PDA

View Full Version : Premature MTMTE Season 2 discussion


Terome
2014-02-18, 07:22 PM
Dark Cybertron's still got another month left in it but statements have been said and educated guesses can be made about what is to come once the comics get back to normal. Maybe we can talk about that while we wait patiently?

What we know so far is:

A prominent Autobot is in for the chop (possibly Rodimus)
Megatron will be on, and possibly leading, the Lost Light
Cross-pollination between the casts of MTMTE and RID will occur
We have a bunch of new characters now
In addition to the likes of Crosscut and Tankor, several new toys have been announced (Gears, Brainstorm, Sky-Byte, Jetfire, etc) that may come with nudges from Hasbro
We haven't yet seen 'The Coffin' or 'For the sake of Cybertron itself don't...'
Roberts has an escape plan in mind, is keen to lay the plot on thick and wants to raise his profile to the point where he can attract other projects.

Thoughts? Predictions? Hopes? Fears? Cast line-ups?

I, for one, think that Hasbro's big push with Dark Cybertron will not be the last of the intrusions. I'd also really like Nick Roche to be writing RID. And as much as I like Whirl and Cyclonus, I'd like them to take a back seat for now. And no secret origins for Rung! He's good as a peculiarity.

Oh, and would Waspinator work on the Lost Light? We can probably bet on more Decepticons and I am trying to think of suitable candidates.

Knightdramon
2014-02-18, 07:45 PM
Hmmm...there are big, wavy signs that Rodimus *might* bite it soon...

The fact that Megatron will be on board the Lost Light changes many things. First off, he's shown with an Autobot symbol and somewhere my eye caught a "rise of the autobots" subtitle. Which, in my mind's translation, means that all cybertronians will be branded Autobots.

Seeing as Roberts wants to realistically end S2 around issue 50...

We're going to have the last part of the pre-war Cybertron trilogy. The one where you'll all see that Tarn is Roller. Which will probably be in conjunction with the return of the DJD.

We'll have a storyline about Brainstorm's suitcase and the green spark. I must be the only person in the fandom who honestly doesn't give a damn about his suitcase, but it could be exciting :D

The rest I can't really speculate upon. We don't even know who the cast will be, with the odd exception of Megatron.

Onto hopes, I honestly hope this carries on for a good while. It's a rare thing to have such a good TF series around, and a writer who's actually more passionate about the subject than the paycheck. There will probably be another "new readers reset" some years down the line, but this series will go on to be legendary.

This is the BW of 2010+ :lol:

Terome
2014-02-18, 09:18 PM
Hmmm...there are big, wavy signs that Rodimus *might* bite it soon...


Yeah, things are pointing that way. Might be a red herring. He's a useful character to have around and I liked how he was played in MTMTE. We'll see.


We're going to have the last part of the pre-war Cybertron trilogy. The one where you'll all see that Tarn is Roller. Which will probably be in conjunction with the return of the DJD.


Oh yes, I remember that being mentioned - the capper to Shadowplay and that other one. I am against Roller being Tarn on the basis that you can only really do one 'faceless bad guy is revealed to have been a good guy with a face you knew' plot per series.


We'll have a storyline about Brainstorm's suitcase and the green spark. I must be the only person in the fandom who honestly doesn't give a damn about his suitcase, but it could be exciting :D


Yeah, I think the briefcase joke has been played out. It'll be good for one tight corner and then Brainstorm can come out from under its shade.


The rest I can't really speculate upon. We don't even know who the cast will be, with the odd exception of Megatron.


I think we can count on Swerve and Tailgate at the very least. Anyone who is not appearing in Dark Cybertron can be assumed to survive. Hound might be rising to the surface too. We might get at least one Dinobot and I bet my boots that Nautica ends up on board. I wouldn't bet against Bumblebee making the jump either. He could do with a change of scenery.


Onto hopes, I honestly hope this carries on for a good while. It's a rare thing to have such a good TF series around, and a writer who's actually more passionate about the subject than the paycheck. There will probably be another "new readers reset" some years down the line, but this series will go on to be legendary.


It can't last forever but I hope it at least makes it to its #50 and #100 milestones. I'd like to see Roberts make an indelible mark on the franchise rather than being its latest flavour. To think, in 2030, he might be able to enjoy the uneasy feeling of seeing Swerve advertising a billion dollar movie on a giant billboard in Times Square without receiving a dime for it. Though maybe the turnaround will be quicker - Guido Guidi and Shane MacCarthy will have that feeling in just a few months.

Terome
2014-02-19, 05:00 PM
Well I'm glad this is happening:

http://www.previewsworld.com/catalogimages/STK_IMAGES/STK620001-640000/STK637381.jpg

Terome
2014-02-19, 05:04 PM
Additionally, something that sounds like a death-knell ringing, far away:

A BWTF interview with folks from the Hasbro Brand Team or some such. (http://www.bwtf.com/events/toyfair-2014)

Here's the sad part:

"Recently the "Transformers Legends" mobile game offered synergy between the toy line and comic book. Now dinosaurs are a theme in "Rescue Bots" and "Age of Extinction". Can we expect to see more of this cross-media alignment in the future?

