general note, DC seems to have lost us a fair few of our regular readers, at least on this site. Is the crossover shaping up to be a bad idea? Even if it's brought in new readers that might not make up for the ones it's lost.
Not that I would call myself a regular reader but I wouldn't say this crossover has 'lost me'. I never really planned to pick it up in the first place, except maybe in trade form when they're available, depending on things.

This crossover seemed like a bad idea from the start. There was no way RID was going to rise to MTMTE's level, unless they handed Roberts full run on both books. And even then it would have been a tall order. As the build-up occured, stuff got previewed, etc., I've reached the opinion that the best we can hope for now is that MTMTE doesn't get dragged down too far.
That and maybe we can get some interesting roster shake-up* out of this. Things like the return of Nightbeat and Kup, some of the Lost Light crew deciding to stay on Cybertron, some of the current Cybertron group deciding to leave with them, maybe even some Decepticons opting to join up.

*Not that MTMTE needs a shake-up. I mean the Lost Light has 200-odd crew and we've only gotten serious use out of what, maybe 1/8 of them? Should be pleanty of material to mine there without needing to add more or switch people out. Though the ship really could use some Decepticons, for the alternate viewpoint.

Red Dave Prime
2013-11-28, 04:49 AM
I've kept buying but I havent been engrossed in Dark Cybertron as I was with the 3 main arcs of MTMTE in Truth. Shadowplay, Remain in Light and the Overlord run were all much more interesting and exciting. Its not that Dark Cybertron is bad per se - its not and its not as predictable so far as I would have feared - but I dont have near the same attachment to the characters involved. I dont think barber has built up his cast nearly as well and we also have quite a few new faces (well, new in so far as the the last 2 years).

The best example is the reappearance of Nova and Galvatron. If you are a new reader (lets say you jumped on at the preludes) you may well be wondering who both these geezers are and why the Big Villain who we all expected to take centre stage is bowing down to them at the very start of the story. If you are a regular / veteran of the series you may ask yourself various head scratchers like were these 2 not dead already, didnt Galvatron kill Nova Prime, how does Shockwaves plan involve freeing 2 people who for all he has known were dead, and also wasn't he a very different transformer (pre-shadowplay) at the time of Nova and most glaring for me - does it seem remotely in character, pre or post shadowplay, for Shockwave to be subservient to anyone?

There's other niggles here. We get a lot of focus on brand new characters like Rat trap and Scoop. Not that they are bad characters but why weren't they introduced more gradually during RiD? Surely instead of Sharkbite, we could have gotten Rat Trap?

Some continuity stuff also rears its head where it really shouldn't. The lack of any follow up to the killswitch of MTMTE is a missed opportunity. Shockwaves appearance at the sunset why back a few issues also looks to be dropped. Shockwave having such problem building a space bridge and then needing the one contained in Megatron... which he built. There's nothing drastically shattering here but it doesnt help matters. At this point Barber and Roberts are working on 2 years worth of set-up. By this point after 20+ issues of each comic, plus 6 spotlights and 2 annuals any kinks left over from Costa or Furman should have been ironed out or discarded by now.

All of these things help give Dark Cybertron the feeling of a movie of a well-loved tv show. New characters are introduced and certain main players are left out to facility the Big Event storyline. Characters change their motives and mannerisms slightly to help keep things running smoothly.

I dunno, I'm not hating this but I feel its not going to lead anywhere really brilliant. Funny to think that this 12 parter has supposodly been the endgame that we were always heading for, yet it doesnt seem to have as much care and attention to detail that Remain in Light had. Whether you liked that particular story or not, everything did flow into it and as such it felt like it was always the story Roberts was aiming for. I'm not sure the two writers would say the same thing about this.

Still, only a quarter of the way through. Plenty of time to be blown away.

Terome
2013-11-28, 05:13 PM
Red Dave Prime: Its not that Dark Cybertron is bad per se - its not and its not as predictable so far as I would have feared - but I dont have near the same attachment to the characters involved. I dont think barber has built up his cast nearly as well and we also have quite a few new faces (well, new in so far as the the last 2 years).

Mmm. The Bible Code guff bordered on distasteful but I think I agree with you. You might have nailed it with the Serenity / Firefly vibe.

I've been thinking about the multiple artist thing. I can understand the reasons for doing it (toy pack-ins) but I have a hunch that it may be attracting some of the more oddly emotional criticism. Having each location broken up by art styles makes it very easy to regard the thing as a collection of bits. It invites you to play the 'who wrote this' guessing game (which is useless when Barber has been the editor of MTMTE all along) and also the urge to pick favourites. It's easier to say 'I like the Lost Light bits' when they are signposted by James Riaz. It's easy to pick apart the characterisation of Starscream when he's drawn a bit off-model. It is messing with people's heads and I think is confusing the readership a bit more than you'd rationally expect.

Actually, I'd like to see the numbers on complaints of out-of-character moments stacked against artists who drew those characters. It's not just a case of being off-model or differently proportioned, the artist who draws a character also acts as that character. Characterisation is a thin enough illusion without that sort of assault every few pages.

But anyway, there were some spoonfuls of good stuff in this issue - Brainstorm, Ultra Magnus, Rattrap and Perceptor all shone through. Whenever I think I have a handle on Starscream he acts up - which might be deliberate but isn't terrbily entertaining. The Shockwave plot is getting sillier by the page and I can't believe I'd forgotten that of course Metroplex is going to be an integral part of what's to come.

There's other niggles here. We get a lot of focus on brand new characters like Rat trap and Scoop. Not that they are bad characters but why weren't they introduced more gradually during RiD? Surely instead of Sharkbite, we could have gotten Rat Trap?

That's a good point - Sky Byte really served two functions: to give us an outsider's view of the status quo and to mention that the Constructicons were really bad news. Rattrap could have done all of that without too many necessary alterations and wouldn't serve to undercut the DJD a little bit more. I suppose that there are various reasons why Rattrap wasn't on the table back then but it would have been a nice way to integrate the character more smoothly. Though rumour is that Sky Byte's getting a new toy soon so who knows what's in store?

If you are a new reader (lets say you jumped on at the preludes) you may well be wondering who both these geezers are and why the Big Villain who we all expected to take centre stage is bowing down to them at the very start of the story.

I know what you're getting at but this might be a bad example - Galvatron has to be one of the more famous Transformers and the Prime title should be enough to suggest that Nova is a big deal. The biggest confusion there would be why Galvatron is not the one in charge and even those who follow IDW are having trouble with that one thanks to Shockwave's obtuse phrasing.

Dalek: If there's a small niggle, is Magnus really not used to taking charge of things? He never seemed to be indecisive back in Wreckers when he was giving orders and sending folks on missions.

Oh yeah, had forgotten that. It can be reasoned away by recent events rattling him. There's an interesting thread in that previous Ultra Magni were quite keen and capable of leading so now that Minimus has been exposed he's more willing to show his vulnerability at being uncomfortable in the role.

Knightdramon
2013-11-28, 07:18 PM
Interesting issue. I'm one of the few who enjoys the crossover appeal, even though technically the two books haven't intertwined yet. The only contact is Orion with The lost light, which both were drifting, and Starscream communicating with Rodimus via a screen.

As far as I know, Bumblebee still does not know that Rodimus is alive.

Some things make sense and some don't. The things that don't make sense largely have to do with the toy shoe-horning. Judging on the RI cover, this is Skywarp's issue. The same Skywarp, who one or two issues ago was said to be in a weird situation "have you seen skywarp's state?" or something. A very interesting thing to do would be to have him be stuck mid-teleportation [sort of like energon starscream].

Things that don't make sense---Rattrap's role, Scoop's role [both toy tie-ins], Starscream [in one issue he spent an amount of time getting geared up for battle with state of the art autobot weapons--very next issue, he goes to speak to the titan alone and unarmed]. Or how he also goes from not caring about the neutrals to flying and trying to stop, single handedly, a wave of light thrown at them.

Though to be honest, that was a heart-warming and kickass scene.

Speaking of wasted potential/things...seriously, the pay-off to the "sunset" depicted in issue 18, almost half a year ago...was to have a zombie titan stand perfectly still for 3/4 issues, and unleash a necro-wave once Starscream triggered a reaction?

I liked Prowl. I loved Prowl. It's as if Barber suddenly decided to give him the voice of the majority of readers when talking to Bumblebee. I know that Bumblebee means well. But can somebody just shoot him to death and be done with it?

Still making no sense from Nova/Galvatron. Galvatron shot and actively tried to kill Nova twice thus far, and Nova just brushes it aside and they team up? And what is with the DU people just not dying at all? If Cyclonus was made "mortal" by the chaos thing, shouldn't at the very least Galvatron be mortal still?

zigzagger
2013-11-29, 05:23 PM
Transformers: More Than Meets The Eye #24: Dark Cybertron Part 4 (of 12) three-page preview @ Full Metal Hero (http://www.fullmetalhero.com/content/more-than-meets-eye-24-3-page-preview-7822/).

Full preview due sometime closer to the release date. Stay Tuned.

Auntie Slag
2013-11-29, 05:39 PM
Goddamnit, lots of sparky dialogue and Nick Roche on drawing duties... I really regret ducking out of MTMTE until issue 27. Hopefully Dark Cybertron will be nicely bound together in a TPB or two (probably two knowing the number of issues). I've already missed the RID part so I'm stuck in my Star Trek-style holding pattern.

Mainframe's the ugliest transformer I've seen since Blot's alt-mode.

Skyquake87
2013-11-29, 10:40 PM
I like Mainframe. He like like a Gobot :)

Red Dave Prime
2013-11-30, 02:04 AM
So is this Whirls past actions coming back to bite him? Hope so, nice to see that bit of resolution.

Knightdramon
2013-11-30, 11:45 AM
If anything, Whirl should be hailed as a god by half of that race. Which half of them encircles the LL is another matter altogether.

inflatable dalek
2013-11-30, 12:48 PM
As far as toy promotion goes, I think I'd have kept to the pattern set earlier in the year by doing the pack ins as Spotlights. You'd have a-hopefully- nice standalone story for the kids buying the toys (realistically the only people going to be tracking down all 12 toys with an issue of Dark Cybertron in the right order are adult die hard* fans with the money to spare, a kid who only has part 7 with their Stranglehold toy isn't going to find it all that easy to get into) and the chance to do an actual Armada Starscream or Beast Wars Rattrap story without worrying about shoehorning them into G1.

Then characters like Scoop could be weaved into the main comic as and when needed (or more realistically, because Hasbro say so) in a less obtrusive way without the need to take page time from previously important bots and cons, meaning a more focused and leaner Dark Cybertron.




*Who are presumably buying the toys whilst waiting for another Die Hard film to be made.

Death's Head
2013-12-01, 02:21 AM
Stranglehold toy

Please, Hasbro. Just to see how you'd do the leather-man-thing without making him a Pretender.

I mean, if they can do Scoop...

Death's Head
2013-12-01, 02:33 AM
Bah, after regretting spending near-non-existent money on the last couple of parts of Dark Cybertron, this looks really good!

Maybe it's a cheeky preview, and the rest of the issue is Starscream posing and Bumblebee calling the Dinobots 'lunkheads'?

Bah!

Skyquake87
2013-12-01, 09:19 AM
..and why have they done Scoop? Of all the Transformers characters out there. Whom had a burning hole in their soul for a classics Scoop?

I'd rather have had Spinister. And no, that expensive limited run bauble doesn't count!

Knightdramon
2013-12-01, 10:03 AM
..and why have they done Scoop? Of all the Transformers characters out there. Whom had a burning hole in their soul for a classics Scoop?

I'd rather have had Spinister. And no, that expensive limited run bauble doesn't count!

Well, they seem to be pimping out Wreckers in the past year, so I think his number came up. Or we can just chalk it up to "the guys at hasbro draw random straws for new releases".

Warcry
2013-12-01, 06:11 PM
..and why have they done Scoop? Of all the Transformers characters out there. Whom had a burning hole in their soul for a classics Scoop?
Blasphemy! Scoop is awesome. A lot of us grew up with those chunky, primitive 87-89 toys and I for one am very happy whenever Hasbro decides to revisit those years. And if they're going to do that, why not Scoop? They've already done Thunderwing and Bludgeon, so other than Nightbeat it's not like there are any "name" characters left.

I would have preferred Spinister or one of the Decepticon small Headmasters personally, but it's not like those guys are significantly more popular than Scoop is with the fandom at large.

Death's Head
2013-12-02, 12:03 AM
I'd have preferred Squeezeplay :(

Warcry
2013-12-02, 12:50 AM
Squeezeplay would be fantastic, but it would take an amazing feat of engineering to pull off a Headmaster at Deluxe scale if they want to give the little Nebulan any articulation at all.

[EDIT]And this goes to show how enthralled we all are by Dark Cybertron, doesn't it?

Death's Head
2013-12-02, 12:43 PM
I'm just dreaming, really - it seems churlish to complain about Hasbro when they're giving us some great figures for the 30th (no Rung, though...yet!).

Oh, and Dark what? :o

zigzagger
2013-12-03, 05:34 AM
5-page preview is now up @ Newsarama (http://www.newsarama.com/19703-idw-previews-for-dec-4-2013-g-i-joe-real-american-hero-dark-cybertron-chapter-4.html).

It's in there. Just need to skip past the GI Joe preview to get to it.

---

The preview almost felt like MTMTE proper, what with Nick Roche and the snappy dialogue. That is, until the 5th page...

**sigh**

Why can't RID just stay on its side of the apartment? Its characters, setting, and really, Barber's writing style kind of jars with what I come to expect from this title.

Guess what I'm saying is... I want my MTMTE back :(

Terome
2013-12-03, 02:56 PM
I dunno, on their own merits those are fine pages. The 'constructed cold' line is a bit frustrating seeing as how they never really considered the last mysterious wave that differently affected everyone on the planet.

Lots of good RTD nuggets too - the Ambus Test, the Black Block Consortia, Warm-Wired, the whole conversation about figuring out their alt-modes and origins.

Dark Cybertron may be disappointing but this is a smattering of quality material.

Death's Head
2013-12-03, 06:29 PM
On that last page:

Rattrap: "It hit us worse'n udders."

http://img.gawkerassets.com/img/18oz8xs77uqk9gif/ku-xlarge.gif

Rattrap has a hard speech-pattern to make work in the printed form without resorting to phonetic spelling, but really...

Auntie Slag
2013-12-03, 10:29 PM
Ooh, is that Earthworm Jim 1 or 2? I had 2, but I don't think I got to the end and I certainly don't remember that scene. Great pic though, and it makes me think a Roberts character could easily develop an obsession with an alien creature; Whirl going alien cow tipping (or equivalent) for instance.

Skyquake87
2013-12-03, 10:40 PM
The attempts at capturing Rattrap's Brooklyn accent are feckin' awful, aren't they? And there's NO NEED. Howard Mackie never wrote his Brooklyn -centric Ghost Rider characters like this.

Death's Head
2013-12-04, 12:49 AM
Ooh, is that Earthworm Jim 1 or 2? I had 2, but I don't think I got to the end and I certainly don't remember that scene. Great pic though, and it makes me think a Roberts character could easily develop an obsession with an alien creature; Whirl going alien cow tipping (or equivalent) for instance.

The cow-based ending of 1. I only got to see it by using a Game Genie :( Mind you, it's not as ruddy hard as 2.

The attempts at capturing Rattrap's Brooklyn accent are feckin' awful, aren't they? And there's NO NEED. Howard Mackie never wrote his Brooklyn -centric Ghost Rider characters like this.

The thing is, even if you take away the phonetic spelling (in itself a dangerous thing for a writer to wield; where do you stop using it?) Barber's writing misses the rhythm, the cadence of Rattrap's speech. Look at the bit just after the amusing 'udder' part -

"Naw. Thought it mighta been a case where, like, guys what were constructed cold got hit harder or somethin'"

- The bit I've underlined is so incomprehensible I can barely read it. What accent is that? It doesn't sound anything like the Rattrap I watched across five seasons. It's an assumption on my part that this is Barber's writing, but a fair one I think since he's the one who brought the character into the storyline.

Barber's dialogue, when it isn't being genuinely bad, is just so...functional. None of the wit and sparkle that James brings to the simplest, most banal of exchanges. A fifteen-issue series set entirely in Swerve's bar as all of the characters get increasingly drunk would be more entertaining than all of RiD, and probably give us more insight into Cybertronian culture, history and politics to boot, despite being ostensibly "comedy" (a dangerous word in science-fiction fandom).

Red Dave Prime
2013-12-04, 03:26 PM
I never watched any of beast wars or machine but I am amazed by this revelation that Rat Trap has a bronx accent. In my mind I had him speak with a bad cockney accent (think Badger from Firefly).

This changes EVERYTHING :)

Dark Cybertron may be disappointing but this is a smattering of quality material.

Pretty much sums up my feelings too. We get some good, we get some bad. It does have a vibe of Revelations (the furman thing, not the bible thing) in that you feel the plot is having to twist and turn both events and logic to suit itself. So far there have been enough points that would make me surprised that its the same 2 writers on this that have been there for the past 22 issues of both books. It just has the feeling of new writer about it.

Red Dave Prime
2013-12-04, 08:56 PM
Can I spoil?




















