View Single Post
Old 2015-10-23, 09:19 PM   #47
Warcry
Likes Beast Wars toys. A lot.
 
Warcry's Avatar
 
Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by inflatable dalek View Post
Blimey, I knew Picard was about a decade older than Stewart, but I didn't know Riker went the other way. Alaska must have some hard living if he was only in his twenties in season 1.
I was shocked when I found out how young Patrick Stewart was at the start of TNG. As a youngster I figured him for, like, sixty and the poor man wasn't even fifty yet. But then he didn't age a day for two decades, so I suppose he won out in the end.

Quote:
Originally Posted by inflatable dalek View Post
I wonder if Data spent a lot of time on Aquiel style one or two man deep space assignments with a lot of monotonous routine? He'd seem suited to it and would explain his lack of social development, plus you never really hear anything about his prior crews ulike Picard, Riker and Geordi.
I could see him being suited for that, and crucially not trying to get out of that duty like a human officer would. But we're also told that he spend a lot of time on the Trieste when he was younger, so he wasn't entirely isolated the whole time.

Quote:
Originally Posted by inflatable dalek View Post
Plus Picard, who was all "Holding Worf accountable for the crimes of his Dad is a dick move" is genuinely remorseful and feels responsibility. I always suspect Old Indian guy was just playing him.
Oh, he was definitely playing him. Picard usually wouldn't have been vulnerable to that sort of manipulation, but he was already so uncomfortable about forcing the colonists from their homes that he left himself uncharacteristically open to it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by inflatable dalek View Post
Mind, them keeping the same basic shape and class designations doesn't mean there weren't drastic changes to the designs as they went along. An Enterprise B style Excelsior (and isn't it odd how we went all the way to the fourth season of DS9 without seeing one of those in the 24th century? Killing Kirk must have really put a dampener on enthusiasm for the extra fins) could hold its own against the only year and a bit old dedicated warship Defiant so it's presumably more modern than it looks.
You picked a perfect example to illustrate, actually -- the Lakota spent the time between dropping Sisko and Odo off at Earth and fighting the Defiant in drydock getting outfitted with new tactical systems (including quantum torpedoes). I'd imagine the Movie-vintage ships had gone through several cycles of upgrades over the decades, though the base hardware doesn't seem to have changed too much. The biggest changes we saw were the different weapons pods that the Miranda-class ships carried, nowhere near the complete teardown-and-rebuild that the first Enterprise got before the movie era (after, what, 25 years in service?).

Though both ships were pulling their punches in that battle, what with not wanting to murder their fellow officers, so it's hard to draw too much of a conclusion from it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by inflatable dalek View Post
Is the Nebula not supposed to be an interim class as well? I know we don't see it until well into the run of TNG but the look of the one Data took over in Redemption made it feel like an older ship to me.
Well, looks-wise it definitely comes off as a contemporary to the Galaxy-class. The saucer, deflector and nacelles are all but identical. If it was meant to be an older design, those probably would have been patterned after the Enterprise-C instead. Bits of barely-seen info like the ships' dedication plaques also seem to indicate that they were built around the same time as their larger counterparts (notably, the one that Data commanded was apparently only built the year before, sinking my long-held "Picard's fleet were ships that were damaged at Wolf 359" theory).

Quote:
Originally Posted by inflatable dalek View Post
It's especially impressive considering it took years to build the Enterprise D, Starfleet must have been really slacking.
You'd have to imagine that the smaller ships took a lot less time to build, though. They could probably slap a Defiant together in a couple months' time, build a new Intrepid-class inside a year, etc. The bigger ships would naturally take a bit longer. Notably, behind-the-scenes info at the time of First Contact said that the Enterprise-E had been under construction since before the TV show ended, under another name, and only had "Enterprise" slapped on at the last minute after they foolishly let Troi drive the old one.

(On a similar note, I hope Brazilians hadn't been lobbying Starfleet command to name a ship "Sao Paulo" for very long...)

Actually, all the new ships they built for the war probably goes a long way to explain the quick promotions for folks like Nog. Not only were they losing experienced officers in battle, but with so many new ships rolling off the lines they had to promote junior officers to fill all of the newly-available command positions.

Though what always breaks my immersion with that line of thought is the Enterprise crew. Starfleet's hippy "do what makes you happy" attitude towards promotions surely would have been put aside when the future of the Federation was at stake, so why didn't they forcibly promote Riker, Data and maybe Geordi as well into positions where their experience would have been more valuable? Riker should have been put into command of his own ship even if they had to staple him to the captain's chair to keep him there, and Data's android brain should have been put to use in the war office analysing Dominion fleet movements (La Forge, I'd imagine, would become Picard's XO in that scenario). I mean, shit, they had science officer Jadzia Dax commanding a warship, so obviously they were hard up for experienced hands.