JJ: Yes, I think what you'll see more of is themes and storylines that will go across toy lines where they're meant for the age target to make sure that we're maximizing the story. That way we can make sure we're not telling a lot of different stories...that way we're telling one story across different expressions and outlets. I think you're going to see more of that going forward whether it's in our main entertainment, whether it's movie or TV or even in "Generations" where you're seeing leveraging IDW or DeNA with the "Transformers" game making sure hey, we're all telling the same story. "

Denyer
2014-02-19, 07:16 PM
Hopefully by now someone's nailed the dickheads down to stop them straying from the marketing offices.

Death's Head
2014-02-19, 08:22 PM
Christ alive. Reminds me of an email from Head Office I once read whilst supervising a pub. It was from the new MD of the company and had words to the effect of: "When a customer walks into a Greene King pub, we want them to have an identical experience no matter where it is."

inflatable dalek
2014-02-19, 08:52 PM
Yeah, that sounds worrying. I could see a certain logic in creating a unified Transformers brand (though that's not really my bag), but trying to coordinate the stories across all medium so as to kill any variety in the storytelling just seems meh. Because everyone would rather just have the same story told over and over again rather than lots of different stories right?

More cheerful:

In terms of what I'd expect from MTMTE 2 in one word: Impactor. To disagree with what Terome said in another thread recently where he mentioned not being able to see what Impactor could bring to the table, I personally think having Megatron's pre-war BFF onboard in what may be the first time the two of them have been in the same room without automatically trying to kill each other is just so full of potential it's hard to see how it won't happen.

Espcially as the other two non-Pax characters who shaped Megatron's future on that fateful day, Whirl and Rung, are already on the ship. That'd be a hell of a four way reunion.

What's going to be interesting about Megatron and Whirl is that the more obvious character dynamic- "I've got to play nice for now but sooner or later you're dead"- had already been done with Cyclonus and Whirl, so it's going to have to work that little bit harder to come up with something fresh.

Also, on a personal note, with the comic having sadly avoided it for the two years he went by that name I hope the third part of the Chaos Theory trilogy will having Orion use the "I'm the PAX collector!" one liner.

I've missed Roberts talking about having an exit strategy (was it in the big interview Denyer posted the link to the other day?), but it's understandable I suppose. As someone who has always firmly believed that very few writers can work indefinitely for a series they didn't create before burning out (Chris Claremont being the classic comics example, but lets face it, Furman falls into that as well), I'd rather have-ideally- three or four good years and then a fond farewell than decades of work that get gradually worse and worse as time goes on.

Knightdramon
2014-02-19, 09:35 PM
To be honest, I doubt either Megatron or Impactor would remember Rung. Almost nobody remembers the poor guy.

To add up...storylines that were left hanging/unexplored in S1 [not that they'll necessarily pop up, just saying]

--The Necrobot thing. Is it indeed cataloging dead victims? Or is it something completely different that just coincides?
--Scavengers and Grimlock. They'll probably get their own saga again. Possibly uncovering something long lost and dwelling more into the Primal Vanguard story, helping Grimlock remember
--Rung's past.
--Skid's actual past. Before the mission. His ties to the DJD, if any
--DJD. Could either work as allies [with Megatron on board] or uber villains against a leader who forgot his way.
--Tyrest and Star Saber, plus their bot behind the scenes, IF any.
--Autobot phase sixer quest. I thought this was going to be Fortress Maximus, but he's left.
--The green super spark of Brainstorm's holding. Plus, his...suitcase.
--Drift. Maybe in conjunction with the DJD.
--The sequel to Shadowplay, as promised.
--The whole deal with "paradise", the tentacles, pharma's body, etc etc
--Galactic Council
--Overlord and whatever's left of Rewind. Could be in conjunction with the DJD.
--The coffin, and the future of the cybertronian race. Though to be technical, these should have been resolved before the crossover. Otherwise why try to send a message before the LL left, if these things haven't happened yet it returns once again in DC?


Have I forgotten anything?

Red Dave Prime
2014-02-19, 09:53 PM
Roberts exit strategy is linked in with this thread http://www.tfarchive.com/community/showthread.php?s=&threadid=52321

He says that he is planned up for issue 50 but if things get cut short he has an option to tie things up in a few issues if needed. Hope we never see that though.

Regarding the message - we havent seen it being sent and it could have been from the future of the second voyage of the lost light. Obviously we havent seen the coffin and the "for the sake of" bit but it is possible that we havent seen what we thought of the others.

Dont look in the basement would seem to be overlord and he could well resurface further on - it also lead to several deaths. But the others I'm not so sure.