Good issue all in all, the art shifts are a bit more jarring than before but I think its because we have two artists drawing the same crew and they dont mesh at all (neither is bad - just very different) The plot is still running along with just a feeling of too much going on and not all of it important. The starscream / rat trap / scoop plot line in particular feels like one too many. Its an interesting enough one, but maybe it would have been best saved for the fallout (obviously it may become vital by issue 8)

I also am not appreciating Shockwaves vagueness as we are one third of the way through and I dont really know what his plan is other then bring Nova and Galvatron back. Everything else is still a jumble and I got the implication that this jumble may actually be a cover for shockwaves other master plan. That said, his interaction with Megatron was quite decent and its an untapped feud for IDW.

Not sure how everyone will feel about the Rodpod but I loved it and as silly as it may seem it was a fun part to the story. Also liked Rodimus and Hardheads interaction and - hurrah - a nod to the killswitch at last. The new, more aggressive Prowl is also interesting. I'm assuming the change is fallout from his time as a contstructicon.

Dark Cybertron continus to entertain and intrigue me but I dont feel I would miss it if I didnt get the next 8 issues. Nothings grabbing me just yet though. The Story needs a focal point other than this is shockwaves plan and its all something-something dark cybertron.

inflatable dalek
2013-12-05, 09:19 PM
Much, much better, lots of fun, snappy lines, good action and a nice sense of pace.

Worryingly though, all of that was in the Lost Light bits, which (as I can't buy the mini-combiner guys as playing a huge role in the story) means all the really good stuff was in a pissing about subplot.

Back on Cybertron, well it's still slogging along in a harmless but hardly action packed way. Characters seem to be repeating themselves a lot as well, "We must kill the Titan!" "No we mustn't!" "The prophocy says Starcream isn't the messiah, he's a naughty boy!" and so on and so on.

The Dark Universe bit had some nice dialouge in it, but suffers from the fact Livio's strength isn't really in characters talking at one another.

And the most blatantly homoerotic moment since Cyclonus and his sword as Megatron has Nova Prime enter his gaping hole.

The odd thing about the Megatron plot, though it's presumably coincidence as it's a fairly obscure thing to homage, is it's exactly the same as what happened to Charley Pollard in the Doctor Who audio Neverland. In that because of her special circumstances the undead inhabitants of a desolate Universe were able to turn her into a portal through which they could escape back into the reality they originally came from (ours). Which would make Nova Prime Rassilon, so from now on I'm hearing him being played by Don Warrington.

Which is nice.

Terome
2013-12-06, 04:29 PM
Hmm. I'm really curious as to how this would read as an all-Roche issue. I can't think of anything bad in it (except maybe Scoop's weird turn) but I wasn't left with a good feeling. Plenty of nice bits - the chat between Hardhead, Orion and Rodimus, Megatron and Shockwave bickering like an old married couple trying to decide on where to go for dinner, Ultra Magnus in general and the introduction of Mainframe. My guess as to why it doesn't add up is due to the inconsistency in the art.

I do quite like how often these are coming out though. That feels a bit special.

And hey, the Lost Light is a proper Red Dwarf of a ship, isn't it? Couldn't fit it all in down here.

inflatable dalek
2013-12-06, 04:51 PM
Yeah, I can understand the real world practicalities of having so many artists on one issue (presumably the same as with Raiz doing 22, needing them ready for a bunch of toys that are presumably going to be released at the same time means getting all hands on deck to have them ready at the same time, especially as all 12 scripts wouldn't have been ready at once) but that doesn't make it any less of a visual mess.

It doesn't even have the thin excuse of splitting the artists along thematic (or at least series) lines at this point. There's at least three good artists on the book here (and a couple I'm still undecided on), the mix and matching isn't really helping any of them.

Terome
2013-12-06, 04:59 PM
Oh yes, they are all doing fine work by themselves (I have to fess up to not being so keen on Rojo but only for boring reasons like being on-model and such) and I'd have no problem with a full issue by any of them. I don't really have a problem with this issue, to be honest, I'm just trying to put my finger on why it seems so much less than the sum of its parts. We've got some nice art, some neat character moments, something sort of happening and nothing dumb or offensive going on and yet...

inflatable dalek
2013-12-06, 05:24 PM
Yeah, I think that's fair, everything is just sort of OK (some of it very good, some of it very bad with everything levelling out) but it's just not rocking yet.

Red Dave Prime
2013-12-07, 03:06 AM
Is it because the actual plot is wafer-thin? After umpteen set-up issues, there's still no clear indication of what Shockwave is planning to do and (key) why anyone should stop him. For all that the others know Shockwave is willing to spread his undying super energon ore to everyone on Cybertron, take them back in time to stop the war and rebuild cybertrons golden age through peaceful means. The big blast that has hit the city may just be a way to turn everyone super immortal.

Theres nothing wrong with a bit of mystery but I feel that a reveal of Shockwaves full plan and motives for doing so would really help galvanise the story.As it is, all sides arent really sure what they are looking for, fighting against or for.

Terome
2013-12-07, 02:30 PM
Is it because the actual plot is wafer-thin? After umpteen set-up issues, there's still no clear indication of what Shockwave is planning to do and (key) why anyone should stop him. For all that the others know Shockwave is willing to spread his undying super energon ore to everyone on Cybertron, take them back in time to stop the war and rebuild cybertrons golden age through peaceful means. The big blast that has hit the city may just be a way to turn everyone super immortal.

Theres nothing wrong with a bit of mystery but I feel that a reveal of Shockwaves full plan and motives for doing so would really help galvanise the story.As it is, all sides arent really sure what they are looking for, fighting against or for.

I think this is a good point. Right now all anyone has is the incongruous Titan and Soundwave's weak grasp of the situation. You'd think that with Soundwave's dirt on Bludgeon and his little chat with Shockwave he'd be able to put the pieces together but then we have been told quite a few times that he's only really very good at focusing on one thing at a time (and therefore a terrible spy).

Frankly I'm not even convinced that Shockwave is the villain. He's always had the good of the many at heart, albeit in a cold way, and now we know that Nova and Galvatron are bit-players in his scheme the same way Megatron was he looks to be better prepared and resolved to solve more of Cybertron's problems than anyone else has before with a minimum of bloodshed. So far he's even somehow on negative bloodshed.

Thinking on it, it seems that all Megatron has been to Shockwave since he reawakened on Earth was a way to get a space bridge to Cybertron in a way that no one would be likely to mess with.

Which is all interesting in theory but dramatically it kind of undersells the epicness. 'Shockwave is up to something...?' doesn't have the same punch as 'Shockwave is dastardly!' or 'Turns out Shockwave is about to accomplish great things but at the expense of your favourite characters.'

Also, 'Ego with a gun' is good but it's no 'Missile with a mouth.'

Red Dave Prime
2013-12-10, 09:15 PM
The tiny preview is up, link from TFW2005

http://www.tfw2005.com/transformers-news/comics-16/robots-in-disguise-24-dark-cybertron-part-5-ibooks-preview-178886/

Wont comment on anything else except the very odd image of Megatron "birthing" Nova and Galvatron.

Denyer
2013-12-10, 10:42 PM
Barber's very meta, isn't he? "Whatever you're doing, Shockwave" reads like a comment on no-one, including the characters, having a clue what's going on.

Unicron
2013-12-11, 02:49 AM
This reminds me of Devastation and Revealation a bit, in that it seems needlessly drawn out to the point of not getting anywhere and I'm expecting that when we finally do find out what the scheme/real danger is, the solution is going to seem crazy rushed (oh, let's just ask a previous McGuffin for all the answers on how to stop it).

Mentioned it before but I'm calling it again: Bumblebee's Matrix half is gonna get sacrificed as part of the fix "changing things forever!".
Either that or it'll turn out that Rung's alt-mode is actually a key needed to activate some back-up plan device thing at or near Cybertron's core.

inflatable dalek
2013-12-11, 08:58 PM
So this week's Underbase podcast (which I think for the first time ever enjoyed an issue less than I did) made the comparison of the story so far to IDW's last 12 part Event, AHM, in particular the pacing, or lack thereof.

Which has gotten me thinking, I ripped AHM a part a lot for exactly the same lack of forward movement that DC is suffering from, am I being hypocritical in letting the current comic have an easier ride? The only real difference is Barber and Roberts had more goodwill built up going in that McCarthy did (and after the inept way Schmidt handled the dropping of Furman Sean could have written Watchmen and the knives would have been out for him), but how long will that last if things don't start getting into gear soon?

Red Dave Prime
2013-12-11, 09:44 PM
This reminds me of Devastation and Revealation a bit, in that it seems needlessly drawn out to the point of not getting anywhere and I'm expecting that when we finally do find out what the scheme/real danger is, the solution is going to seem crazy rushed (oh, let's just ask a previous McGuffin for all the answers on how to stop it).

Yeah, I'm feeling that as well. After drawing out 2 special issues and an annual in RiD plus 4-5 preludes issues and then another 12 issues I am thinking we are due a rushed final 3 pages. That Bumblebee-matrix idea has legs, Rungs alt-mode I think is more linked to Season 2 of MTMTE.

I miss proper MTMTE....

But we are surely getting a Zombie-titan v Metroplex splash page aren't we? Possibly including the ubiquitous "I. Am. Metroplex!" (and maybe an easter egg of a tiny Megatron in the background going "I. Am. Megatron!")

Terome
2013-12-11, 09:56 PM
Faith in the producers counts for a lot in a serial. Good will can make an experience drag out or fly by. IDW have built up a head of good will over the past two years and it makes sense that you're willing to give them the benefit of the doubt.

Course, the disappointment at the end of it might be all the more crushing because of it.

But then if it is, hey, MTMTE Season 2.

Frankly, I don't think that a maxi-series is a terribly good format for action drama. Twelve parts are only necessary to fill out an arbitrary block of time and the realities of getting all the lights to blink in time are too often ignored. The meter is all wrong and that is why you get dropped notes on character costume changes, resurrections and retcons. These are empty calories dramatically but they something to buffer out every chapter and the story is too thin to give up anything else.

Unicron
2013-12-12, 04:02 AM
That Bumblebee-matrix idea has legs, Rungs alt-mode I think is more linked to Season 2 of MTMTE.
Yeah, I'm figuring the Rung thing is gonna be a Season 2 thing (or later, possibly "Big Event 2"™). Just kind or wanted to get the key theory on record, as it were.

But we are surely getting a Zombie-titan v Metroplex splash page aren't we? Possibly including the ubiquitous "I. Am. Metroplex!" (and maybe an easter egg of a tiny Megatron in the background going "I. Am. Megatron!")
Now that we know Metroplex is still functional, yeah that's kind of a given at this point. Though if they're gonna go for an easter egg like that, I'd rather it be a tiny Megatron standing on Metroplex's shoulder feeding him the dialogue.

So... what are the odds it's going to turn out Megatron knew/figured out what Shockwave is up to, set up a contingency, and is will hi-jack the plan at a suitable point?

Denyer
2013-12-12, 06:20 PM
Which has gotten me thinking, I ripped AHM a part a lot for exactly the same lack of forward movement that DC is suffering from, am I being hypocritical in letting the current comic have an easier ride? The only real difference is Barber and Roberts had more goodwill built up going in that McCarthy did
Roberts can actually write and isn't plot-driven. His style is more perpetual ideas and characters-go-to-the-pub dialogue.

Knightdramon
2013-12-12, 08:20 PM
So far it's a classical "really bad guys using the already existing bad guys to bring forth a plan for the greater good of their race".

Odds are that Shockwave will doublecross Nova and Galvatron and bring forth his own plan [he must need them for something].

Megatron will emerge as an anti-hero again at the end [like he did in Chaos].

Pax will possibly do something extremely boring [SPOILER--one of the covers shows him fighting...himself].

Overall, fan feedback has been extremely lukewarm at best. Considering that one series [RID] has been using the last 6-9 months worth of issues to set up the plot for Dark Cybertron, and MTMTE has some fantastic stories set in limbo for half a year, plus the fact that all of dark cybertron is used for tie-in comics for toys...

WHAT DID YOU DO HASBRO? :lol:

Red Dave Prime
2013-12-13, 04:20 AM
So... what are the odds it's going to turn out Megatron knew/figured out what Shockwave is up to, set up a contingency, and is will hi-jack the plan at a suitable point?

It's all part of Megatrons grand super-plan in which he knew Shockwave would have a grand plan.

I swear if thats what it turns out to be, I'm gonna stop buying RiD.

Cyberstrike nTo
2013-12-14, 04:56 PM
Dark Cybertron continus to entertain and intrigue me but I dont feel I would miss it if I didnt get the next 8 issues. Nothings grabbing me just yet though. The Story needs a focal point other than this is shockwaves plan and its all something-something dark cybertron.

That is a problem with most crossovers now of days is dragging them out by having 2 or 3 really unrelated plots going on at the same time. IMHO it will be parts 5-9 that will tell if Barber and Roberts are just padding the damn thing out to justisify it being a 12 issue arc. IMHO however it feels like a 6-issue arc being padded out to sell 2 tpbs/hcs instead of 1 tpb/hc.

I think Shockwave's role won't be as big or as important as he's being promoted to be I think he'll start it and then it will end with a Nova Prime and Galvatron vs. Optimus Prime and Megatron tag team fight.
Shockwave has pretty much done his part.
I haven't read any Marvel's crossovers because they don't interest me but from what I read about Marvel's Age of Ultron and Infinity crossovers is that the villians promoted heavily in each arc (Ultron and Thanos respectfully) of them both being the lead villians, they really aren't the lead villians and they don't seem to do anything major in either of their respective storylines other than show up at the start and get beaten up at the end (again from what I read about them this seems to be especially big complaint about Thanos' role in Infinity).

Summerhayes
2013-12-15, 01:20 PM
I think Shockwave's role won't be as big or as important as he's being promoted to be I think he'll start it and then it will end with a Nova Prime and Galvatron vs. Optimus Prime and Megatron tag team fight.


I'd have a lot of time for that.
While I can agree with most of what people are saying about dark Cybertron, for me personally I'm not finding it to be that bad. I'm enjoying at least one or two moments each issue and I'm enjoying having optimus involved again, so I'm willing to just let it play out.

inflatable dalek
2013-12-17, 09:15 PM
One thing I have decided is that my reservoir of good will is all about used up, if the next issue isn't the comic equivalent of having my genitals covered in whipped cream and then licked by Kelly Brook I'm giving up on the singles until things get back to normal. Any trade purchase will likely be that Mike Costa thing of coming into after the dust has settled to read it with a detached disinterest where I can have a bit of a laugh at the piss poor bits and catch anything that may actually be important to MTMTE.

Either way, considering at this point that in all of 2013 Barber has managed to write exactly half a good issue with the flashback bits in the second part of that Soundwave two parter the first "Normal" issue of RID is going to really have to rock my socks to just make me a MTMTE boy.

inflatable dalek
2013-12-18, 09:13 PM
OUT NOW AND SPOILERS HOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO:





















Hmmm, after making a grand statement of intent... I'm really not sure what to make of DC5.

Good points: Only two artists this month, clearly split along thematic lines. Less artists means one of the new boys got to strut his stuff properly for the first time and he did OK, even if the Big Fight stuff would have once again suited Livio better than the standing-about-in-the-dead-Universe-stuff.

Actual proper forward momentum on Cybertron rather than the fits and starts stuff! Though it is mainly things that should have happened... well the point the Titan first turned up and Shockwave was obviously behind it six odd months before Dark Cybertron even started.

The ending, very nicely done subversion of expectations, I'd twigged Nightbeat was still EVIL with his out of character (for the warm grinning guy Roberts wrote him as in Shadowplay and Orion Pax) cold reading of Cyclonus but that's still not something I think any of us saw coming when he first showed up, but still made perfect sense.

And, considering this issue felt like it had the least Roberts-sey material out of all of them to date, the dialogue wasn't too bad.

The big bad point: There being at least three moments where characters point out to the villains their behaviour Makes No Sense. If even the characters in the fiction have noticed that something has gone very wrong somewhere. Though at least in Metalhawk's case he gets to give Bumblebee the bitch-slap he's had coming since the idiot Autobots decided to make him leader.

I am now very undecided on dropping the books till the end or not, and will have to have a think.

I do think one shame is that yesterday Chris McFeely mentioned on Twitter that issue 1 of DC sold 30% better than average, considering the much better stuff both authors have done since the relaunch it's a pity it's the meandering mediocre start to a storyline that's taken forever to kick off that's got all the attention. I wonder how many of that 30% will still be reading by this point? I can see a ReGeneration 1 situation where the heavily pimped first issue sold considerably better than the two ongoings but the poor quality of the title gradually drove all those floating buyer away till it was selling pretty much exactly the same (indeed, the last time I checked a few months ago it was, by a narrow margin, the worst selling one, not sure if issue Zero gave it a little bump or not).

Anyone who doesn't normally have time for Transformers will have had all their worst assumptions confirmed by this point (derivative, heavy toy promotion, clealry hastily thrown together as shown by the need for so many artists...), and are unlikely to stick around for when the really good interesting stuff returns that (even if it doesn't always work in Barber's case) is at least trying new things.