Quote:
Originally Posted by inflatable dalek View Post
Of course, by the time those other races started showing up the Ferengi backstory was well on the way to being retconned so they'd been around and known for years (I think there's even a Voyager episode with a line about them visiting Wall Street before the end of capitalism).
Yeah, it certainly got to seem like the Ferengi had known Hu-mons for a lot longer than humans knew them. Picard and co. didn't even know what they looked like!

It's a shame actually...as much as I love the comedy ultra-capitalist Ferengi that DS9 gave us, the idea of a powerful alien empire that the Federation only knew through rumour was an interesting one. Seeing Starfleet and the Ferengi expanding into the same regions of space, building towards a first contact confrontation that neither of them really wanted but both knew were inevitable, would have been cool.

You know, if the Ferengi had been treated with any respect at all by the writers. How much crack must Gene have been smoking to think they would have been taken seriously as an adversary?

Quote:
Originally Posted by inflatable dalek View Post
Interesting, I'd always thought that was a producer choice to keep them in the tighter one-piece uniform throughout.
That's what I would have thought, but no, from what I read it was the ladies' choice.

Quote:
Originally Posted by inflatable dalek View Post
It might be that was the closest "Hero" uniform they had, the extras costumes are often less detailed/well made (though it'd be hard to do that with DS9 jumpsuit). If only they hadn't wasted money making a load of new uniforms they never used.
Did they ever say why they didn't use them? I'm actually quite fond of that look...they're like a blending of the TNG and TWOK designs. They're more "dress uniform" than "everyday attire", but it would have been nice to see them at some point.

Quote:
Originally Posted by inflatable dalek View Post
The uniform thing in Generations is really odd. Defenders say that Star Fleet has two uniform types and wearing both on the same ship makes sense and is more like real navies. Which is fine, but completely at odds with the rest of Trek where everyone on the same ship wears the same uniform at all times.

it actually looks like they're in the middle of changing over to the new regular uniform (something backed up by Voayger using it. Was DS9 trying out the look before it was rolled out fleetwide? Mind, DS9 continued to use the TNG outfits for "Not We" officers) and everyone doesn't quite manage to start wearing it on the same day.
I always figured that the TNG outfit was Starfleet's more formal variant, while the DS9 one was the "hard work, roll up your sleeves" attire. We do see something like that in the TOS films and early TNG, I think, with engineering crews sometimes wearing what looks like a futuristic utility jumpsuit. I figured that the DS9 crew just wore the more relaxed outfit all the time because they were out on the frontier and nobody cared. But Picard and co. were the super-important flagship constantly meeting new people and acting as a diplomatic face for the Federation, and the captain probably didn't want them doing that in their pajamas.

Quote:
Originally Posted by inflatable dalek View Post
Burton had been working to get rid of the visor since at least season 2 (there's a couple of scenes with Pulaski establishing they could do it just in case the producers decided to agree), he hated not being able to use his eyes. Though you can see his normal pupils through it in at least one scene in Generations, so that may have factored into as well.
Yeah, the thing looked ridiculously uncomfortable and apparently caused some pretty serious headaches too, so I'm not surprised the actor wanted to get rid of it. And as cool as it looked, it was the farthest from "high-tech" considering Data has fully-functional artificial eyes that actually look like eyes.

Quote:
Originally Posted by inflatable dalek View Post
The fact he could always be rendered helpless with a good slap to the face was always a bit of a design flaw anyway, especially with the number of intruders who made it to engineering and would start throwing him about.
I always figured he should have had the thing on a lanyard attached to his uniform, or something. All the times that he patted around for it on the ground could easily have been avoided.

Quote:
Originally Posted by inflatable dalek View Post
I always though it was odd that, with the full range of special sight the visor gave him, the thing didn't have a setting for "Normal" sight as well. Even something as simple as a 1980's TV picture would probably be more useful than seeing the entire spectrum all the time.
It's especially silly twenty years on, since we've got better vision prosthetics right now than they apparently will 300 years in the future (albeit still highly experimental).

Quote:
Originally Posted by inflatable dalek View Post
Did Geordi not have his normal eyes still in Nemesis? It says a lot about his role that I've never noticed they went back to the implants...
I always thought he did, until I read a few books that said he didn't. Then I went back and looked at some screenshots, and it does indeed look like he's got the implants in Nemesis. According to Memory Alpha he knew that he'd loose his eyes again if they stopped the Son'a, but I don't remember anything at all like that in the movie itself and don't feel like dragging out my VCR from the basement and watching the movie on tape to find out.
 
Warcry is online now   Reply With Quote