Dont go to delphi? Why not the first time? They sorted out Pharma, cured the virus, no-one died (other than the other prowl) and it brought Max and first aid onboard. Unless a second trip there results in some major casualties in a battle with the DJD (think about it - Megs leads the Lost light there to recruit his loyal DJD only for them to turn on him and see him as the ultimate traitor against his own ideals)

Dont take Skids? Again, nothing major bad happened there in regards to Tyrest but it could refer to the other dimension. They seemed linked to skids and that could be where his arc ultimately goes. Or even if he is captured by someone who wants to learn about the other dimension.

I cant wait for season 2 of Roberts work and I hope Hasbro leave him and Barber alone. It baffles my mind that Hasbro think its best if everything is samey-samey. Surely you want different versions of Transformers in all media to broaden markets you can hit - movie verse for general public, cartoons like prime for kids, g1 throwback cartoons for adult collectors gives you three distinct toylines. Fair enough to have characters be a little consistent through out the line but if they have different toy lines they surely have more appeal for collectors where as a streamlined range means many people will collect less.

Death's Head
2014-02-19, 10:54 PM
It seems a little daft since Transformers has managed with multiple continuities since its inception.

Terome
2014-02-19, 11:22 PM
Peace through tyranny.

Red Dave Prime
2014-02-19, 11:45 PM
When will Hasbro lay down their fusion cannon???

Death's Head
2014-02-20, 12:08 AM
Everything is fodder.

Unicron
2014-02-20, 05:38 AM
The way the brand team response thing reads to me is that the things aimed at a particular "age target" will try to have an overarching theme. Like the kids' show, mobile games, etc. being tied together while the Generations toyline (which they now seem to view as a line for older fans) gets tied in more with the IDW comics, as seen with the pack-ins, new toy character shoehorning, and such.

Ok, if that cover is an actual indication Megatron and Tailgate will interact, then I can't wait for this to start. Should be some fun stuff.

Aside from this whole 'Megatron on the Lost Light' thing and all the story that would be tied in with that, I think the thing I'm most looking forward to is the Point-One-Percenter spark Brainstorm has. I'm dying to find out who it's going to end up being (assuming it actually becomes a character and doesn't fail or get destroyed somehow). I'm assuming we'd have to be digging into Japanese characters to find a powerhouse who hasn't shown up yet, unless it's going to be either some late G1 nobody who's yet to show up or a brand new character. I'm thinking Grand/Brave Maximus because of the schematics in Brainstorm's lab at one point, given the way Roberts does things I'm betting that was a hint to something. That or Quickswitch, because when the hell has he ever been used.

I'm also curious about whether it'll be made as a Phase Sixer, given that Chromedome has the knowledge from his reads on Overlord. Though given Overlord's knowledge of mnemosurgery and Chromedome's apparent surprise that he remembered the event, I have to wonder if he faked it. Unlikely, but random theory.

Cliffjumper
2014-02-20, 04:01 PM
Thoughts? Predictions? Hopes? Fears? Cast line-ups?

1986 Minibot with quirky personality will feature heavily, you will all pay three or four times retail for its' poorly-manufactured Generations equivalent. With sexy results. Maybe Hubcap starting a brothel with Vortex next door to Ultra Magnus' office. With sexy results. Said brothel will have a mysterious secret buried under it which will be faintly underwhelming (i.e. Ramjet) and quickly forgotten about while the focus switches to Override only having one foot. With sexy results.

Terome
2014-02-20, 07:12 PM
1986 Minibot with quirky personality will feature heavily, you will all pay three or four times retail for its' poorly-manufactured Generations equivalent. With sexy results. Maybe Hubcap starting a brothel with Vortex next door to Ultra Magnus' office. With sexy results. Said brothel will have a mysterious secret buried under it which will be faintly underwhelming (i.e. Ramjet) and quickly forgotten about while the focus switches to Override only having one foot. With sexy results.

Shall we open up a board pool on how close the result is to this prediction?

inflatable dalek
2014-02-21, 04:18 PM
I'll take good bets on something terrible happening to Cliffjumper in the background of one panel before the year is out.

Personally, I'm all in favour of sexy results. We've had too many unsexy Transformers comics, MTMTE having slapped on the brut and gone out on the pull hard is exactly what the series needed.

Though I am not saying I am in any way aroused by MTMTE and anyone who claims other is a liar.

Hmm, Whichever book he ends up in I guess we can put a reasonable guess on Jetfire getting better from having died and coming back in a much larger, voyager sized body. Just a hunch.

EDIT: RE Megatron/Rung... I think it'd be entirely in keeping with the "Champion of the little people" thing the comic seems to be pushing as the angle by which they're going to make it seem plausible for Megatron to become an Autobot that he'd be the one guy who does remember Rung.