Phase Sixer
2013-12-18, 11:15 PM
Confused, is all I can say, it may be me but nothing really makes sense so far

Galvatron just rips Megatron in half? Why should they even fight now? I mean is it me or should Megatron have never switched bodies? I mean in costa-going he was indestructible basically and OP couldn't even lay a shot on him, but now Galvatron is so powerful as he rips Megatron in half, like seriously? Same Galvatron that's portrayed as Nova Primes lackey? Same Nova Prime who OP beat in revelations, and the same OP that couldn't lay a finger on Megatron who just got ripped in half by Galvatron. As you can see I have issues with this

Another thing Megatron was bolted to the table, how did he get free? Did Nova get knocked back into the dead universe? Nothing is clear, because how can Nova be in the DU and on Cyberton and if he's not on Cybertron wouldn't he not want Shockwave to let Megatron free? Seeing as he's the only way NP can get from universe to universe?? And if so why is he content now to reveal himself in the DU to OP and company disguised as Nightbeat? When it would have had to have been him all along as Nightbeat, which means he was f'n with OP and company and trying to come thru Megatrons chest all at the same time (btw have we solved how NP's body was on garrus-9 and then all of sudden he was back in the DU for DC)

Ok maybe I'm not smart, but we're 5 chapters in and the only real question I have is, why is Shockwave doing all of this??

And honestly telling me why Cyclonus scratched his face up, was def not a tidbit I needed revealed, how about telling us why we are even reading THIS story after 5 chapters at $3.99 a piece, I mean it still feels like we're in prelude mode, none of the characters motivations beyond universal dominance(which is the motivation we already knew they had) have been revealed, idw events seem to always not go right.

Knightdramon
2013-12-19, 01:09 PM
I must be one of the very few people in the fandom that actually enjoys this crossover.

Not since the beginning, but definitely since last issue.

Bad points? It SCREAMS hasbro interference and toy promotion. One thing I do with each issue is try to figure out which generations figure it will be packed with, based on who gets central focus out of the blue.

I do not get why the book switches artists so often. I mean, when you've got 3-4 fan favourite regulars, why get somebody completely fresh and hand them over a piece of the mythos that's supposedly so important? It just screams MTMTE Annual all over again.

Good points? A few. I'll get to them in a moment. Before that...


Confused, is all I can say, it may be me but nothing really makes sense so far

Galvatron just rips Megatron in half? Why should they even fight now? I mean is it me or should Megatron have never switched bodies? I mean in costa-going he was indestructible basically and OP couldn't even lay a shot on him, but now Galvatron is so powerful as he rips Megatron in half, like seriously? Same Galvatron that's portrayed as Nova Primes lackey? Same Nova Prime who OP beat in revelations, and the same OP that couldn't lay a finger on Megatron who just got ripped in half by Galvatron. As you can see I have issues with this

Another thing Megatron was bolted to the table, how did he get free? Did Nova get knocked back into the dead universe? Nothing is clear, because how can Nova be in the DU and on Cyberton and if he's not on Cybertron wouldn't he not want Shockwave to let Megatron free? Seeing as he's the only way NP can get from universe to universe?? And if so why is he content now to reveal himself in the DU to OP and company disguised as Nightbeat? When it would have had to have been him all along as Nightbeat, which means he was f'n with OP and company and trying to come thru Megatrons chest all at the same time (btw have we solved how NP's body was on garrus-9 and then all of sudden he was back in the DU for DC)

And honestly telling me why Cyclonus scratched his face up, was def not a tidbit I needed revealed, how about telling us why we are even reading THIS story after 5 chapters at $3.99 a piece, I mean it still feels like we're in prelude mode, none of the characters motivations beyond universal dominance(which is the motivation we already knew they had) have been revealed, idw events seem to always not go right.

The most realistic way I see it is that since they are around the regeneration/resurrection ore, they can really go at it, battle-wise. Which is probably why most bots got their asses kicked so bad.

Galvatron may have been Nova's lackey, but it's been defined in the RID annual that he's a very powerful warrior. Perhaps the reason he's the "lackey" and only dared to fire from behind in Revelations is that Nova is just too damn powerful on his own. Bar that one time in Revelations, where other factors were relevant, he hasn't lost once.

He's so far the ONLY Cybertronian able to end a war and unite the population. He's so far the only Prime in the known lineage, bar Optimus, who had the genuine matrix [though how he got it is still a mystery]. So yeah, Nova's pretty damn important on his own for a warrior such as Galvatron to cower.

Optimus was nearly killed by Nova in Revelations, the only reason he gained the upper hand is because the darkness wanted to jump from Nova to Optimus AND Galvatron shot him from behind. Make no mistake, OP didn't win that one by strength.

The last we see of Megatron is himself on the table, Ironhide on top, and the giant Necrotitan arm behind them. Is it really that much a leap of faith to assume that they managed to get out?

From the looks of it, Galvatron managed to get on Cybertron amidst the confusion but Ironhide actively pushed Nova back. So no, from this issue, Nova didn't manage to jump to the regular universe, hence our seeing him in the last pages. As for Nightbeat, it makes perfect sense for Nova to employ him as a sleeper agent to trap the last two matrix holders in a place of death and an endless dead end while he ravaged their universe. Since he couldn't get out as he intended, he went back to deal with them personally.

As for Cyclonus's tidbits...I could actually see Roberts writing that scene. It might have looked out of place for you, but it's pure, typical, traditional MTMTE style. I don't see what's wrong with it.
-----------------------------------------------------------------
Generally, I'm seeing the same pattern that emerged with AHM in DC. There's a storyline in mind, but because we're not spoon-fed from issue 1, people lose interest. Why? Why in a planet where a show like LOST went on for 5 years before answering questions from the first season aren't people more patient with monthly comic book plots?

Warcry
2013-12-19, 05:42 PM
Generally, I'm seeing the same pattern that emerged with AHM in DC. There's a storyline in mind, but because we're not spoon-fed from issue 1, people lose interest. Why? Why in a planet where a show like LOST went on for 5 years before answering questions from the first season aren't people more patient with monthly comic book plots?
LOST didn't cost people $4 an episode, for one thing... ;)

But to give you a more serious answer, a show like LOST was more about the characters than the plot, and each and every episode was crafted to build up the backstory of one or more of the cast and give them some character development even though the plot frequently meandered off in nonsensical directions. Dark Cybertron doesn't have that (or it didn't before I stopped reading) because all of the characters bar a handful of MTMTE cast in the background come off as two-dimensional cardboard cutouts with not real motivations or personality. If each Dark Cybertron issue told the same amount of (non) story but made the character who it was eventually going to be packed in with feel like a real fleshed-out person, I don't think people would be complaining about it nearly as much.

Denyer
2013-12-19, 11:15 PM
As ever, RID feels like reading less than half of a comic.

Red Dave Prime
2013-12-20, 12:25 AM
Its not terrible but...

I'm with those who find the vagueness of Shockwaves master plane a bit off-putting. I need something more to get me interested. At the moment there's nothing about it to grab my attention or spark my imagination in the way the best mysteries of MTMTE did. I guess its because, as Denyer says, the characters in RiD dont have the same investment as those in MTMTE. It says a lot that for me the best bits were the reveals of the various bits of Cyclonus's actions.

I also didn't like the art for the Cybertron bits. There was nothing wrong with it, just not to my taste.

Its possible that we have 2 main plotlines running here and they will collide in the finale - Shockwaves take over of cybertron in the RiD issues and the Lost Light finding and rescuing Metroplex in the MTMTE ones. Thats not a bad way to run the "event". Also Livio is not being assigned properly. The Dark Universe bits are way too talky for him and he just isn't up to it. Milne, Frank or Roche would have aced these parts.

As much as I may niggle on this, I am enjoying it more than Furman or Costas stuff and it has some nice moments even in this issue - Ironhides put down of Nova Prime (even though it doesnt quite make sense that Ironhide would see Nova as a despot - that was only revealed after Optimus looked into it after his near death in escalation) and the banter between the DU guys is good too.

I'm still in, but just not too impressed or captivated by it all. To be honest, I think I'll be glad when this is over and hopefully Shockwave is put to rest.

Terome
2013-12-20, 03:46 PM
Unf. I don't think a single element of this quite worked. The fight was confusingly drawn, the plot involved a group of people entering and leaving a room, the important motivations remain vague and the Dead Universe stuff fell flat.

Regeneration One, on the other hand, was really good this month. What a world!

Knightdramon
2013-12-24, 02:28 PM
I'm actually loving Livio as the penciler for the DU bits---it's like he was made to draw the dark, moody parts of the fiction.

With his pencils on Nova in this issue, I think he's the only penciler so far to have drawn every single known Prime, from Nova to Rodimus.

Re-read the entire thing/saga yesterday. I can't help but feel bad for Starscream. The guy can't get a break! He knows everybody, including Rattrap, is out to get him, yet he swoops in to try and stop the wave going to affect his city.

The only real negative so far is how Scoop goes from Starscream prophecy follower in one issue to Starscream dark prophecy destroyer of worlds hater in the next.

Skyquake87
2013-12-24, 09:04 PM
Well I've read issue 24. Came and went, really didn't it? New guy on art has the same kind of problems drawing TFs as Manny Galan did on G2. They just look a bit weird and not quite right. Shockwave has a massive head (and its purple, fnarr fnarr).

I just can't get into this. Its all so woolly and vague and nothings really happening. How comes Nova is at one point entering through Megatron's portal (painful) and then back in the DU for dramatic splash page? I thought he wanted out?

I don't particularly care for Rattrap in all this. He's not a character, just 'director's commentary' - and if, IF, this supposed to be the same guy from Beast Wars, how comes he's so pally with a bad guy? RT always struck me as slightly prejudiced and set in his ways, and yet its totally fine for him to be best buds with Starscream?

Scoop just annoys me. He's one of these wretched "I see visions of the future" goofballs that exist only to spout portentous dialogue and be deliberately mysterious just to mask how incredibly dull and f**king empty their life is. He's basically the goth from the I.T. crowd.

I honestly couldn't tell if there was any Roberts in this at all. I have the feeling his involvement in this staggering event of epic proportions (tm) is minimal, if it all.



Dear Mr Barber, please stop raking over the past and a bunch of horrible comics we'd all rather forget about an concentrate on making some good comics. Lots of Love, Simon xxx

Knightdramon
2013-12-25, 01:51 AM
I just can't get into this. Its all so woolly and vague and nothings really happening. How comes Nova is at one point entering through Megatron's portal (painful) and then back in the DU for dramatic splash page? I thought he wanted out?

I don't particularly care for Rattrap in all this. He's not a character, just 'director's commentary' - and if, IF, this supposed to be the same guy from Beast Wars, how comes he's so pally with a bad guy? RT always struck me as slightly prejudiced and set in his ways, and yet its totally fine for him to be best buds with Starscream?

I honestly couldn't tell if there was any Roberts in this at all. I have the feeling his involvement in this staggering event of epic proportions (tm) is minimal, if it all.


Ironhide pushed Nova back, then the giant metrotitan hand probably smashed the facilities for the portal opening, Nova got stuck in the DU again.

Rattrap is not the same guy. Why would he be? Is Galvatron the same Galvatron from G1? Nope. Same goes for Rattrap ;)

There was DEFINITELY some Roberts penning that DU scene with Cyclonus. DEFINITELY. :up:

Red Dave Prime
2014-01-06, 08:34 PM
dark cybertron part 6 (http://www.tfw2005.com/transformers-news/comics-16/transformers-more-than-meets-the-eye-25-ibooks-preview-178949/)

Link from TFW2005. Love the art. Not perfect but theres some nice dynamics to each panel.

Denyer
2014-01-06, 09:21 PM
If anyone can salvage the Cybertron bits, it's Roberts.

Knightdramon
2014-01-06, 10:59 PM
I'm more excited for what's on the cover. First Prime versus the last two known Primes.

Which will probably get a splash page, and then be resolved off panel :lol:

Auntie Slag
2014-01-06, 11:22 PM
Ah reading that made me want to get into it again. Love Astrotrain for that admission, says so much about him in one line.

And look Swoop has the first bit of personality I've seen him exhibit since '87. And isn't that the same style of binoculars Jazz used to spy on Galvatron and co. in Target: 2006?

Red Dave Prime
2014-01-07, 09:21 AM
Shouldnt you change your name to Auntie Slug now?

(good spot on the binoculars - think you are indeed correct)

Auntie Slag
2014-01-07, 10:24 AM
Once a slag, always a slag :smokin:

zigzagger
2014-01-14, 06:12 AM
Transformers: Dark Cybertron Volume 2 contains More Than Meets The Eye #26-27, Robots In Disguise #25-27 and Dark Cybertron Finale.

-- ziggy

----

Transformers: Robots In Disguise #25: Dark Cybertron Part 7 (of 12) three-page preview @ TFW 2005 (http://www.tfw2005.com/transformers-news/comics-16/robots-in-disguise-25-dark-cybertron-part-7-ibooks-preview-179033/), courtesy of iTunes.

Full preview due sometime closer to release date. Stay tuned.

zigzagger
2014-01-14, 06:13 AM
Rest of the preview @ Newsarama (http://www.newsarama.com/20027-idw-previews-two-g-i-joe-adventures-tranformers-dark-cybertron-for-jan-15-2014.html) (once more mixed in with a preview for G.I. Joe).

Death's Head
2014-01-14, 02:23 PM
"It looks like his head, Skids."

:D

Oh Dark Cybertron, why do you taunt me so?

Knightdramon
2014-01-15, 06:10 PM
Not a bad issue, although sadly...NOTHING happens.

No new Necrotitan battle, not many revelations about Metroplex, not even a Nova-Orion/Rodimus battle that's hinted on the cover.

Especially on the last part, there is almost NO build up from last issue. This issue cheats in that it presents the last issue moment [Nova crashlanding] halfway into the story, with scenes set before it that didn't occur last issue.

Even though I enjoy the storyline so far, with each passing issue I just get the impression that Hasbro just wanted a cross-promotion of toys they ALREADY designed years/a year ago, and pressured IDW to do so.

inflatable dalek
2014-01-15, 08:36 PM
READ AND SPOILERS FROM HEREIN






Like Knightdramon says, there's still a sluggish pace, but generally this was just a lot of fun. For once the join between the two authors wasn't as apparent, and most of the dialogue was zinging, and Hardhead's death was very nearly shocking (slightly undone by the fact it's the second time he's died in a Dead Universe related way, and he's standing next to Nightbeat who has also made a complete recovery from dying in a Dead Universe related way).

I even didn't mind the Slag/Slug gag, (though as I'm currently rereading G.I. Joe it did remind me of the really painful stuff about Ghost Rider's name) but I still don't understand why the versions being released with the toys aren't just edited with the different names in whilst the regular comic is just left alone.

Only really out and out painful bit was "Hello, my name is Tankor and I must speak for I am a genuinely important character!". Couldn't they have at least had him pop up to say a few words in one of the previous issues? Presumably he's now going to be the voice of the NAILS.

Red Dave Prime
2014-01-16, 10:13 AM
It feels very throw away doesn't it? Not a terrible read, with some nice quips and touches but really its a nothing issue. Whats going on on Cybertron is still vague (it cant be as simple as Shockwave creates a zombie army to take over Cybertron?) and the dead universe stuff seems like the very definition of holing pattern.

Also as an aside, its hard to feel any sympathy for the nails and their complaints against 'screamer. It would not have mattered who was in charge when the titan went all agro with that bomb. And I hope the god part of Shockwaves plan wasn't to incriminate Starscream - his leadership is a very recent event and has no bearing on anything at all.

Cant wait for all this to blow over...

inflatable dalek
2014-01-16, 10:22 AM
Of course the NAILs matter, after all, they're represented by the well known and highly regarded Tankor!

Red Dave Prime
2014-01-16, 11:06 AM
Yeah, Tankor. After 20 or so issues you think he would have come up.

Funny how one of the more interesting aspects of RiD was the third faction of Nails but they really have added nothing to the Cybertron culture other than bitching at whomever is in charge. Would have been great if they had been given a stronger leader than Metalhawk (or just had him at something more than a gulible twat)

I mean you cant blame either side from hating on the nails. They arrived, uninvited, started using up resources while making everything look even more shanty town and then complained about everything. And they complained AFTER the event.

Basically the nails are that Aunty you never liked coming to town.

Terome
2014-01-16, 02:25 PM
I think maybe my favourite part was the Promethea-esque arrow-following sequence because you just don't get enough of those in action orientated, toy-promoting crossover events.

Also, Tankor as a pissy nurse - now there's a reinvention. Is he another Empurata sufferer or does he just have the funky stylings of wherever he's been hanging out?

The Hardhead sequence was nice and effective but I couldn't help thinking that Hardhead has been exposed to the Dead Universe before. Has he? Didn't he dive into something or other at the end of his Spotlight? And then came out again as Colossus? Hardhead has a lot going on.

Oh, and Nova Prime talking smack to Cyclonus was unexpected and neat. And strangely more mean than anything Nova Prime has done in the story so far. The cyberforming and the Expansion are such abstract concepts but picking on Cyclonus in a way he knows will push his buttons is just low.

This is almost certainly because I am still enjoying my Seacon reissue but since the Lost Light has the Seacons on board it would add up that they'd sic them on the Minicons. Though that would be a totally unnecessary diversion in a series with enough of those stacked up.

So while Dark Cybertron continues to be quite a bad idea this issue had enough fun bits and texture to be enjoyable.