Death's Head
2014-02-21, 08:14 PM
When did Jetfire die?

inflatable dalek
2014-02-21, 08:26 PM
IIRC when the Decepticons raided the prison to free Megatron in the Prowlestator arc in RID. Though it most likely will turn out to be just a flesh wound now.

Unicron
2014-02-22, 02:30 AM
Wasn't he one of the ones picked up and hidden by Swindle during that whole prison raid mess?

Hmmm... there's an idea. Swindle on the Lost Light, ripping off various cultures as they travel the galaxy. Could be a fun gag for an issue.

inflatable dalek
2014-02-22, 10:07 AM
Damn, looks like you're right, I really liked the raid on the prison for the no nonsense go in and kill everyone approach of the Decepticons, but no, it turns out they were as rubbish as all the other cons in that arc.

Death's Head
2014-02-22, 04:45 PM
Considering how visible he was back in the "-Ation" era that's quite a come-down - possibly shot dead in the background. If Yomtov were still on the job it would probably would have been block-coloured, too!

Edit: Ah, didn't see those last two replies. Whoops!

Unicron
2014-02-23, 12:45 AM
Damn, looks like you're right, I really liked the raid on the prison for the no nonsense go in and kill everyone approach of the Decepticons, but no, it turns out they were as rubbish as all the other cons in that arc.

Yup. Can't have anyone die, that would actually be something happening for once or Decepticons appearing to be competent. Definitely can't have that. T'would be against the natural order.

inflatable dalek
2014-02-23, 03:09 AM
Hey, but Pipes is going to stay dead at least!

Till the Western release of the retool of the highly likely Masterpiece Huffer gets announced anyway.

Unicron
2014-02-23, 04:53 AM
Yeah, I suppose he'll come back when that happens. But by then we'll likely have been through 2 more continuity reboots, so moot point.

Auntie Slag
2014-03-25, 02:26 PM
With Megatron on-board sporting an Autobot ("a Autobot"?[/Phoneshop]) sigil, Tarn's gonna be well miffed when they meet.

Also, now Megatron's on board he can't fail to hear of their meeting with Overlord and the fun they all had together. Possibly even meet up with Tyrest and the headless body of Pharma in that other Universe with the other Luna-1's that Skids visited briefly. And find the one who is controlling Tyrest!

Then there's former buddy Impactor, and of course.... Whirl, who bitchslapped him and kicked off the war!

Shirley all of these things will be big, bold neon signs to put him back on the path to Decepticon-ism. And when he does, he'll be there on the Lost Light.

Auntie Slag
2014-04-01, 04:01 PM
Some new fun guesses:

1) Tarn is a Decepticon, not Roller. Prowl seemed sure of this in issue 14, because he lists Tarn as a phase Sixer... and no Autobots are phase sixers. So who else could Tarn be? Sandstorm? (Wreckers don't have much truck with morals after all).

2) Prowl is constructed cold from a piece of Overlord. Lets say Rossum tried extracting a bit of Overlord with the intention of generating more Phase sixers. Such a technique would have originated from the institute, which means Rossum was once affiliated with the institute & the senate.

Once Overlord killed Rossum there were no more phase sixers BUT... how about some institute guys got to his lab and could work with it to create the likes of Prowl and Chromedome? This links because Chromedome is so impressed by Overlord's mnemosurgical abilities which seem very developed despite Overlords insistence that he only gleaned the basics before Megatron had Trepan killed. Maybe Overlord shares Chromedome's special affinity to this skill and that they are cut from the same cloth.

3) Mirage will find out that Chromedome lobotomised/manipulated him (maybe Red will find out too) and turn Decepticon. He will disclose everything about the senate and institute to Megatron. When Megatron sees there are still Autobots carrying out dodgy Senate/Intitute ideals he will denounce the Autobots as a corrupt movement, turn back to his true Decepticon ideal AAAAAND.... convince Pax to join him!

4) Overlord says "Starting with that skinny little friend of yours". The same phrase Prowl uses to describe Rewind. Does this suggest a spark link between Overlord, Prowl and Chromedome, explaining the heavy moral greyness of Chromedome and Prowl?

It may further be a reason why Overlord singled out Rewind as his first pick in the massacre, and perhaps why Rewind has not died in the slow cell explosion. Rewind is the true victim in all this, and may find that Overlord is linked to.... Dominus Ambus!

Because Tarn is Dominus Ambus!

5) Kup described looking into Overlords eyes and seeing nothing there. Was Overlord also a victim of Shadowplay?

6) Did Dominus Ambus create shadowplay? Was so disgusted by its bastardised use by the senate that he signed up to the Decepticon cause, put on a mask and became Tarn?

7) Will Rewind save Tarn from Overlord? Overlord being an extension of Chromedome (his second love) versus Tarn/Dominus Ambus being his first? A true test of where Rewind's heart lies.

8) Are Dominus and Minimus brothers? Linking Magnus, Overlord, Chromedome, Tarn, Prowl, Megatron and Rewind together?