Red Dave Prime
2014-01-16, 04:40 PM
Really feel that next time they should try this they should keep the books plot seperate apart from the first and final issues. The jumping about isnt helping any of the three plots and in some cases we seem to be getting major padding. MTMTE could have focused on the underwater hunt (and **** yes to the seacons coming out) and RID could have been the Dark Universe and Zombie Titan plots (both the more padded plot lines, or at least it feels that way to me)

Auntie Slag
2014-01-16, 05:06 PM
Donkey's years ago there was an ABBA medley in the charts. B*Witched, Steps, probably the Vengaboys, Scooch, Sugababes, Honeyz, 5ive and others absolutely murdering the shit out of some mulitply-conjoined ABBA tracks making one supertrack performed by a supergroup of the time.

It would've been better to let ABBA do their own song, again. And I'm not even a fan.

I think Hasbro owned all of these bands, and the idea hasn't been done to such effect since. So there is hope.

Knightdramon
2014-01-16, 08:04 PM
The Hardhead sequence was nice and effective but I couldn't help thinking that Hardhead has been exposed to the Dead Universe before. Has he? Didn't he dive into something or other at the end of his Spotlight? And then came out again as Colossus? Hardhead has a lot going on.



The Hardhead thing doesn't work on many angles.

First off, he became an undead zombie in revelations. Like Cyclonus. So that's 2 undead warriors.

Somehow, when Cybertron was reformatted with vector sigma at the end of chaos, cyclonus became a regular cybertronian as well. So no zombie regenerative powers [also prevalent since his horn never grew back and he had to be patched up after issue 12].

Presumably, Hardhead turned normal as well. Because, like Cyclonus, he'd need protection to get in the dead universe, which he got via the forcefield palm generator.

However, Cyclonus's generator broke, so he became "infected" again. Coughing up black energon, becoming moody...sick, but still, okay.

Hardhead's generator breaks and he crumbles away?

Something doesn't add up.

inflatable dalek
2014-01-16, 08:27 PM
Also, Tankor as a pissy nurse - now there's a reinvention. Is he another Empurata sufferer or does he just have the funky stylings of wherever he's been hanging out?

Was he supposed to be a medic? I thought he was just sort of hanging about to have his say because he he is so important.

Joking aside, part of the problem is it feels fairly obvious that there's one ex-Decepticon with a beef with Starscream who should be taking up the plight of the disenfranchised NAIL's, and that's Dirge. And I wouldn't be in the least bit surprised if, when which toys were getting promoted in which issue was in flux it was Dirge.


So while Dark Cybertron continues to be quite a bad idea this issue had enough fun bits and texture to be enjoyable.

I think that's an excellent summing up.

Skyquake87
2014-01-17, 08:52 PM
I have read this and it was the best issue of the crossover. Still bloody NOTHING happening, but the catch up with the MTMTE crew inside Metroplex's noggin was excellent and had me laughing out loud. The stuff with Starscream and Tankor was pish. It was just another horrible 'I AM NEW TOY CHARACTER OOH LOOK AT ME' moment which totally takes you out of the reading experience.

...I'm sure stuff like this used to be done better. Of course, my personal distaste for muddling in Transformers from divergent continuities with stylistically different bodies to many of their regular page sharers only helps amplify this.

Denyer
2014-01-21, 09:38 PM
http://i.imgur.com/aGxUNnc.jpg]

http://jasonenright.tumblr.com/post/74011840875/james-roberts-talks-about-mtmte-season-2-and-how

Red Dave Prime
2014-01-22, 12:53 PM
Wow, think this is out today and it would appear nobody cares - even though it has direct links to the beloved More than meets the eye :P

Warcry
2014-01-22, 05:42 PM
Do people even care about MTMTE currently? Dark Cybertron seems to have smothered a lot of the enthusiasm around both series, with lots of people just saying "Screw it, I'll wait until after the crossover to start reading again".

Knightdramon
2014-01-22, 07:47 PM
Great issue. Before I go on...take a look at this. (http://tfwiki.net/wiki/File:RID25_subcvr.jpg) This is the variant, toy-exclusive cover that will be with Crosscut.

There's about a billion things wrong with that, which is why I think Phil Jimenez was only and ONLY brought abroad as a PR thing, and credited so much when he's done nothing thus far bur lay out 3 pages in issue 1, and some atrocious covers.

On to the actual issue...

Brilliant. This feels and reads like a proper MTMTE penned issue. Though the art was at times incomprehensible on the Cybertron chapter [...was Dreadwing transforming into a tiny spaceship above Galvatron? It took a few tries to notice it was the spaceship of Jhiaxus].

Things are at a breaking point. Love how Bumblebee somehow stayed behind [Skywarp must still be around, was expecting him] to get Megatron. Who, surprise...is still alive and kicking. Which is no big surprise, we've seen bots survive this exact same injury, and he's one tough SOB to actually be able to work around it as well.

Galvatron's onto something...I think once more he just wants to do something for himself and ignore Nova and Jhiaxus. Sadly the power levels he exhibits here are much higher than what he had before.

Rodimus's palm doesn't make much sense. 89 trusted comrades and 101 expendable? 89 constructed cold and/or 101 forged?

People at tfw2005 were puzzled at how the number was smaller than the 300 he quoted in Remain In Light...

Which was deliberately inflated to boast off their offensive capabilities. Seeing as how Red Alert, Drift and Fort Max left the crew, at least 10 people have died [maybe much more] and some must have stayed behind at Luna 1...yeah, 190 crewmates sound about right.

Red Dave Prime
2014-01-23, 12:30 AM
Do people even care about MTMTE currently? Dark Cybertron seems to have smothered a lot of the enthusiasm around both series, with lots of people just saying "Screw it, I'll wait until after the crossover to start reading again".

(We care a lot) about Transformers cause there's more than meets the eye

Ahem...

Yeah, thought this was a cracker of an issue in general with the Cybertron bits being the only real drag. The art in some of those bits is really bad - Heart of Darkness bad. I really could do better myself.

A few gripes but nothing really major. Overall it was a good dense issue.

inflatable dalek
2014-01-23, 09:05 PM
Ohhhh, there was a bit of plot progression in here! Not much, but it was there. We know what the Mini-cons are up to, Nightbeat is back to normal (boooo though him suddenly being Benedict Cumberbatch wasn't a subtle clue something was wrong after all but rather it's his new default personality) and Megatron is rescued.

Considering just after the halfway mark in a story this long is where something big and game-changing should happen to keep things fresh that's rather underwhelming, but anything is welcome at this stage.

Still, despite the plot snailing along (has nothing been learnt from the last time IDW tried a 12 parter? Did Shane McCarthy die for our sins for nothing?) most of the individual scenes are very good, lots of snappy dialogue and fun moments and the second issue in a row where the styles of the two authors feels like it's meshing well. The only bit that didn't really work being yet another rerun of the Scoop/Starscream scene (that's what, the third such one?).

And when this is all done and dusted we need a poll for Least Convincing Toy Introduction. I didn't think "I am Tankor and I must speak!" would get topped so soon but "Hey, you're the famous anti-corruption senator Crosscut!*" managed it, even with a meta joke about him not having met Swerve before it's hard not to escape the feeling that neither Barber nor Roberts are that enthused by the pack in mandate.

Still, flaws aside that was still a fun, if not exactly best of the best, read.






*It's odd he'd be given a backstory that would straight away have you asking "So where was he during all the senate corruption flashbacks Roberts and Dille have given us?

Skyquake87
2014-01-23, 09:46 PM
I will look forward to this continuing avalanche of average when I next go to the comic shop, then. yay comics.

Terome
2014-01-23, 10:49 PM
Yeah, it was pretty gripping. I'm a bit fond of these toy introductions and Crosscut was neat. The Nightbeat stuff was fine, but I found myself liking the Shockwave / Galvatron / Bumblebee / Megatron scenes the best. And Dalek's right, the Starscream segments are a real drag. The interesting parts of Scoop's character fell off with a clang a while back.

Red Dave Prime
2014-01-24, 01:46 AM
It's odd he'd be given a backstory that would straight away have you asking "So where was he during all the senate corruption flashbacks Roberts and Dille have given us?

The worse thing about this is that one of the nice things about the first year of MTMTE is how much attention Roberts paid to his back story - there are numerous threads which have been well planned out and tie together well. Whats been even better is that he hasnt used them all up - they are still very much background colour to help give the characters a bit of history beyond the comic thats consistent. Things like this stick out like a sore thumb.

That reminds me... I really must get back to writing my comic reviews.

Knightdramon
2014-01-24, 10:29 AM
I'm not fussed about it. On a spaceship as big as Magnus mentioned a while ago, with a crew numbering on over 200 at the time, even certain A-listers can get lost in the mix. Unless I remember wrong, Perceptor didn't really speak until issue 14-15 or so? And he's the Autobots main science dude.

On the subject of Senators...again, not too fussed about it. Up until RID 17, we didn't know Dai Atlas was a senator, and barbers fit that in very nicely. Proteus? We hardly even heard of him before Shadowplay/Chaos Theory.

Heck, we didn't even know of a Nominus Prime/Delta Magnus/Primal Vanguard and those guys turned out fine.

So yeap, Senator Crosscut has got about a billion places to fit in ;)

inflatable dalek
2014-01-25, 10:35 AM
Dai Atlas was at least established as a major and important character from Cybertron's history back in Drift, that coupled with the fact he's clearly a snooty bastard who looks down on everyone else means him showing up as a senator in Monstrocity but not anywhere else makes a sort of sense.

But as you say, it's not impossible for Crosscut to fit in (though he must have been on holiday during all MTMTE flashbacks), it's just when you get hammered over the head with his backstory in a scene that has nothing to do with the rest of the issue (and likely the story) the incongruity stands out a lot more.

It actually would have made more sense to have this famous champion of the people in the Tankor role last issue really wouldn't it?

Terome
2014-01-28, 04:52 PM
What has been said and resaid about the Senate and Starscream's killing of them all? As far as I am aware, it was originally just Kaon's politicians, then it became an emergency meeting of everywhere's politicians, then it turned out there were exceptions and there was a reduced but functional Senate for Nova Prime to shout at.

I think that the Senate weren't just corrupt but utterly incompetent. Do they even do a headcount? Most of them probably got their Senate membership free in a box of Frosties.

inflatable dalek
2014-01-28, 05:13 PM
I think part of the problem is that the original intent back in Origin (which was of course originally pitched to Dreamwave where Starscream did, IIRC, kill all the senate) was he wiped out the entire government.

Then Autocracy retconed it so he just killed a senate for one city or something like that.

Now RID seems to have swung back to everyone being lured into a trap with Dai Atlas being the only survivor until Crosscut was lubed in.

Basically, no one seems to have any idea what is going on there.

Terome
2014-01-28, 05:20 PM
Maybe everyone in the Senate just works part-time? At three o' clock they take off their capes and togas and go to deliver pizzas until they are pooped.

That's why Crosscut had that shovel. He was Astrotrain's coal-stoker. Oh no, it wasn't coal coal it was cy-coal. Or Co-AL. And there's nothing sexual about it.

zigzagger
2014-02-04, 03:59 AM
Transformers: More Than Meets The Eye #26: Dark Cybertron Part 8 (of 12) full preview @ Newsarama (http://www.newsarama.com/20211-dark-cybertron-act-2-ends-in-transformers-mtmte-26-preview-sorry-no-dinobots-here.html).

Unicron
2014-02-04, 09:51 AM
Link botched up, looks like a colon got missed. Try this (http://www.newsarama.com/20211-dark-cybertron-act-2-ends-in-transformers-mtmte-26-preview-sorry-no-dinobots-here.html)

Knightdramon
2014-02-05, 06:29 PM
Nifty issue.

The good? Things are finally happening. All out war on Cybertron. Bumblebee finally being likeable instead of me wanting to hit him in the head.

The better? Megatron's plan. He manages to come off as a nice guy. He wants to evacuate everybody, gather all his forces, and then launch an offensive against Shockwave. It only dawned on me how this is all-against one when he specifically said he'll call the DJD back--badass villains from MTMTE fighting alongside heroes, just in mention though, hammered the idea home.

Finally some answers as to why Metroplex was like that. And fun references with Alpha Trion and Thunderclash. Not terribly fussed or excited about the fembots, but they work okay here.

Starscream's collapsed again. This recurring catatonia when things go out of control is extremely original and has mixed feelings from me. Why would he think that the Autobots/Decepticons are with the Necrotitan?

Something fishy is going on in the dead universe. First off, as I've touched on before, why isn't Cyclonyus simply disintegrating, since he is without protection, like Hardhead? If anything, Hardhead should still be undead, so his demise makes less sense in the long run.

Not too fussed about Kup. And I'm of the belief that Pax is somewhat possessed by something evil. His words to Rodimus, as well as an upcoming cover featuring Optimus fighting a slightly darker Optimus are a big giveaway to that.

Nova continues to be a joke, much to my dismay. For a guy so hyped up as the first Prime [that we know of], for the guy that actually was so powerful and charismatic he ended a war...he surely gets sidelined by lesser "villains" a lot. Last issue he walked with the bots, showed them Kup as if they were all buddies, locked them up and was then...gone?

inflatable dalek
2014-02-05, 08:43 PM
Yep, the series continues to find its feet, probably a bit too late in the day for it to help the overall quality but at least we're getting some non-terrible issues to close things out.

The main thing I liked was the Rodimus revelation and Prime's reaction. Unlike the esteemed Mr. Knightdramon I don't think there's anything funny or wrong with Pax, not only was it exactly the sort of thing I felt he would say (after all, he willingly stood down for the greater good himself), but it was the bucket of cold water to the face Rodimus needed much more than platitudes if he is going to change.

The main weakness (allowing for the fact it's too early to say if the fembots are going to be a train-wreak or not, though there doesn't seem to be enough plot for three of them, you'd almost think there are only that many because they wanted to introduce some none-Windblade ones first so as the character leading her own series wouldn't have to take the full impact of any initial negative reaction to a controversial idea) was Bumblebee's continued inept leadership.

I mean, he's a bastard, but Megatron does know a few things about fighting war and his suggestion of retreating in order to regroup and get reinforcements was an entirely sensible one (and as Cybertron's NAIL population is likely not insanely huge at this point there's no reason everyone couldn't evacuate Iacon for Luna 2 as well). Bumblebee's tactic of "Get ourselves killed under the heels of a giant zombie killing machine because it's the morally right thing to do, even though it won't actually help anyone" was just mentally ill.

It's just a shame Metroplex showing up and changing the situation mean Bumblebee is likely to be validated, with ensuing smugness despite the fact there's no way he could have factored that into his plans.

It's also only something that really stands out because of those Dawn French of the Autobots posters and as such is a slightly unfair criticism to make, but all of Megatron's talk about his original pure ideals did feel like a slightly clumsy way of foreshadowing his side switch.

Metroplex seeming ready for a fight when his brain is in his shoulder and he's supposedly used most of his energy to space bridge them there seems a bit odd as well, but hopefully next month will either subvert that final panel or explain it.

And what is going on with Kup's almost unrecognisable design? Considering the nature of Dark Cybertron it feels for all the world as if he has a new, different looking, toy out, but unless I've missed it this is not the case. If people didn't keep calling him Kup, I'd have trouble keeping track of the fact it's supposed to be him.

inflatable dalek
2014-02-07, 03:19 PM
The come down in the lack of comments on a MTMTE issue compared to what we were getting four months ago is probably the harshest review of the whole series isn't it?

Death's Head
2014-02-07, 03:50 PM
I just...I just can't. Money's tight at the mo so comics where I'm enjoying maybe a few panels per issue are definitely out the window, especially as I'm looking askance at Marvel's Revolutionary War and thinking about buying all of those (first Marvel comics I'll have bought in nearly fifteen years!).

I'll be back on board once Dark Cybertron's out of the way. March, innit?

inflatable dalek
2014-02-07, 03:53 PM
Yep. I very nearly gave up myself a before the half way mark and I'm still not completely sure sticking was a good idea, but it is at least much more entertaining than it started out as even if the Big Plot is basically meh.

Death's Head
2014-02-07, 06:06 PM
I'm following the wiki summaries and comments threads and I keep seeing little snatches of dialogue, or certain scenes (like the stuff in the recent issue about Megatron hiding in the shadows until a dramatic moment presents itself) and I think "Oh, maybe I should have stuck with it". Then I read the rest of the summary in which absolutely nothing seems to happen (how many months is it now that everyone's just been staring up at the "necrotitan" and not actually doing anything?) and I just think "sod it".

Never mind, new Death's Head soon! Drawn by Nick Roche (yay!) Written by Dan Abnett (hmm. Wonder how poor old Furman feels about that? I get the impression that poor man needs a giant bloody hug.).

Denyer
2014-02-07, 07:42 PM
The come down in the lack of comments on a MTMTE issue compared to what we were getting four months ago is probably the harshest review of the whole series isn't it?
Just busy mainly. Enjoyed this one more than most issues so far.

Bumblebee/Goldbug/whatever has been so thoroughly ****ed as a character so far (not specifically in Dark Cybertron) it'd be kinder to off him.

Kungfu Dinobot
2014-02-08, 05:23 AM
Just busy mainly. Enjoyed this one more than most issues so far.

Bumblebee/Goldbug/whatever has been so thoroughly ****ed as a character so far (not specifically in Dark Cybertron) it'd be kinder to off him.


I don't know about you, but I think Hasbro just wants to rub salt in the readers' collective wounds. Not like they like Hasbro all that much to begin with, I guess it's just a case of trading punches.

Knightdramon
2014-02-08, 11:39 AM
I think they're trying to write Bumblebee as meaning well but flawed, make him more "human" than the never wrong Optimus.

But they're failing. It's not like the little guy isn't trying either.

He's been constantly undermined for the past 2-5 years, by Prowl, by Magnus, by Rodimus, even by Prime.

And being so small and timid, he's always cautious of somebody trying to undermine his leadership. He can't really take it if it's Megatron :lol:

Of all the Autobot high command, he's the one that has suffered most in comparison.

Prime/Pax is the paragon of justice. Most Autobots and even some Decepticons can't get enough of him.
Magnus is possibly the strongest Autobot, he's feared and respected in equal measures.
Prowl is a badass on his own right WHEN he fights, but he's not very high on the popularity meter. He doesn't give a damn about it though.
Rodimus is maybe a little less strong than Prowl, but he has a way of swaying the crowd even though he just wings it 99% of the time.

...and Bumblebee is weaker than regular bots, can't handle pressure, can't handle leadership posts and his opponents don't respect him at all. So...yay.

Terome
2014-02-08, 03:54 PM
I read it but don't have much to say beyond the approval of the Megatron bit and the telling off of Rodimus. Nice, understated intro for Windblade & co. and some effective hints about Alpha Trion. Death's Head is right on the 'couple of panels per issue' ratio. The preview for the next issue looks like something will happen maybe:


http://www.tfw2005.com/transformers-news/comics-16/robots-in-disguise-26-dark-cybertron-part-9-full-preview-179252/ (http://www.tfw2005.com/transformers-news/comics-16/robots-in-disguise-26-dark-cybertron-part-9-full-preview-179252/)

Mostly I've been pondering that bit in #13's Signal To Noise where Tailgate says that Cyclonus is a multi-billionaire because of his real estate investments. How on earth does that work?

Unicron
2014-02-08, 04:19 PM
I read it but don't have much to say beyond the approval of the Megatron bit and the telling off of Rodimus. Nice, understated intro for Windblade & co. and some effective hints about Alpha Trion. Death's Head is right on the 'couple of panels per issue' ratio. The preview for the next issue looks like something will happen maybe:


http://www.tfw2005.com/transformers-news/comics-16/robots-in-disguise-26-dark-cybertron-part-9-full-preview-179252/ (http://www.tfw2005.com/transformers-news/comics-16/robots-in-disguise-26-dark-cybertron-part-9-full-preview-179252/)

Mostly I've been pondering that bit in #13's Signal To Noise where Tailgate says that Cyclonus is a multi-billionaire because of his real estate investments. How on earth does that work?
Yeah, definitely looks like something will actually happen. Of course, the rest of the issue after those preview pages could just be Pax and Nova sitting in the Dead Universe, having a spirited debate over where to build a new on-ramp or something.

As for the real estate investments, I figure it's sort of like that Futurama episode where Fry discovers he's a billionaire because of the interest his bank account picked up while he was frozen for 1000 years.
Cyclonus was missing (but not officially dead, atleast for any sort of record keeping purposes on Cybertron, I would assume) for a couple of million years. Think of all the shanix in interest he'd have accrued.

zigzagger
2014-02-08, 04:53 PM
Transformers: Robots In Disguise #26: Dark Cybertron Part 9 (of 12) full preview @ Newsarama (http://www.newsarama.com/20263-metroplex-drops-in-on-dark-cybertron-for-transformers-robots-in-disguise-26-preview.html).

inflatable dalek
2014-02-08, 06:30 PM
Though all that depends on the Cybertronian Banking system surviving millions upon millions of years of war. Which would make the person in charge of it more efficient than Gordon Brown.

How big is Iacon supposed to be anyway? Considering that, in fiction, it can't be more than a week (and that's being generous and assuming it took a few days for all the kicked out Transformers to get their shit together and leave the city) since Prowlestator was dry humping the place, so there can't be that much left to destroy, so why is there enough time for everyone to stop for a chat whilst he's supposedly raining death down upon them?

Knightdramon
2014-02-08, 06:41 PM
It's been a day after Megatron's rampage.

Unless days passed in Dark Cybertron [which, I doubt], the timeline is like this...

Megatron's master plan comes to fruition at night

It's all done by very early dawn [Starscream casting out his symbol and all the combatants in the wilderness]

That day passes

Next morning comes in much earlier thanks to Shockwave's plan.

Dark Cybertron envelops.

So yeah, not much time has passed.

Terome
2014-02-08, 06:49 PM
No wonder everybody is acting so tired and out-of-it.

Death's Head
2014-02-08, 08:19 PM
If they all just sat down and talked it over with a pot of tea this would have been over ages ago.

Death's Head
2014-02-08, 08:19 PM
(And the pot of tea's dialogue would have been more convincing than Rattrap's!)

Kungfu Dinobot
2014-02-09, 05:26 AM
I think they're trying to write Bumblebee as meaning well but flawed, make him more "human" than the never wrong Optimus.

But they're failing. It's not like the little guy isn't trying either.


That's a more realistic assessment of the situation, but I like to think Hasbro's smarter than that.I mean, we're talking about a sinister cabal that makes money by raping childhoods. That takes serious skills.

Knightdramon
2014-02-09, 12:12 PM
That's a more realistic assessment of the situation, but I like to think Hasbro's smarter than that.I mean, we're talking about a sinister cabal that makes money by raping childhoods. That takes serious skills.

I'm...not sure of the meaning of this, or the previous message of yours...

Terome
2014-02-09, 06:06 PM
As for the real estate investments, I figure it's sort of like that Futurama episode where Fry discovers he's a billionaire because of the interest his bank account picked up while he was frozen for 1000 years.
Cyclonus was missing (but not officially dead, atleast for any sort of record keeping purposes on Cybertron, I would assume) for a couple of million years. Think of all the shanix in interest he'd have accrued.

That sort of fits but surely every institution he was ever involved in would have dried up even if there hadn't been a perpetual war? Keep in mind that most of Cyclonus' defining character moments pre-MTMTE were him tut-tutting at the wreckage of everything he had ever known.

I'm tempted to chalk it up to Tailgate bullshitting, actually.

Yeah, definitely looks like something will actually happen. Of course, the rest of the issue after those preview pages could just be Pax and Nova sitting in the Dead Universe, having a spirited debate over where to build a new on-ramp or something.

I would maybe prefer that. Nova Prime's ideas about civil engineering works are bound to be worth something. He does live in a house shaped like his head.

inflatable dalek
2014-02-09, 07:20 PM
That sort of fits but surely every institution he was ever involved in would have dried up even if there hadn't been a perpetual war? Keep in mind that most of Cyclonus' defining character moments pre-MTMTE were him tut-tutting at the wreckage of everything he had ever known.

I suppose it's possible his property investments could have all been off-world. Hell, screw the Windblade series, I want to see Cyclonus: Intergalactic Stock Broker: The Series.

lets just hope the Norweb Federation doesn't catch up with him.

Terome
2014-02-09, 07:29 PM
Sadly, it's specifically Tetrahexian real estate that Tailgate mentions.

The idea of these guys accumulating wealth is pretty interesting - it's very sloppily implemented right now but could be a great way to colour in Cybertronian society. As far as I see it, the planet itself seemed to be a giant reservoir of energy in the old days. But then, I suppose, isn't ours?

The difference is that it's entirely plausible that the first sentient Transformers lived in a world where food was handed out to them by existing, non-sentient machines. I'm guessing that those beings that could monopolise the Basic Needs Machines were the first of the wealthy. Do Transformers build new infrastructure or does it all spring forth from the planet in response to population pressure? Are those tendrils and cyber-flora we see in RID the beginnings of that process? Is this why they are so hopeless at thriving off-planet? What does a 'primordial' Cybertron even mean?

Am I asking far too much for these sorts of things to be discussed at all in the fiction?

Terome
2014-02-09, 07:33 PM
I mean wouldn't it be neat if all those mega-highways and tri-torus loops and Underbases and whatever just kind of grew out of glowy holes? That way, it would make sense for nobody except a select few to know how they worked, would emphasise the importance of Cybertron to the Transformers, give a hint to why there are similar races in the galaxy and would be a ready-set way to explain why they are so warlike and obsessed with controlling certain resources and patches of ground. 'What's so great about Iacon?' 'It doesn't grow anywhere else.'

Anyway. I should be reading about infanticide in meerkats.

Kungfu Dinobot
2014-02-10, 03:17 AM
I'm...not sure of the meaning of this, or the previous message of yours...

Ooo..kay, I'll try to rephrase what I said into something less... cluster****y-_-'


I'm saying, what you said, about Hasbro trying to make Bumblebee realistic character but failing, is probably the truth. But me, being the weirdo I am, believes Hasbro is deliberately making him as unlikeable character as humanely conceivable, as some kind of "trololololol" attack on the fanbase. Sort of a "You hate Bumblebee? Too bad!" kind of thing.



Between a fringe movement in the fanbase being convinced the Hasbro-Bay cabal is some kind of evil scheme to "rape their childhood", and the knowledge that they will buy the comics no matter what (how many people stuck through Costa anyways?), I believe, as ridiculous as that sounds, that Hasbro is giving the fandom their bile back.;)

Skyquake87
2014-02-10, 09:35 AM
I think you are crediting Hasbro with far too much editorial control over the comics then they actually have. As far as I can tell, their involvement is pretty much 'we have some new toys we'd like you to pimp to fandom' or 'no, you can't kill that guy'.

The reason Bumblebee comes over as such an out of his depth character is because...he is. He's not Leadership material, and he's never been an Autobot that anyone takes seriously, despite his espionage skills.

If anything, the writers are probably projecting their own misgivings about the character being put into a Leadership role that he's clearly not cut out for. Barber, being the continuity nut that he is, is running with a concept set up before he took over as writer/editor.

Conspiracy theories about the machinations of Hasbro are stupid and pointless where the comic books are concerned anyway. I can imagine they couldn't give two shits about - there's only 10,000 people tops reading these things globally. Not even the majority of fandom are reading these things, so why would they care to piss off a tiny minority?

Privately, more widely I bet some of their staff probably do wish they could get on with their work without the self entitled bleatings of whiny men-children, but I can't see they'd go out of their way to wind people up. Its not in their interests to do that. Always remember, Hasbro are there to sell toys (and now dabble in the best ways to exploit their IP).

If you think the comics are poorly written/ drawn, there's only one place you can lay the blame for that: IDW.

Knightdramon
2014-02-10, 06:15 PM
First off...the comic sales figures are from US single issue sales alone and number around 8000+...

but they don't take into account comixology US sales, European release market or European comixology sales. Heck, not even Asia sales, if applicable.

So I believe the actual headcount for readers is way over the 8800 or so figures we see each month.

And yes, I don't think Hasbro cares enough or has a spite with fans the way fans do with them. Just this past month I've had two instances in which, if I was a designer/employer of Hasbro/Takara, I'd just say f*ck it and stop working.

1st off, that massive, blind and stupid rage at tfw2005 where everybody and their mother cried out because the MP designer changed again. Up until half a f*cking year ago, those morons were clueless as to who was designing their figures. Nowadays they feel they can trust a man with vision, a man who knows what he wants, a man who has had a healthy career beforehand but they were still f*cking clueless. And of course they're going to bitch like bitches when said man dares to have another assignment by takara.

So yeah, talk about entitlement first.

Secondly, the collective mass hysteria of how "badly formed" the AOE FE Prime is. How Hasbro ruined it forever and then that designer [who wasn't even a chief designer on the thing] DARED come out and pimp out the toy in a video? OMFG a man trying to do the job he was assigned by hasbro? DARE he try to promote a toy he had a part in and is a big part of hasbro's push? In a video?

---So yeah, Hasbro is still making money, man-children still cry worse than 10year olds and all is good in the world.

And no, hasbro isn't trolling us. I think some of the people associated with hasbro would like to, but as a collective, they can't be arsed to give a damn after they watch their profit.

Denyer
2014-02-10, 08:37 PM
I think you are crediting Hasbro with far too much editorial control over the comics then they actually have. As far as I can tell, their involvement is pretty much 'we have some new toys we'd like you to pimp to fandom' or 'no, you can't kill that guy'.
Pretty much. I suspect IDW themselves are quite keen on the whole comics pack-in thing. The company's been hit-and-miss with writers, with picks for Megatron: Origin (not an bad concept if it'd been edited better) and Mike Costa on the ongoing left to do... whatever he was trying to... particular low points. Shane McCarthy, for all that he pulled the same crap with AHM as with the Batman Riddler story he did for DC, demonstrated better elsewhere and managed to develop some fan following.

Secondly, the collective mass hysteria of how "badly formed" the AOE FE Prime is.
Kind of glad by this point I don't have time to read other forums. Sure, it looks pretty crap, but look at all of the other cool stuff that's around at the moment.

inflatable dalek
2014-02-10, 08:42 PM
If Hasbro are doing some sort of evil plot to ruin Bumblebee forever to the (relatively) small percentage of fandom who read the comics, they're really playing a very long game as the character has been ****ed up since the AHM Coda stuff... what four years ago? That's some severe dedication, as well as committed coordination between a group of disparate editors and writers who often had trouble with things as simple as getting speech bubbles to point at the right characters.

Terome
2014-02-11, 12:24 AM
Pretty interesting interview about the writing process of Dark Cybertron - it makes a certain amount of sense that Andy Schmidt has his fingerprints on it.

http://www.iaconunderground.net/?p=330

inflatable dalek
2014-02-11, 08:56 PM
Of course Schmidt had to be involved somewhere, the "You still function" bit this issue was the give-away. Presumably he suggested it whilst popping in the room to bring everyone their tea.

You can actually tell the two writers have worked together on scenes a lot more as the series has gone one, the join in their styles has been a lot less obvious making for a smother read as we've gone into the second half. Obviously hindsight is 20/20, but it would probably have been better if the series had worked like that from the start.

Knightdramon
2014-02-12, 07:46 PM
Wow, what an issue.

Will write more coherent thoughts later, but wow.

Cop out of the cover though...major cop out :lol:

Terome
2014-02-12, 09:01 PM
Yeah, that was a decent enough payoff. I like the idea of Optimus being unwittingly used as an assassin or heat-seeking missile.

Shockwave's little sigh to Galvatron on the last page was some of the Good Old Stuff too. 'Ancient royalty to an imagined throne' - better get yourself to a SICK BURN WARD, Galvatron.

Are we supposed to know what that wibbly trance-party throwball thing Jhiaxus had the end was? A nega-core or whatever?

Rodimus stuff was a bit obvious but it played out well enough.

Kungfu Dinobot
2014-02-13, 04:05 AM
I think you are crediting Hasbro with far too much editorial control over the comics then they actually have. As far as I can tell, their involvement is pretty much 'we have some new toys we'd like you to pimp to fandom' or 'no, you can't kill that guy'.

The reason Bumblebee comes over as such an out of his depth character is because...he is. He's not Leadership material, and he's never been an Autobot that anyone takes seriously, despite his espionage skills.

If anything, the writers are probably projecting their own misgivings about the character being put into a Leadership role that he's clearly not cut out for. Barber, being the continuity nut that he is, is running with a concept set up before he took over as writer/editor.

Conspiracy theories about the machinations of Hasbro are stupid and pointless where the comic books are concerned anyway. I can imagine they couldn't give two shits about - there's only 10,000 people tops reading these things globally. Not even the majority of fandom are reading these things, so why would they care to piss off a tiny minority?

Privately, more widely I bet some of their staff probably do wish they could get on with their work without the self entitled bleatings of whiny men-children, but I can't see they'd go out of their way to wind people up. Its not in their interests to do that. Always remember, Hasbro are there to sell toys (and now dabble in the best ways to exploit their IP).

If you think the comics are poorly written/ drawn, there's only one place you can lay the blame for that: IDW.


Like I said, what you and Dramon said are probably the truth, but a guy can't dream can he?


Anyways, I haven't been following IDW since AHM 12. Thought of getting into MTMTE, but the whole Dark Cybertron thing puts me off.


First off...the comic sales figures are from US single issue sales alone and number around 8000+...

but they don't take into account comixology US sales, European release market or European comixology sales. Heck, not even Asia sales, if applicable.

So I believe the actual headcount for readers is way over the 8800 or so figures we see each month.

And yes, I don't think Hasbro cares enough or has a spite with fans the way fans do with them. Just this past month I've had two instances in which, if I was a designer/employer of Hasbro/Takara, I'd just say f*ck it and stop working.

1st off, that massive, blind and stupid rage at tfw2005 where everybody and their mother cried out because the MP designer changed again. Up until half a f*cking year ago, those morons were clueless as to who was designing their figures. Nowadays they feel they can trust a man with vision, a man who knows what he wants, a man who has had a healthy career beforehand but they were still f*cking clueless. And of course they're going to bitch like bitches when said man dares to have another assignment by takara.

So yeah, talk about entitlement first.

Secondly, the collective mass hysteria of how "badly formed" the AOE FE Prime is. How Hasbro ruined it forever and then that designer [who wasn't even a chief designer on the thing] DARED come out and pimp out the toy in a video? OMFG a man trying to do the job he was assigned by hasbro? DARE he try to promote a toy he had a part in and is a big part of hasbro's push? In a video?

---So yeah, Hasbro is still making money, man-children still cry worse than 10year olds and all is good in the world.