9) Maybe Dominus Ambus is on the other side of that singularity that Skids found. DA augmented Rewind after befriending him, and Rewind was/is his link to our Universe. Meanwhile DA lives on the other side of the singularity with the five Luna-1's he ACTUALLY found. He's been keeping an eye on the Cybertronian war from a distance and that's why Rewind never located him. Controlling Tyrest enables Dominus to try and sway the course of the war (Tyrests negotiations with Megatron) also be a way to keep an eye on his younger Brother Minimus Ambus... the Magnus suit was an option to keep his brother safe.

Rack 'n Ruin
2014-04-01, 04:25 PM
1) Tarn is a Decepticon, not Roller. Prowl seemed sure of this in issue 14, because he lists Tarn as a phase Sixer... and no Autobots are phase sixers. So who else could Tarn be? Sandstorm (Wreckers don't have much truck with morals after all).

Well, Sandstorm was listed as being deep undercover behind enemy lines somewhere in the LSOTW hard cover. I've been waiting for him to crop up somewhere. Could he have turned 'con? Or is he one of the DJD in disguise? I don't think its Tarn though. Tarn is Roller! ;)

Could the scene be set for an almighty DJD / Wreckers smack down, with (Voyager) Roadbuster and Springer appearing in the nick of time to save the day? (Toys to sell, toys to sell.)

On another DJD tangent: Tarn makes his victims sparks self destruct due to his modulated vocal tones. What would happen if he tried this on someone with no spark? Or maybe a pseudo one in a briefcase?

2) Prowl is constructed cold from a piece of Overlord. Lets say Rossum tried extracting a bit of Overlord with the intention of generating more Phase sixers. Such a technique would have originated from the institute, which means Rossum was once affiliated with the institute & the senate.

Once Overlord killed Rossum there were no more phase sixers, but... some institute guys got to his lab and could work with it to create the likes of Prowl and Chromedome? Links to Chromedome because Chromey is so impressed by Overlord's mnemosurgical abilities which seem very developed despite Overlords insistence that he only gleaned the basics before Megatron had Trepan killed. This suggests Overlord shares Chromedome's special affinity to this skill and that they are cut from the same cloth.

Not sure where this has come from. Maybe I missed some pretty critical stuff during Shadowplay? I don't think Prowl & Domey are Overlord's "children". Have Prowl or Domey exhibited phase sixer like tendencies? A fraternal link between the two would put a new spin on their squabbling though.

3) Mirage will find out that Chromedome lobotomised/manipulated him (maybe Red will find out too) and turn Decepticon. He will disclose everything about the senate and institute to Megatron, who will find the Autobots as corrupt and turn back to his true Decepticon ideal.

Now this I can see. Oh yes. The Autobots are plenty dirty, and Megs will eventually rebel against them again. Hence the symbol changing gimmick built into the forthcoming leader class Megatron toy. /wildspeculation ;)

It would certainly be nice to see Mirage do some interesting stuff, too.

Auntie Slag
2014-04-01, 04:38 PM
Whoops, sorry. Sandstorm can't be Tarn because Tarn is a phase sixer and no Autobots are Phase sixers. So Tarn is someone else, which is what made me think of Dominus Ambus, but DA signed up to be an Autobot, so not him either perhaps...
[Edit] Ah, but then Impactor said that Wreckers AREN'T Autobots! So maybe it is Sandy?


Perhaps an offcut of a phase sixer doesn't share all abilities to its mother/father, just similarities?

Your DJD/Wreckers idea makes sense on the shilling toys front.

Yeah, there was a bit where Overlord restated Prowls words in reference to Rewind. Its probably just a cute reference but its also got that ambiguity that could imply Overlord is Prowl's Dad :D

Unicron
2014-04-01, 06:23 PM
A Phase Sixer is just a Point One Percenter subjected to a Weapon X-like metal bonding process (unless Overlord was somehow feeding Domey bad memories), so Tarn could easily be an Autobot defector or undercover man Prowl doesn't know about or remember.

Was there any proof Mirage was actually tinkered with? All I recall is him playing guard at the New Institute.

Not sure where all this 'children' and familial connections are coming from. Remember, those constructed cold come from energy bled from the Matrix, not from any sort of actual spark splicing.

Auntie Slag
2014-04-01, 06:39 PM
The children and familial things are just my guesses, but yes your 'energy bled from the matrix' comment invalidates all of that, so forget my burbling above :)

Someone mentioned the relevance of Mirage and Pharma being in the panel when Chromedome says that he performed operations on those members of high command whose views may not agree with everyone, and there must be something significant in having those two guys on the panel. Mirage has never been a security guy, why not have Red or Ironhide behind Pharma?

Minimus ambus mentions Impactor is a Point One Percenter, and Prowl says they never managed to recreate the phase sixer process, so the Autobots have guys who are one step away from, but are not actually phase sixers.