And no, hasbro isn't trolling us. I think some of the people associated with hasbro would like to, but as a collective, they can't be arsed to give a damn after they watch their profit.


I don't really care who designs the MPs (since I dont collect them), as long as they make a good Galvatron Figure. I might not be able to afford it,(though my luck is changing as of now) but I'll be happy for everyone else.


I think AOE Optimus is kind of crap (though technically speaking, no worse than animated Wreck-Gar), but I also think he's make a great Rodimus Prime custom, you know, with the triple smokestacks and all.


If Hasbro are doing some sort of evil plot to ruin Bumblebee forever to the (relatively) small percentage of fandom who read the comics, they're really playing a very long game as the character has been ****ed up since the AHM Coda stuff... what four years ago? That's some severe dedication, as well as committed coordination between a group of disparate editors and writers who often had trouble with things as simple as getting speech bubbles to point at the right characters.


Like I said, rubbing salt in the wound. Not that i really believe it, mind you.



Of course, I have nothing worth saying anymore, so I'll lead myself out, for now. See ya! *door slam*

Red Dave Prime
2014-02-13, 12:48 PM
Yeah, that was a decent enough payoff. I like the idea of Optimus being unwittingly used as an assassin or heat-seeking missile.

Shockwave's little sigh to Galvatron on the last page was some of the Good Old Stuff too. 'Ancient royalty to an imagined throne' - better get yourself to a SICK BURN WARD, Galvatron.

Are we supposed to know what that wibbly trance-party throwball thing Jhiaxus had the end was? A nega-core or whatever?

Rodimus stuff was a bit obvious but it played out well enough.

what do you mean by an assassin or heat seeking missile? i appear to have missed something

ok issue, keeps things building and the titan battle wasnt the all engulfing scenario i feared it might turn into. although, again, i missed why the thumb being attached was so important when he was still missing an eye...

some questions i would like answered before all this finishes though:

where did galvatron and nova come from in the begining of all this? both were killed.

why were they friends again? technically galvatron has killed nova twice.

when did nova get to control the dead universe like that?

why does galvatron now have a link to nova and the dead universe?

is metalhawk enslaved to shockwave or what? and if not, he seems oddly placed to being important to shockwave?

what was all the black marks covering everyone?

nightbeat died outside the dead universe, how was he still alive?

how does nova know or have any link to the other primes - especially sentinal, that guy was just a trumped up head of security.

wasnt it megatrons old body that had the space bridge?

metroplex kills all the minicons by... what now exactly?

béfore, you could not leave the dead universe because you become contaminated but nova, jhiaxus and galvatron never sort this issue out. ok, galvatron was immune from the start but that was the whole reason for their original scheme back in furmans days.

theres more i am sure but as enjoyable as things have been the plot holes feel even more glaring then normal.

Terome
2014-02-13, 02:18 PM
what do you mean by an assassin or heat seeking missile? i appear to have missed something


Looks like Shockwave and Jhiaxus lured Orion in to the Dead Universe specifically so he could take out Nova, breaking his hold on its power.

ok issue, keeps things building and the titan battle wasnt the all engulfing scenario i feared it might turn into. although, again, i missed why the thumb being attached was so important when he was still missing an eye...


All we know is that there was an extra-special Ore inside the thumb which Megatron could recognise.


where did galvatron and nova come from in the begining of all this? both were killed.

why were they friends again? technically galvatron has killed nova twice.

when did nova get to control the dead universe like that?


I think there is information being withheld for now but I'd wager that Nova was D-Void all along. He had the power to do wacky Dead Universe stuff and to cloud minds, Galvatron's in particular. Galvatron's always been established as the one with the most empathy for the Dead Universe. How or why that works I do not know.


is metalhawk enslaved to shockwave or what? and if not, he seems oddly placed to being important to shockwave?

what was all the black marks covering everyone?


Beats me!


nightbeat died outside the dead universe, how was he still alive?


They kind of explained this a few issues back with all that 'But I killed you!' 'Yes, but...' business. Can't remember the specifics but they made enough of an effort to have some.

how does nova know or have any link to the other primes - especially sentinal, that guy was just a trumped up head of security.


As mentioned, Nova is a literal-minded kind of guy. He's also probably chuffed enough about the Legacy of Primes that he'd include technicalities like Sentinel to boost its importance.


wasnt it megatrons old body that had the space bridge?



They moved that over along with the brain and spark and such.

metroplex kills all the minicons by... what now exactly?


He was immunocompromised before he got his thumb back. Presumably Metroplex on a good day can kill anyone running around inside of him with a thought or a twitch.

béfore, you could not leave the dead universe because you become contaminated but nova, jhiaxus and galvatron never sort this issue out. ok, galvatron was immune from the start but that was the whole reason for their original scheme back in furmans days.

This hasn't been covered very well. Presumably, Shockwave had lied to Nova about that being a thing any more since he had Jhiaxus on-side. Jhiaxus has an excuse because he was hanging around on Cybertron during Chaos and whatever remade Cyclonus went for him too. Galvatron could stay outside for as long as he wished after Heart Of Darkness. Maybe Nova just plain seizing up and dying was the back-up plan if Orion hadn't smashed him to pieces?

These will be fun questions for the kids who got a piece of Dark Cybertron with their toy to mull over. I envy them a bit - it might seem quite a bit more exciting to them than to someone who has actually read Heart Of Darkness, Chaos, Revelation, et al. I remember the Dead Universe being exciting when all we had were shadowy figures, that weird pool, Micromasters and Nova Prime's floating head.

Knightdramon
2014-02-13, 05:39 PM
what do you mean by an assassin or heat seeking missile? i appear to have missed something

ok issue, keeps things building and the titan battle wasnt the all engulfing scenario i feared it might turn into. although, again, i missed why the thumb being attached was so important when he was still missing an eye...

some questions i would like answered before all this finishes though:

where did galvatron and nova come from in the begining of all this? both were killed.

why were they friends again? technically galvatron has killed nova twice.

when did nova get to control the dead universe like that?

why does galvatron now have a link to nova and the dead universe?

is metalhawk enslaved to shockwave or what? and if not, he seems oddly placed to being important to shockwave?

what was all the black marks covering everyone?

nightbeat died outside the dead universe, how was he still alive?

how does nova know or have any link to the other primes - especially sentinal, that guy was just a trumped up head of security.

wasnt it megatrons old body that had the space bridge?

metroplex kills all the minicons by... what now exactly?

béfore, you could not leave the dead universe because you become contaminated but nova, jhiaxus and galvatron never sort this issue out. ok, galvatron was immune from the start but that was the whole reason for their original scheme back in furmans days.

theres more i am sure but as enjoyable as things have been the plot holes feel even more glaring then normal.

Have you read the series until now? Some of your questions are easily answered.

1) Galvatron was last seen in Chaos, where he simply evaporated. Much like Orion, who evaporated and simply teleported, it's not that big a stretch that Galvatron evaporated back to the dead universe. Nova appeared to be dead in Revelations, only to turn up again in Heart of Darkness, where he was under the influence of "The Darkness" and was simply held inside that universe. You could argue that Nova has such a strong handle on his deadite powers that he can pull of stuff like that.

2) The friendship thing came out of nowhere, but I suppose a megalomaniac like Nova can forgive a turn tail who had ambitions that were thwarted.

3) Nova probably had these powers ever since Revelation [but couldn't use them due to being out of the dead universe], or he "leveled-up" by being all alone in the dead universe all these years. Guy was special enough to be the only Cybertronian to have stopped a civil war, I'm pretty sure he can master a craft like that within a span of 6.000.000 years ;)

4) Galvatron appears to have such a link because for the past 1 or 2 years, he and Nova were the only "living" bots inside that Universe. Do not forget that "the darkness" or whatever coursed through both of them, so they could both be interconnected to it, and by extension, each other.

5) Metalhawk appears to be under Shockwave's control [much like Necrotitan, who was also revived by the dead Ore], or he could be acting on his own. The final panel of him holding a gagged Waspinator implies 2 things

a) Either Shockwave, for some reason, wants Jhiaxus and the rest to think that Waspinator is dead [a bit farfetched].
b) Metalhawk is free of any control, doesn't want to murder a Decepticon, and tries to figure out more about Shockwave's plan to try and thwart it.

6) The black marks have been implied to be "the black plague". Not everybody was affected, but the bots that were affected [Slag, Astrotrain, Starscream, among others] appeared to be decaying and dying.

7) Nightbeat said a few issues ago that his dead body was kept by the portal of the Dead Universe, and the portal being a river that grew in tide, eventually dragged Nightbeat in and revived him.

8) Nova, even back in Revelations, appeared to have connections to the outside world through agents of Jhiaxus. He even had access to Nightbeat's and Kup's memories, who both lived through all the Primes. Sentinel, even though he was an extension of the Senate and almost fully under their control, was still an official Prime.

9) I think it was explained a couple of issues ago that Shockwave/Bombshell transplanted Megatron's transwarp technology into this new body. They even used that energy to bring Galvatron to this world some issues ago.

10) I guess Metroplex was aware of whatever was going on inside him, and when the time was right [ie rejuvenated], basically run some anti-virus programme that fried whomever didn't have the Autobot code within him.

11) Not getting out because of their undead status was an issue, yes. AHM 15 made Galvatron so strong he immunized Scourge and Cyclonus, and in turn immunized Jhiaxus. Furthermore, thanks to the massive reboot of Cybertron in Chaos, Cyclonus got his spark back [as detailed in Remain in Light], so you could say Jhiaxus did as well.

Or, even Nova, who didn't get out, got over those effects in Heart of Darkness, similar to Megatron.

I'm only asking if you read the past issues because some questions [Megatron's space bridge, Nightbeat] were flat out said so a couple of months ago ;)

Red Dave Prime
2014-02-13, 06:47 PM
Have being reading it but I'll be honest I havent been paying it as much attention as I normally would. Not to do with the comic but more to do with outside issues not giving me a huge amount of time.

Those are great, plausible answers from both of you guys - i still find some of it flakey but it just about hangs together enough to overlook little wobbles. I do feel that the Nova / Glavatron arc has been a bit shit so it may be why I dont buy into it as much as other bits. Galvatron just feels completely out of character with how furman or costa wrote him and it just makes the character pointless.

I also dont buy the rejuvination of him - when he disintergrated in chaos I thought it was done at that point to emphasis that he had unwittingly destroyed the universe (he thought he was working against the d-void). It seems odd that the matrix or vectar sigma would recreate him back in the dead universe.

Still dont get the metroplex thumb thing - so there was some ore stuff in there, fair enough. Megatron could sense it, fair enough. Its enough to rejuvinate him so that he can destroy another titan filled with both that ore and possible others? Hmmm.

But to be fair, I've made similar leaps of logic with other comics and I think Dark Cybertron is interesting enough to justify it. Very glad that Shockwave looks to be taken centre stage agains. I really didnt like the Nova / Galva angle (did I mention that already :) )

Cheers again though to both Terome and Knightdramon - both excellent responses.

Knightdramon
2014-02-13, 07:27 PM
I think Metroplex's thumb had come into contact with a cleansing ore or something.

It's not like it was a superpowerful ore, but something that was just right in battling the death ore.

Or it was a simple ore, which, in combination with Metroplex's dormant ore from the rust sea he was in, resulted in that.

Much like how Dead Universe portal ore + resurrection ore = Necrotitan or something.

:up:

Terome
2014-02-13, 07:58 PM
Looking at it another way, it might be that Megatron bridged to Earth, picked up a shipment of Ore-13, put it in the thumb, bridged back to Cybertron and gave it to Metroplex. I'm not sure if that makes more sense or less.

inflatable dalek
2014-02-13, 09:13 PM
Metroplex is seemingly already coated in at least one Ore, one of the planets on the screens showing where all the Ores were is a straight lift of art from a previous issue of the Mysterious Unnamed World (it's going to be Earth isn't it?) the Lost Light found him on.

Overall, probably the best issue by far to date. Stuff happened! Not always completely logical stuff, but I guess having watched the '86 film so recently I'm slightly numbed to nonsensical McGuffin's at the moment.

Just look at the difference from the last part, which had lots of characters standing around talking at each other that- however entertaining- never felt like there was any sense of urgency to it (indeed, anyone reading last week could be forgiven for forgetting that there was supposed to be a giant monster stomping around the place). Here the action and the talking are working hand in hand properly for the first time throughout the comic. And it's about time. If the series had had this sort of pace from the start, it would have been over in six issues.

Nice to see Livio get to draw some of the nuts widescreen stuff that more suits his talents as well, the I AM OPTIMUS PRIME bit was cheesier than an unwashed penis but still worked pretty well.

The main bad point was Bumblebee continuing to deserve a horrible death. I mean, this was what, the forth time he's had a "Stepping up to the plate" moment since he became leader back in the Costa days? And personally, I don't associate "Trying to throttle your second in command" with "Becoming an appropriate Autobot leader", I can't see Optimus Prime, or even cartoon Rodimus doing that to anyone for the heinous crime of being... well sensible.

No, that's more the sort of thing cartoon Megatron would do to Starscream. Word to the wise Bumblebee: If you want to be a good Autobot leader, just try to be less like Megatron than Megatron is being. That's a place to start from.

A more minor niggle, but at this is no less that the third time Nova and the Dead Universe have been finished off it was hard to care that much as no doubt he'll be back again in two years. And I still don't know how to reconcile his stated aim of making the Universe like Cybertron and unleashing the Dead Universe upon it.

Still, overall good enough for me to be actually confident we'll be heading into a much better final than I'd have expected at the start of the year.

Terome
2014-02-13, 10:03 PM
Mysterious Unnamed World (it's going to be Earth isn't it?) the Lost Light found him on.

Oh snakes. That is so very certainly the case.

The main bad point was Bumblebee continuing to deserve a horrible death. I mean, this was what, the forth time he's had a "Stepping up to the plate" moment since he became leader back in the Costa days? And personally, I don't associate "Trying to throttle your second in command" with "Becoming an appropriate Autobot leader", I can't see Optimus Prime, or even cartoon Rodimus doing that to anyone for the heinous crime of being... well sensible.

I understand that nobody can realistically complete that 'becoming a leader' character arc while Prime is elephanting around but the sensible way to get around that would be to not focus on the leaders. How much better would Robots In Disguise have been if Bumblebee had been a line-an-issue character and the focus instead was on, say, Wheeljack? Everyone liked Wheeljack and he was allowed to be interesting. Or Jazz. Jazz is a great character and has a lot of strings to his bow. You could have the same plot of Bumblebee never quite getting a handle on things but it wouldn't be so boring to sit through.

A more minor niggle, but at this is no less that the third time Nova and the Dead Universe have been finished off it was hard to care that much as no doubt he'll be back again in two years. And I still don't know how to reconcile his stated aim of making the Universe like Cybertron and unleashing the Dead Universe upon it.

I can believe that Nova isn't coming back from this as he had absolutely no role to play dramatically other than to give Orion a half-way sensible reason to call himself Optimus Prime again. He was an intriguing presence in the flashbacks but as a villain there's nothing he can do that wasn't already breezed over in Revelation.

Or it was a simple ore, which, in combination with Metroplex's dormant ore from the rust sea he was in, resulted in that.

Much like how Dead Universe portal ore + resurrection ore = Necrotitan or something.

Shockwave is an avid Doodle God player.

Red Dave Prime
2014-02-13, 10:48 PM
Dear god let this be the end of Nova. As a villain he was kinda interesting when he first appeared and as revelations wore on he got sillier and then Heart of Darkness really peed all over him. This has been better but he really is a nothing bad guy. His shinning moment was the Rid annual.

Jazz is a great character and has a lot of strings to his bow

If that was intentional, I like what you did there.

Regarding the bee, I just find he is a character who shouldnt be in charge. It never makes much sense why the autobots put up with him - he aint big, he aint strong, he aint intelligent, he may be likeable but its been kinda stated that autobots tend to gravitate to the more in-yer-face type heros - Grimlock, Optimus, Springer. And while they may have given him one chance at this point the little fecker has made such a mess of the Autobots, he's rivaling Starscream for the "oops, did it again" award.

it would have been over in six issues.

When you think of how much time and page has been put into Dark Cybertron as a whole... And not because it needed it.

Pad Pad Pad...

Terome
2014-02-13, 10:59 PM
It's a time machine! The wibbly ball thing with the wires - it's the time machine from Turmoil's ship.

Makes sense. Shockwave's been making a lot of time puns lately. Back when he had Megatron on the slab he talked about making equity for the Autobots 'for all time.'

If that was intentional, I like what you did there.

Oh yeah! Ho ho!

Regarding the bee, I just find he is a character who shouldnt be in charge. It never makes much sense why the autobots put up with him - he aint big, he aint strong, he aint intelligent, he may be likeable but its been kinda stated that autobots tend to gravitate to the more in-yer-face type heros - Grimlock, Optimus, Springer. And while they may have given him one chance at this point the little fecker has made such a mess of the Autobots, he's rivaling Starscream for the "oops, did it again" award.

It's not a bad idea but it is one that was mined out almost immediately. It's drawn too much focus and Transformers as a franchise concerns itself far far too much with who is the leader. Leaders have stressful, boring jobs.

inflatable dalek
2014-02-14, 07:49 AM
I did like how the writers sensibly clarified that not all the Ores worked, thus saving the inevitably slightly desperate coming up with effects for all 14 of them. Life, Death, Time and Ressurection are easy, but by the time you've gotten to the 8th one it's be "A slight sense of ennui" and "The cure for short sightedness". To be honest, "Makes things cold" is pushing it a bit as it is.

Red Dave Prime
2014-02-14, 07:59 AM
Now you have me hoping for a comedy mtmte issue where they discover ore 420 - the one woth the mellow buzz.

Wonder will we find out who made the wooden robot - had assumed it wws linked to shockers but maybe not.

inflatable dalek
2014-02-14, 08:56 AM
Maybe there's an Ore that will make Scoop shut the **** up? Or is that beyond even Shockwave's power?

Knightdramon
2014-02-14, 10:24 AM
Wonder will we find out who made the wooden robot - had assumed it wws linked to shockers but maybe not.

Probably is.

Pretty much everything in this continuity is linked to Shockwave.

I'm willing to bet the symbol ship is his. I think it was said that Shockwave made away with Grimlock at the end of LSOTW, if I remember correctly then I'm certain the ship is his.

Red Dave Prime
2014-02-14, 01:38 PM
Yeah, thought that myself.

We still have the whole time travel / displacement to sort out - given that we had one major issue of RiD with that centre stage I figure it has to come into effect at some point (and what a great way to completely mess with continuity without doing an official re-boot?)

Terome
2014-02-15, 04:47 PM
I do wonder about that symbol ship. Perhaps in time gone by it was earmarked as Shockwave's but there aren't many hoops that need to be jumped through to make it belong to MTMTE's Next Big Villain. Grimlock could have been offloaded to anyone at any time.

Skyquake87
2014-02-18, 08:35 PM
Well, I am glad I read this thread. Having not read HoD or much of the Costa stuff, I have largely not had much clue as what this DU stuff is all about. Its all so woolly and impenetrable to casual readers like me (I only buy MTMTE on a regular basis so have no idea what else has been going on since I gave up with IDW after the end of AHM). I find the art doesn't lend itself to clearly showing what is going on. Ramondelli's art is so dark and the characters all look like shoeboxes that I find its hard to tell whom is talking to whom. Griffith needs to lay his pages out better - frequently key plot points are squeezed into a tiny panel at the bottom of the page and -weirdly - the colouring is a bit over excited and all the explosions and effects from that obscure some of the characters.

Although chapters 8 & 9 have seen a huge upswing in momentum and something approaching a point to all this, I'm just not excited or that interested in it. It seems to be an event for the sake of itself, not because things have felt like they've been building to this.

Terome
2014-02-18, 09:20 PM
Well, I am glad I read this thread. Having not read HoD or much of the Costa stuff, I have largely not had much clue as what this DU stuff is all about. Its all so woolly and impenetrable to casual readers like me (I only buy MTMTE on a regular basis so have no idea what else has been going on since I gave up with IDW after the end of AHM). I find the art doesn't lend itself to clearly showing what is going on. Ramondelli's art is so dark and the characters all look like shoeboxes that I find its hard to tell whom is talking to whom. Griffith needs to lay his pages out better - frequently key plot points are squeezed into a tiny panel at the bottom of the page and -weirdly - the colouring is a bit over excited and all the explosions and effects from that obscure some of the characters.

Although chapters 8 & 9 have seen a huge upswing in momentum and something approaching a point to all this, I'm just not excited or that interested in it. It seems to be an event for the sake of itself, not because things have felt like they've been building to this.

That's kind of damning considering that this cross-over is aimed at people in your situation. I'd thought they were doing a decent job of only dealing with concepts they'd introduced within the series but it seems I was blurring the lines in my mind.

zigzagger
2014-02-27, 04:08 AM
Transformers: More Than Meets The Eye #27: Dark Cybertron Part 10 (of 12) three-page preview @ TFW2005 (http://www.tfw2005.com/transformers-news/comics-16/transformers-more-than-meets-the-eye-27-dark-cybertron-part-10-preview-179384/).

Full preview due sometime closer to the release date. Stay tuned.

Unicron
2014-02-27, 04:35 AM
Ok, I still can't tell what Shockwave is up to. From his description I can't tell if he's planning to absorb all that stuff and become a god, if he's making the Infinity Gauntlet, searching for the Anti-Life Equation, or if he's discovered the Colonel's eleven secret herbs and spices.

And yet again, Shockwave and Jhiaxus are responsible for frikken everything in IDW. Seriously? I'm now officially waiting for the reveal that they're what took a chunk out of Crankcase's head or why Swerve is now short.

Also... that cover. Screw the actual content of the issue, just give me those characters hanging around in a bar.

Red Dave Prime
2014-03-10, 01:09 PM
Full preview link thanks to tfw2005:

http://www.tfw2005.com/transformers-news/comics-16/transformers-more-than-meets-the-eye-27-dark-cybertron-part-10-full-preview-179446/

Love the big splash panel but I cant believe the turn around with the Autobots and Megatron. Looking forward to wednesday, looks like the big reveal is coming up

inflatable dalek
2014-03-12, 04:38 PM
NOW OUT AND READ SPOILERS AHOY.


























Hmm. The character stuff was all great (though I think the "Prowl is a dick" thing is going too far now, he was needlessly OTT to Chromedome but equally it's not like he hasn't been going through some shit himself), the Blurr gag was a bit obvious but still fairly funny and I'm really liking the cheerful Constructicons.

A minor niggle is the book is trying too hard to push Megatron's forthcoming change of team, that's two issues in a row where he's had lengthy "I'm nicer than you think" speeches and it does feel a bit as if this could have perhaps been seeded a bit more evenly throughout the series. Loved Ratchet's reaction to him though.

However, I did find the final reveal of what Shockwave's been reeeaaaaaaaaaaaaaaallllllllly up to somewhat underwhelming. First, because it owes a lot to some of the sillier RTD era Who season finals (Shockwave might as well be played by Timothy Dalton), but mainly for two other reasons:

1: Shockwave plans to use the time machine to create the Dead Universe as a mean of stealing energy for Cybertron's present... OK, to a degree that makes sense. But that means Shockwave is indeed now firmly retroactively behind everything the IDW continuity has been about. We didn't know how lucky we were when Dreamwave only had him behind things that had happened after he was created.

[Though if the good guys beat him, presumably the Dead Universe won't be created and none of the last nine years worth of comics will have happened. Soft reboot ahead?]

2: What exactly is he going to get out of causing the "End of time... itself!" as the Daltonator might put it? He's going to trap Cybertron in a constant never ending "Now" with no past or future, how is that logical and how is it to the advantage of the species? Is he just a loon now or am I badly misunderstanding?

Actually, what's Jhiaxus getting out of helping to create the Dead Universe, a place that has been nothing but bad news for him? If he's always been working towards this, why did he seem to be trying really hard to help destroy our Universe back in Revelation?

Oh, and will Scoop please **** off.

Cyclonus and his singing is intriguing as well, and I loved the Brainstorm bit as always.

Auntie Slag
2014-03-12, 04:44 PM
Just looking at the splash page preview; who is the Trailbreaker-looking guy stretchering Megatron on the bottom left of the page? (Trailbreaker/cutter is on the right with some of the other Lost Light crew).

inflatable dalek
2014-03-12, 04:46 PM
The Decepticon medic guy? Fasttrack IIRC?

Auntie Slag
2014-03-12, 04:57 PM
Blimey, never heard of him! A quick check of the TF Wiki says he was mates with Blurr and then joined the Decepticons... although the way its written suggests they're not entirely sure if we're referring to the same Fasttrack. There seem to be a few of them.

Thanks!

Unicron
2014-03-12, 05:04 PM
Just looking at the splash page preview; who is the Trailbreaker-looking guy stretchering Megatron on the bottom left of the page? (Trailbreaker/cutter is on the right with some of the other Lost Light crew).

The Decepticon medic guy? Fasttrack IIRC?

Flatline (http://tfwiki.net/wiki/Flatline_(G1)), actually.

Auntie Slag
2014-03-12, 05:18 PM
Cheers Unicron :-)

Hey Dalek, I thought you knew about Transformures? ;)

Unicron
2014-03-12, 07:06 PM
No problem. Honestly I had no idea who it was either, what with not having actually read RID or Dark Cybertron yet (gonna pick up the trades for DC eventually). Somewhere in the TFW2005 thread for the preview, there's a post tagging everyone in the big splash page.

inflatable dalek
2014-03-12, 07:11 PM
Cheers Unicron :-)

Hey Dalek, I thought you knew about Transformures? ;)

Says the man who can't get Slug's name right in his own name! ;)

Auntie Slag
2014-03-12, 07:33 PM
No need to get arcee about it!

Knightdramon
2014-03-12, 07:37 PM
2: What exactly is he going to get out of causing the "End of time... itself!" as the Daltonator might put it? He's going to trap Cybertron in a constant never ending "Now" with no past or future, how is that logical and how is it to the advantage of the species? Is he just a loon now or am I badly misunderstanding?

Actually, what's Jhiaxus getting out of helping to create the Dead Universe, a place that has been nothing but bad news for him? If he's always been working towards this, why did he seem to be trying really hard to help destroy our Universe back in Revelation?



The way I read it, he'll essentially immortalize Cybertron and their power sources forever through him. His main worry as a Senator was the limited resources they had, and it's been made explicit [especially in MTMTE] that bots in other star systems are using poor placebos for energon.

By constantly feeding Cybertron energy through a loop, he undoes that need.

While Jhiaxus seems like a mastermind and a puppeteer, he's more like a puppet. I think he greatly feared and/or respected [more like feared] Nova and Galvatron to stand up to THEIR plan, and he's been out of a position of power for too long to try and stand up to Shockwave. Never mind that thanks to millenia of upgrades and so on, Shockwave can take on Jhiaxus one-handed [no pun intended], possibly along with Bludgeon.

inflatable dalek
2014-03-12, 08:01 PM
The way I read it, he'll essentially immortalize Cybertron and their power sources forever through him. His main worry as a Senator was the limited resources they had, and it's been made explicit [especially in MTMTE] that bots in other star systems are using poor placebos for energon.

But stealing energy from the Dead Universe via time travel from before it was the Dead Universe in order to create the Dead Universe takes care of the energy problem (surely the Transformers can't use up the power of an entire Universe?), what does the end of time thing achieve? Other than showing off?

Red Dave Prime
2014-03-12, 11:24 PM
Wasnt too fussed about this issue. There's some nice moments with the regulars but the Dark Cybertron thing is feeling a bit lame and has over stayed its welcome at this point.

I dunno, Shockwaves plan seems far, far too elaborate for its own good. For a start if the idea was to save cybertron why not let everyone know from the off hand? Hell, he can still keep some of the better ores secret if he wants to betray them. Cant see a single Cybertronain being bothered by Shockwave grabbing energy from the dead universe to keep Cybertron going.

And the end reveal of Shockwaves army? These are the same guys who couldnt kill a guy who whirl took down in seconds and have been routinely getting their asses handed to them every time we have seen them. Ok, 70 billion is a lot but the extra numbers didnt exactly help them against the lost light crew. Also - why does he even bother with cybertron if he could simply set up a world with the ammonites and becoming their god? The tech could be recreated on another world (going by Gorlan Prime) and it cant be sentimentality for Shockwave.

I'm sure it will all just about make sense in the end and there's a certain impressiveness in how everything is just about tying in together but its one hell of an over egged pudding. The cast list has been needlessly big and several characters that should have gotten a bit of spotlight have been nowhere because there was a need to justify having both the main casts of RID and MTMTE. Bludgeon has been wasted to the point of why bother and Metalhawk has the most flimsy turnabout from siding with the bad guy to now feeling Shockwaves gone too far (no problem with raising a dead titan and destroying half of Iacon though)

Also - Scoop. Seriously, why?

The Megatron thing bothers me a lot. Fine, he has somewhat seen the light. Fine, the Autobots appreciate that he saved the day. But he is still the guy who plunged their planet into a 4 million year long war and butchered many of the autobots colleagues. I find it hard to buy how any of the head autobots can even speak to the guy let alone team up with him. I'll give Ratchet a let-off given he's a medic but Bumblebee? A few days ago (in story ville) Megatron crushed his face.

Ah, I've ranted enough. Not bad but the return to a single MTMTE comic cant come soon enough.

Phase Sixer
2014-03-14, 04:01 AM
This story still is all over the place

I mean unless prime and rodimus are supposed to be in the dead universe to stop shockwave, what was the point of having prime and company in the DU? I mean we have learned absolutely nothing new about dead universe we didn't already know. (Except the fact that nova lives in a fortress shaped like his head) And the reality that this story tells is that nothing can be done from the DU. So if nova does kill prime, what then? He still can't get out, shockwaves plan was never as he put it to restore some ancient royalty to the thrown. Which really makes all the DU parts pointless at this moment. And honestly what happens to prime and company if both nova and Galvatron make it thru the space bridge? Who would care that they are there?

Shockwaves plan is like, ok? What exactly is changing the universe so there is no past or future or whatever and have the all the energies of the universe converse on cybertron is actually going to achieve what? Does this mean no one in the universe exists? Planets like earth and nebulous or any planets for that matter what happens on these worlds? I mean ten issues and this is the plan. This is what jhiaxus would allow the student to become the master for and go along with?

This Megatron, I just simply don't like, Megatron talking with bumblebee? Feeling remorse? Megatron? Who would happily wade thru dead autobots chest deep just to kill the last one? And now this? This is bad comedy

And don't get me started on Metalhawk, jeez is he with the nails? Is he with autobots? Is he with shockwave? I mean we have no explanation for him, he wakes up and is suddenly on shockwaves side, he was DEAD, and awoke in a zombie like trance, but now he has his own mind. Is it just ok to change a character just to fit your story at the moment?

The character bits are good, like prowl and chrome dome exchange and Magnus, the swerve and blurr bit was good, but other than that it's all over the place, here's hoping the last 2 issues make some sense of things

Terome
2014-03-15, 01:21 AM
Largely agree with the general direction of this thread - lots of good bits and satisfying moments but the morass of the plot (Metalhawk, Scoop, Shockwave's big reveal) sucks it down in a frustrating way.

I'd agree that Megatron's about-face is somewhat sudden but I suppose it's going to have to happen one way or another. I do quite like him teamed up with Bumblebee too.

Knightdramon
2014-03-15, 09:06 AM
Guys...isn't it obvious that Metalhawk was faking being with Shockwave, just to get an idea of what's going on?

The thing with Megatron is a tad ridiculous in that he was walking around, killing Autobots and nearly killing Bumblebee just a day ago. Literally, a day ago.

He has a history of teaming up with Autobots when the danger is too high, but this is kind of taken to the extremes.

Unicron
2014-03-15, 06:40 PM
The thing with Megatron is a tad ridiculous in that he was walking around, killing Autobots and nearly killing Bumblebee just a day ago. Literally, a day ago.

He has a history of teaming up with Autobots when the danger is too high, but this is kind of taken to the extremes.

Yeah, it's a bit ridiculous. I guess those couple of hours he spent locked up in Wheeljack's magic bubble gave him time to reflect on his actions, leading to this change of heart.
That or it's part of his newest scheme of the week.

They probably came up with the 'Megatron goes good' too late to seed the idea in RID, which seems like another sign of how much that comic was stalling for time. It's why I'm glad Roberts is going to be the one handling Megatron after this is over. We should get a good explanation that way.

Knightdramon
2014-03-15, 07:28 PM
We're already getting him written by Roberts. It read like Roberts' writing.

The problem with DC, as I've repeatedly said, is that apparently RID spent the past 5-6 months building up to it, while MTMTE did its own thing, hence why RID seems so...disjointed in comparison.

With the interviews and all that, it seems as if DC was decided veeeery early into the series, so it still comes as a surprise as to why there are various obvious errors here and there.

Furthermore, it appears as if lots of these issues were drawn at the same time by different artists altogether, because whenever an artist changes or something, there are discrepancies here and there.

zigzagger
2014-03-18, 01:13 AM
Transformers: Robots In Disguise #27: Dark Cybertron Part 11 (of 12) preview @ Newsarama (http://www.newsarama.com/20591-transformers-previews-dark-cybertron-penultimate-issue-regeneration-one-finale.html).

zigzagger
2014-03-18, 01:15 AM
Oh...

And the preview for Regeneration One #100 is in there too, for those who are paying attention.


Me, I'm looking forward to next month.

Unicron
2014-03-18, 05:10 AM
Hmm... that flashback in the DC preview... definitely raises some questions.

Knightdramon
2014-03-18, 08:13 AM
If I didn't know these were written way in advance, I'd say that the entire flashback scene is to just counter my point about Hardhead already being dead when Nova "dissolved" him some issues ago, hence it should not affect him.

Red Dave Prime
2014-03-19, 12:28 PM
Not a brilliant issue but I did like the feeling of "epic" going on here. The cast list is huge and while we are only now getting some action with the liks of monstroctor and Bludgeon, it still works in setting a real doomsday feel. Shockwaves plan is still a bit "huh?". I think I get the idea but why, even a logic focused mind, would think that it was a desirable goal is eluding me (maybe I'm just missing something)

So we're set up for the grand finish and while i cant say I've loved Dark Cybertron its been alright in parts.

Now for a spoiler prediction

This seemed obvious to me but I'm curious if others saw it the same because on another webpage, they didnt so I could be super wrong.