So yeah, by that logic you're right Tarn could be Roller (another Point One Percenter mentioned by Minimus) who defected and underwent the process.

What's really interesting me is the whole 'everyone knows everyone' thing. Its like when Rewind got people to tell the story of Shadowplay to kick Rung back into consciousness. Its starting to feel like so much of everything can be pared down to say, 9 or 10 characters causing a 4 million years war, which I think is pretty interesting.

Unicron
2014-04-01, 06:56 PM
Timing also blows a hole in the 'Overlord's kids' theory. Prowl and Chromedome were alive pre-war, while presumably the Phase Sixer-ing and death of Rossum happened during the war.

I could buy Mirage being a potential subject of Chromedome's meddling, given the various traitor stuff that's always thrown around with him. I just didn't know if I missed something beyond that one panel, something definitive.
As for why him as security, he can turn invisible. Wouldn't that make for good security at a secret installation? I could easily see that as the reason for him being there, and all the traitor stuff is just an overblown reputation due to comments he's made, spurred by disillusion in the cause after witnessing stuff at the New Institute.
And I think Pharma was there as he's a doc dodgy enough to be involved in a place like that.

I can buy everyone knowing everyone. They're beings who are millions of years old. Unless you spent a lot of that time buried in rock on Earth or chilling in a non-living universe, you're bound to have run into a lot of people. Hell, Shockwave was responsible for everything despite being buried in said rock.

Auntie Slag
2014-04-01, 07:07 PM
Ha ha, I completely forgot about Mirage's invisibilty! And the timing with Overlord's kids you mention makes perfect sense.

Ah well, its still fun to discuss and debunk this stuff, as we've three weeks before it all kicks off again :)

Unicron
2014-04-01, 07:21 PM
Yeah, definitely a good time working through the crazy theories. Thousand monkeys at a thousand typewriters, one of us is bound to hit something accurate.

I just realized, they left Bumblebee's body to get sucked up in the singularity, right? Assuming it was on him and not in his other pants at the time, that means the second half-Matrix is gone too. Fun

Auntie Slag
2014-04-01, 07:27 PM
And Rodimus has used up his and Bumblebees half is still copy protected, yes? The stuff on the other side of this singularity is getting annoying!

Ok then here's another one; One of Magnus' favourite pieces of music is The Empyrean Suite. Swerve plays it to him in issue 16 whilst Ratchet is trying to repair the wounds caused by Overlord. The Suite is the same that plays in Skids' head, and Chromedome comments that he hopes Skids never finds out why its playing in his head (Issue 8).

Why does this link Magnus to Skids? That they've both been to the same place in the past? Magnus has been to the other side of the singularity, to Cyberutopia (and to Dominus)? Linking Magnus to Skids and Rewind?

Unicron
2014-04-01, 07:38 PM
Isn't the popular theory that The Empyrean Suite is what Tarn was playing when murderizing Black Shadow?
It could be as simple as being a popular or well known piece of classical music (their version of Beethoven's 5th or whatever). Knowing Roberts that probably isn't the case. I can't figure out what the connection would be though.

I'm not sure Dominus is connected to Cyberutopia. I think it's more likely that Chromedome and his New Institute shenanigans are related to Dominus' disappearance. As far as I know, there's still that unrevealed dirty little secret Prowl threatened to reveal leading to Domey doing that spontaneous mnemosurgery.

Auntie Slag
2014-04-01, 07:52 PM
Oh yeah! I've gone back to look at that issue, Tarn doesn't mention the Empyrean Suite specifically, but like you say there must be the suggestion that Skids and Magnus (and possibly Chromedome too) have come into contact with Tarn in the past, rather than it just being a popular Cybertronian tune.

I'm just guessing on the whole Dominus angle, probably because I want to believe its more interesting that Rewind doesn't die, and that the only way Overlord would spare him is if he's got something to gain from Rewind's database, or he wants to use him as a tool against Chromedome.

And Chromedome's dirty secret. When is that going to get revealed?

I was just going over issue 16 again. When it came out I commented how I didn't like the artwork, I think its perfect now. Every shot of Chromedome's sadness in so well depicted, and Brainstorm's cynical and caring looks. That was such a lovely issue, and I was underwhelmed at the time simply because it wasn't Milne on the art duties.

Unicron
2014-04-01, 08:05 PM
I don't think Overlord necessarily needs a reason to spare Rewind beyond the fact that he has Chromedome's severed arm with finger needles and Rewind as a test subject/practice dummy right in front of him. Why waste a free resource and need to go hunting for another spare Cybertronian to brain hack?
It could also be the plan that during Overlord's practice, he undoes some edits Chromedome made in Rewind's head, leading to shocking reveals and other solicitation fodder.

I'm still trying to figure why both Overlord and Tyrest had finger drills. Standard feature for certain kinds of Cybertronians?

And I've been wanting to bring this up at some point: I'm still pissed by the death of Ambulon. He was awesome, apparently grinning while ramming a MARB into Overlord's back during the big splash page fight scene. But more important than that, how could he die before we got a chance to see the alt mode?

Auntie Slag
2014-04-01, 08:25 PM
I'm sure Ambulon will feature a lot in flashbacks if First Aid is now chief medical officer on the Lost Light.

I remember discussing this a while back, but I think Chromedome's severed arm is a red herring, because Chromedome only does mnemosurgery using his right hand (at least, every time we see him doing it, its with his right hand), there may be no needles in his left. Kind of like Scrounge and his special arm.

I never questioned the finger drills, I thought that was just something cool referenced from a single panel in the early days of the Marvel comic where Soundwave has finger drills he's scaring humans with in a facility.

Unicron
2014-04-01, 08:45 PM
I remember digging through the trades when we were going over the arm thing a little bit back. As I recall, aside from the one cover, Chromedome was shown injecting with both hands when Overlord broke out of the chair. I'd have to go back and look again though. Maybe also check on the sparkeater bit too.

Auntie Slag
2014-04-01, 08:49 PM
Damn, you're right again. Ok, Rewind is completely screwed!

Overlord is brilliantly annoying. we know why Megatron is evil. Overlord just does it for shits and giggles!

Auntie Slag
2014-04-01, 08:55 PM
I'm also really intrigued about Krok, the device in his left hand, and whether Red Alert will ever come back to the Lost Light, simply because he's tied so closely with shadowplay and Rung.

And Rung is 90% compartments... what else has he got stashed away? And how Skids knew the trick to bring him back to consciousness. That was really a nice touch.

Unicron
2014-04-01, 09:10 PM
I just went back and looked. I was right about a both hand injecting but wrong about precisely when. It was in issue 14, but not at the chair escape. It was earlier in the issue, when Chromedome is explaining to Overlord what's going on. We get a pair of panels showing Chromedome and Overlord in the slow cell, one of which is a nice close-up of Overlord's head with both of Chromedome's hands injecting.
The one during the sparkeater incident was right hand only though. Same for the Metrotitan brain in the Annual. I forgot to check on the Skids and Prowl ones, but I'm pretty sure you're right about those not being left handed. So either we have an error on the Overlord scene, or the 'deep reading on a live subject' calls for both hands.

I'm not so sure Overlord does it just for shits and giggles at this point. He clearly enjoys the evil and brutality, but I'm thinking there is motive behind it. Garrus-9 was to draw out Megatron. The Fort Max torture apparently was to get at whatever was under Aequitas, assuming Overlord wasn't just dicking with Max. The Lost Light mess was him on a hostile ship, limbering up after being jailed for a while and realizing his life had meaning again.

Death's Head
2014-04-01, 09:47 PM
That's another one - what's under Aequitas?

I also find myself curious about that symbol ship the Scavengers found - the wooden robot, in particular, and the ceiling full of brain modules. Presumably it belonged to Shockwave at some point but what was he up to? I guarantee it was probably more interesting than Dark Cybertron.

Actually, it could have been Scorponok - he's got a fondness for merging organics and machinery, the pervert.

This is a cross-post from Transfans; some speculation on those 'forged' or 'constructed cold':

And yeah, you're right that in G2 everyone's forgotten about 'budding' - especially as it was probably still occurring within the lifetimes of most of the characters. James Roberts addresses this in Eugenesis, actually, which is where he first developed the distinction between 'forged' (born from 'budding') and 'constructed cold' (built and then infused with life from the Matrix) - at some point in TMUK history the memory gap regarding budding is lifted too.

This has interesting implications for his IDW work. We already know what 'constructed cold' means in the IDW-verse: a body is built then infused with life from the Matrix. So far, all we know about those 'forged' is that their sparks emerge from the surface of Cybertron itself and are surrounded by 'sentio metallico'. This has parallels with Generation 2, where it's revealed that the first Cybertronians were born from the planet's surface in much the same way. Also, the term 'sentio metallico' was given by James to describe the sort of fluid metal that emerges from a Transformer's chest during budding, forming the newborn.

This, coupled with the knowledge that those with forged limbs (Ratchet, Whirl, Shockwave) consider their original appendages to be irreplaceable indicates that, in the IDW-verse, to be forged means to be fully born, spark-and-body-whole, from the surface of the planet (presumably after the spark and sentio-metallico is harvested, it continues to grow?). This has political implications for those constructed cold, as regards Ratioism; after all, someone must have built their bodies, and thus their alternate modes, so what does that say for the constructed-cold menial worker?

Unicron
2014-04-02, 12:19 AM
Yeah, Krok's mystery device and what exactly happened to his old crew has been bugging me too. So many dangling plot threads.

I assumed the 90% compartments line was a joke on Rung's part.