Brainstorm is dead and has been dead since the little "incident" at the start of the issues flashback occured (it happens before he joins the lost light). This explains why he was working on the dead universe insect-thingies (they can be seen in his lab back in issue #3 of MTMTE).
In effect, he is a member of the Dead Universe like the others which is why his body is used as a bridge in this issue.

Also, it makes me think that Brainstorms suitcase is holding a surrogate spark of some sort. Not a spark, but something to replace it (a bit like Iron Mans heart thingey) this would explain why the Sparkeater ignored him.

It may also be behind his reasoning to join the crew of the lost light in the first place.

And it adds a new dimension as to why Brainstorms mind was blown at the thought of putting a green spark into the suitcase.

Anyway, those are my theories.

Rack 'n Ruin
2014-03-19, 02:04 PM
I think your theories sound very plausible. I look forward to seeing this story develop in MTMTE Season 2.

Knightdramon
2014-03-19, 10:06 PM
Given what we know now, I think the sparkeater ignored him because there was no spark at all to go after.

But this raises more questions...if he was indeed dead, why did the killswitch have an effect? What did it have an effect on?

Unicron
2014-03-19, 10:35 PM
Maybe he has a spark that is still able to be affected by the killswitch, but it's corrupted and reads as dead to anything that would scan for life. Like the scanner in the flashback, the sparkeater, the scanners on the RodPod when they were in Metroplex. I don't think we ever got a solid explanation of how the whole dead but animated thing worked. Cue a few panels of explanation next issue.

I question whether he knew he was dead though. He studies the Dead Universe, so the insect things may have nothing to do with his condition. Plus the reaction to the Sparkeater. If he knew he was dead, he would have had nothing to fear.

Red Dave Prime
2014-03-19, 11:46 PM
The killswitch was aimed at forged or non-forged - its possible that the surrogate spark (or whtever) is based on Brainstorms original spark.

As for the sparkeater, well it may not have been able to eat his spark but it stillc could have removed his brain.

Still, I am only guessing here so its possible that I am very wrong about things

inflatable dalek
2014-03-21, 02:20 PM
Oh Dark Cybertron Chapter 11, you didn't have to get me a late valentines day present in order to make me love you again, but killing that little git Bumblebee was nearly as good as a blow job.

Though I'm really not sure "**** yeah!" was intended to be the reaction it engendered. now, if only Scoop, Ratttrap and Metalhawk (who wasn't faking to get close to the enemy after all, he's just a dick) could take part in some sort of elaborate suicide pact.

Overall, with all the really dumb exposition done in part 10, it looks as if the decks are clear for a nice straightforward balls to the wall action final, which is probably a good thing. One of the problems with the final issue of Reg was devoting so much page count to its worryingly similar and equally nonsensical explanation for what the hell is going on there, if you're going to base your story around a really stupid premise it seems to be a good idea not to burden the climax with it.

Well, actually it's a good idea not to base your story around a really stupid premise, but this is a close second.

After an improvement in the second half I do think the stumble with part 10 and the fact Shockwave's plan is basically nonsense (and feels like the two authors are bandying words like "Universe" and "Time" just because they sound cool rather than they have any idea what they mean) does mean even if the last issue is just non-stop brilliant we'll be looking at something that, at best, was just sort of OK. Which is a shame.

It's actually interesting to compare Shockwave's plan to Tyrest's. Both are basically mad (however an ill fit that is for Shockwave you pretty much have to roll with it to even accept the basic idea of his plan), but the execution of their stories were very different.

What Tyrest wanted to do was evil and insane, but you could see the internal logic his twisted mind went through to arrive at that place. He was a man who thought X, wanted to achieve Y in order to get it and put Z in progress so as to achieve it. You could follow his motivation and how he ended up where he was.

With Shockwave, I do not have even the slightest idea how in the hell he's going to get anything out of the destruction of the Universe (even erasing it from ever having happened in the first place? My eyes are bleeding), nor the freezing of everyone on Cybertron in one moment of time. I mean, he's a scientist, what's he going to get out of no more science?

The plan to create the Dead Universe by draining its energy through time travel would actually make more that enough sense as the reason for his plotting without ending time thrown in as well. Even if it were to repower Cybertron, the Autobots would be opposed in principal as he'll have effectively destroyed the "Normal" Universe that would have come into being if the Dead Universe had never been created, cause the greatest potential genocide ever. You could even get the Decepticons on side with the whole "Shockwave's lost it thing" by revealing what he's going to do will actually destroy Cybertron, after all, an entire Universe would have far more power than one planet could ever, ever use.

Knightdramon
2014-03-21, 08:37 PM
Did I read it wrong, or am I the only person that understood Shockwave's plan? :lol:

He'll basically drain energy from the DU and continue draining it forever [since time will erase, or sth], so that Cybertron will be forever locked in a state of infinite energy flowing.

It's basically a very perverted way of solving the energy crisis he discovered when he was much younger.

And the opening panels with the melding of time and Shockwave through it make me think that in next week's book, he'll have a momentary lapse because his pre-empurata self will take over, allowing Pax and Megatron a moment to kill him.

Called it. You read it here first people. :lol:

inflatable dalek
2014-03-21, 09:12 PM
But they can't drain the energy of the Dead Universe forever if Time Ends, because "Forever" is still a concept that needs time to work.

I can see the energy grabbing thing as his motivation, but trying to END TIME ITSELF makes no sense as a motivation for him.

Unless we just go with him being mad and his entire plot is madness for the sake of madness, but as that's what he's been working towards since even before Chaos Theory, that makes Shockwave a loon since we first met him.

Oh, and a small shame, it would have been nice if Shockwave's flashbacks to his past life had included at least one moment we hadn't seen before, it's not like this is a TV show where characters are only allowed to wibble wobble back to events from previous episodes and never, ever, remember anything else.

Terome
2014-03-21, 10:21 PM
Shockwave's plot also bears a striking resemblance to a Shortpacked! idea from a few years ago...

I'm feeling more charitable in that I think it does make sense but the problem is that Shockwave really doesn't think the way he would have to in order for it to fit. He's acting like a robot from a 50s science fiction story who, charged with the directive to protect people, lobotomises all humans so that they never get out of their chairs. Shockwave has never been so literal-minded and selfless until now.

I've been thinking about Megatron and the things he is turning around in his brain and I realised that we have probably seen every meaningful conversation he's had with another character in this part of his life on page. I got the impression in Infiltration that he hadn't spoken to anyone for at least a hundred years - he'd been running around putting out fires by executing traitors, something that is retroactively quite desperate since he has a super-team to do that for him.

After nearly murdering his best friend he has his first chat with Prime in forever, nearly murders him too, but fails so badly that he tries to murder Earth for no good reason. Then when that goes tits up he throws every military asset he has at what turned out to be quite a poor plan to stamp out the Autobots forever and for his trouble was told exactly what an idiot he was by Starscream and then shot in the head. After three years stewing, Starscream has ruined everything and, on a wing and a prayer, he throws himself into some sort of protracted suicide bid and by the time Prime talks to him in Omega Supreme he has obviously lost the plot. Cue another weird suicide attempt against all his followers standing on each other's shoulders, a few months walking around a wasteland with no one to talk to and a quick capture and defeat by Wheeljack. Next thing he knows, Shockwave is taunting him with how insanely together he is and people are jumping out of his chest and tearing him in two. Then Bumblebee talks to him and, while the things he says are kind of obvious, this is the sum total of people Megatron has spoken to properly in the entire time we've known him:
Starscream
Prime
Starscream again
Three years with his head blown off
Starscream, in a BDSM kind of way,
Prime, in Chaos Theory, where he was goading him into executing him (and succeeded, though Omega Supreme intervened)
Shockwave, briefly
Bumblebee

I'm discounting toadies like Soundwave and Bombshell because they don't talk much and certainly wouldn't tell Megatron anything he didn't want to hear.
Prime wants to get to the bottom of Megatron. Starscream has his own weird thing going on. Shockwave is either playing him, ignoring him or telling him he's otherwise useless. Bumblebee is the only person who has been in a position to point out the obvious and give him stick for it.

I like it. It's a lot more natural than what I'd originally thought.

And the opening panels with the melding of time and Shockwave through it make me think that in next week's book, he'll have a momentary lapse because his pre-empurata self will take over, allowing Pax and Megatron a moment to kill him.

Called it. You read it here first people.

Good call. 'Unstuck psychologically' indeed.

Man, Jhiaxus has had a stunning run of being totally unremarkable and forgettable, hasn't he?

Finally, I would like Skids to be okay. There I said it.

Unicron
2014-03-22, 01:29 AM
And the opening panels with the melding of time and Shockwave through it make me think that in next week's book, he'll have a momentary lapse because his pre-empurata self will take over, allowing Pax and Megatron a moment to kill him.

Called it. You read it here first people. :lol:

Seems the most likely, yeah. If it's not that, then I think the most likely option is Jhiaxus betrays him in a bid to steal the power for himself and get's taken down in the process. Horribly cliché, but I wouldn't be surprised.
And like I guessed back near the start of this whole thing, I'm still expecting that the whole 'save the day' plan will somehow involve the destruction of Bumblebee's Matrix half.

inflatable dalek
2014-03-22, 01:23 PM
Megatron will distract Shockwave at a crucial moment with his sexy legs.

Terome
2014-03-22, 02:51 PM
Rumour is that Megatron's sexy legs will be heading up RID Season 2 while his boring old torso will be the one starring in MTMTE.

inflatable dalek
2014-03-22, 02:54 PM
It will be the greatest comic of all time if Shockwave is defeated because he needed two hands to hold something at a crucial moment. "I now regret my choice of this gun arm!" could be his last words as he falls into the pit from that Dreamwave mini-series.

Terome
2014-03-22, 02:56 PM
At the bottom of that pit should be some tar floating on top of a swamp.

Then a volcano erupts!

zigzagger
2014-03-24, 05:42 PM
Transformers: Dark Cybertron Finale full preview @ Newsarama (http://www.newsarama.com/20651-transformers-dark-cybertron-finale-preview-brings-all-out-action.html).

Red Dave Prime
2014-03-25, 02:00 AM
For all its faults, it would appear that Dark Cybertron is going to have a pretty decent final issue. Art looks very nice so far and there's plenty of little pockets going on. I suppose that sums the series up - as a whole its been nothing of note but there have been enough pieces that have entertained to make it worthwhile.

Skyquake87
2014-03-25, 08:47 AM
As I'm behind all you up-to -the-minute kids, I only picked this up yesterday. Best issue of the crossover , if only because Shockers' plan is revealed. Okay its a bit 'he's doing what now?' , but at least its there. Sadly, its given out in a HUGE infodump which comics gave up on a long time ago (seriously, most mainstream comics gave up on the 'my evil plan' speeches in the 1990s). It would have made this crossover a damn sight more interesting to have Shockwave's plan laid out from the start and the ramifications explored throughout the crossover instead of cramming it in in the last three issues - what have been reading the rest of this crossover for? The dull as ditch water bumbling about on Cybertron with Starscream - his apparent significant other Rattrap (really?) and the spouting prophecies in lieu of a personality Scoop? I could have done without all that - or at least something interesting happening!

Elsewhere, some nice character stuff abounds - mainly with the MTMTE characters and mainly because Roberts has properly fleshed them out so I'm at the very elast interested in what they're up to. As I've missed out on what Megs has been up to, I quite liked seeing him as a wiser, older, reflective character. It worked well for me harking back to the hot blooded thinker that we saw in those two good issues of Chaos (also written by Roberts) and also fitted in with Roche's groovy Spotlight. But that might just be me. I just like seeing Megatron have some proper characterisation and motivation other than just shooting people and ten being undone by his own hand and written out of the comics for years at a time.

The stuff in the DU with Pax and chums seemed utterly pointless and hasn't really gone anywhere. It was just so Pax could reclaim the name Optimus Prime. Well big woo. Still not getting the sense of breath taking awe from Raviolli's art either. Its far too murky, blocky and poorly proportioned for me to get any enjoyment out of. Being digitally painted or whatever isn't enough of a draw for me, I'm afraid.

inflatable dalek
2014-03-26, 03:05 PM
OUT NOW, SPOLIERS TO FOLLOW.
























OK, that worked. This series has been all over the place in terms of quality, but that was a really good final (even if Shockwave's plan still made no sense. Also, did a black hole open up at the centre of Cybertron at the end? Was no one worried by that?).

Yes, how Shockwave fell was pretty much as predicted as a Darth Vadar moment, but how it was done still had that nice little twist that it wasn't just Optimus going "Remember that time you performed sneaky surgery on me to prepare me for you nefarious goals the bench!" but Megatron threw himself in there, and actually brought something unexpected to the speechifying by breaking Shockwave's resolve with just a symbol. Very neatly done.

And after it felt as if the set up for it was trying just a Bit To Hard, Megatron's side switch actually felt fairly organic at the end, though it's more the fall out (and new Decepticon leader Galvatron) that's really interesting.

Soundwave's wounded reaction was unexpected and very well done as well.

With Bumblebee and Metalhawk gone (and I don't think Scoop was acounted for was he?) that's a lot of my annoyances with RID thrown out an airlock as well, here's hoping Rattrap can step on a landmine or something before the next issue.

Not a huge amount else you can really dig into indepth here, but as a BIG action issue, it did pretty much push all the right buttons.

One funny thing about this crossover is you've been really able to tell which of the toys they've been asked to include have held any interest for the two authors, Tankor having been the worst off to date, but Starscream and Jhiaxus actually calling each other's new toys terrible is all sorts of meta.

Warcry
2014-03-26, 03:40 PM
So now that the whole thing is done, what's the verdict? Does the decent ending make it worth going back and slogging through the silly early chapters? Or should I just read the last issue or two so that I'm primed to pick up the story in MTMTE when the actual plot starts up again?

Red Dave Prime
2014-03-26, 04:25 PM
@ Warcry

Price would define this. Its 12 issues long so if you buy individually it will be about €60 (which I have) and in that case, not worth it. Pick it up at half that probably in TPB and I think it gives more than it takes. Not as good as MTMTE but better than RID as a series. Worth a read, but not essential.

inflatable dalek
2014-03-26, 10:57 PM
The last two issues are worth reading in a silly action scene way, and the (entertainingly OTT) Previously stuff fills you in pretty well.

Worryingly, you don't need to read the issue where Shockwave explains his plan though.

zigzagger
2014-03-27, 12:09 AM
The last two issues are worth reading in a silly action scene way


Part 10 (MTMTE #27) wasn't too shabby either, I thought. Mostly just folks from both titles sitting around gabbing away, but it was a lot of fun and touches on a few plotlines that are pertinent to MTMTE (e.g. Prowl and Chromedome's bit, and every moment with Megatron, really -- worth it just to see Ratchet snark off to him).

It's where I decided to pick up, and I was able to follow along just fine. But, more on that later. I'm tired.

Terome
2014-03-27, 12:33 AM
Yeah. Okay. They pulled it off.

It was a long and winding way to get to the standard Christian moral but the scene that has been set looks promising.

Warcry: So now that the whole thing is done, what's the verdict? Does the decent ending make it worth going back and slogging through the silly early chapters? Or should I just read the last issue or two so that I'm primed to pick up the story in MTMTE when the actual plot starts up again?

I'm curious to see how it reads on a single afternoon but if I were you I'd pick up one or more of the new issues - we've been told they will serve as custom-fitted jumping on points. MTMTE seems like the logical choice but Windblade looks quite fun from the little we've seen and Barber might actually fool me twice with the solicits of RID.

Knightdramon
2014-03-27, 08:19 AM
Hmmm...much more coherent thoughts later on, but the rough draft

--I was right! Shockwave regressed back to his old self!

--Kind of a natural progression for Rodimus to volunteer to carry the wounded back. Not anymore gung-ho, he decides to care for his crew, which is what he was guilt-infested of in his very first IDW appearance.

--...black hole opens up, with possibly time travelling and time-changing properties...and bumblebee's body is left around that. Cop out. Love though how Megatron tried to grab Bumblebee while Magnus and Prime left him behind :lol:

--Megatron's progression felt natural, indeed. He'll be like an anti-hero for a while, yeah.

--Galvatron leading the Decepticons seems a bit forced, but okay

--Starscream's kind of an asshole. He has his moments, but he's indeed an arse. Also, while self-boasting as the Decepticon's greatest warrior, for the past few years he is either too catatonic to fight or gets his ass kicked badly. When he wins, he wins because he takes the opponent by surprise.

--Poor Metalhawk. I really like this guy.

Rack 'n Ruin
2014-03-27, 08:50 AM
--Poor Metalhawk. I really like this guy.

:eek:

I was with you until this! ;)

inflatable dalek
2014-03-27, 12:19 PM
--I was right! Shockwave regressed back to his old self!




Don't be too proud, after all, you know who saw it coming first? Stevie Wonder.

Unicron
2014-03-28, 07:22 PM
I kind of like the idea of Galvatron ending up as the new Decepticon leader, and not just because it's Galvatron and tradition. Practically everything we've seen of IDW Galvatron has been when he's being controlled or influenced by the Dead Universe in some way. I'm curious to see what his goals and motives will end up being now that he is apparently free.

Heinrad
2014-04-03, 09:57 AM
As all I've read of Dark Cybertron is two of the toy pack-in comics, I have one important question:

Is Nightbeat back?

Unicron
2014-04-03, 12:15 PM
Yes