The symbol ship... I always assumed Shockwave, given the mad science and Grimlock being on board. It just kind of made sense. Though for some reason lately I was thinking Bludgeon, probably due to the aborted protoforms on board and Rewind's history lesson for Tailgate mentioning Bludgeon's army of halfforms and deviants.
I really hadn't considered it being Scorponok's ship. It makes complete sense though. The wacky mad science, the organic and machinery blend, he and Grimlock have a history, and he was probably locked up on G-9 just like Shockwave.

One little thing has been bugging me lately. Given Barber's bent for fixing continuity and tying things up, and being the editor on MTMTE, how on earth have we not gotten some quick explanation on where the bloody Magnificence is? I mean a couple of quick questions to that magic 8-ball and this whole Knight Quest is over. That's kind of a big thing to just leave hanging out there.

Terome
2014-04-02, 12:44 PM
I'd prefer it if they just pretended the Magnificence didn't happen, to be honest. But that Barber is a scab-picker so no doubt we'll find out soon...

I'm tempted to think that, much as we like to think of Roberts as a fiendish master planner, that the symbol ship, the object under Aequitas and the thing in Krok's hand are all placeholders for things he intends to think of later. If those loose ends are tied up then we'll celebrate them being threaded early on but if they are not then we can always chalk it up to characters lying / generic mystery / editorial interference. It's a storytelling win-win.

Auntie Slag
2014-04-02, 01:03 PM
Oh yeah, I'm ok with Aequitas not being explained for another year, but I'd imagine as a writer Roberts must be concerned about the lateness of reveals. If he leaves it till 2016, how many readers will care? How many readers will be annoyed that it relates to something from issue 6 and they didn't start reading until issue 42?

LSotW is three years old already. I don't like the idea of making excuses for readers. I'd rather James Roberts be as complex with his stories as he likes. I'm just bothered that someone will look over his shoulder and say "Come on, man... time to tie this one up".

Is Barber the only one to do that? The plots are so labyrinthine who else would be bothered to understand all the seeding apart from the readers, and me when I steal his ideas book next month?

Terome
2014-04-02, 01:09 PM
I'd imagine, since Barber seems to be good at his job, that he rereads the back catalogue fairly regularly and makes notes on mysteries and loose ends and then shoots an e-mail to the relevant writer with his thoughts and suggestions. It might be that a specific case like Aequitas has come up already and was planned to be expanded on but was pushed aside for something more interesting / pressing.

But you're right in that reader pressure to address every loophole and dangling thread could be to our detriment - remember all the talk not so long ago about how Ore-13 was abandoned as a concept?

Auntie Slag
2014-04-02, 01:17 PM
Excellent point. Is Barber actually Roberts' Bernie Taupin?

The keyboard bloke of the Pet Shop Boys to James' Chris Tennant?

The Marr to his Morrissey? Ooooooh!

Rack 'n Ruin
2014-04-02, 01:25 PM
The Wise to his Morecambe?

The Corbett to his Barker?

The Jason to his Kylie?

The C-3PO to his R2-D2?

The bloke-without-a-tache-from-Sparks to his bloke-with-a-tache-from-Sparks?

Auntie Slag
2014-04-02, 01:34 PM
The Oldman to his Numan.

The supermarket brand version to his Jacobs.

The Tetley to his PG.

The Macleans to his Colgate.

The Fender to his Les Paul (that's right, bitches!).

The American Dad to his Family Guy.

The Jurassic Park to his Maximo Park.

The bloke that played Robocop after Peter Weller... to his Peter Weller.

Auntie Slag
2014-04-02, 01:40 PM
Maybe it will take Gary Numan and Gary Oldman working together to discover what's under Aequitas. Before Overlord returns from overturning Simon Le Bon's boat.

Death's Head
2014-04-03, 12:34 AM
Maybe the Magnificence is under Aequitas? And it's learned to move around, like the machine in the Mind of Evil?

Unicron
2014-04-03, 01:06 AM
I'm inclined to think no, as the Aequitas trials should have been a fair bit in the past, probably well before Hot Rod first acquired the thing. Even if Aequitas was built after it was found, it still had to be before his use of it during Revelation.

Unless what's under Aequitas is Fort Max's storage room and he keeps all sorts of random junk down there.

Death's Head
2014-04-03, 02:20 PM
The Transformers equivalent of Josef Fritzl? Frightening!

Osku
2014-04-16, 07:37 AM
Not sure where to ask this, but... I gave up waiting for TPB and read Dark Cybertron on comixology, IMHO not worth it by the way. :-(

Stupid question I quess, but how much is a just released MTMTE issue on comixology? Does the price drop at certain time?

Prices for IDW back catalogue seem to differ a lot. I am almost tempted to purchase Ironhide mini as it was under 5 euros. :o

Denyer
2014-04-16, 10:58 PM
The Ironhide mini isn't really worth reading if someone pays you, unless it's a lot.

Terome
2014-04-17, 02:35 PM
It really is a hot mess under that very nice Casey Collier artwork.