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Old 2012-04-20, 06:24 AM   #41
inflatable dalek
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It's not so much that comic companies aren't willing to pay for good ideas (though the average slush pile being 98% crap is another reason for ignoring the thing, as is the amount of time it would take to work through), it's to protect writers from acusations of palgerism.
 
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Old 2012-04-20, 02:37 PM   #42
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It's not so much that comic companies aren't willing to pay for good ideas (though the average slush pile being 98% crap is another reason for ignoring the thing, as is the amount of time it would take to work through), it's to protect writers from acusations of palgerism.
But a writer will only be accused on plagarism if SOMEONE CALLS THEM OUT ON IT.

Like i said, im sure a small "based on an idea by *insert fan's name*" credit would be more than enough to please a fan who just wants his idea out for people to see. At least thats the impression i get talking to fans at cons.

THey dont want the money or the takings from a plagarism lawsuit. They just want their idea to be acknowledged.
 
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Old 2012-04-20, 04:25 PM   #43
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But this hypothetical fan wouldn't be credited or paid, the entire source of their complaint would be that they'd had their idea stolen. It happens a lot, especially to anyone who has money (Spielberg, Rowling and Stephen King have all been accused at various times. David Gerrold talks on the More Tribbles, More Troubles commentary for the Animated Trek episode how a fan he'd met on a studio tour tried to sue him for stealing the idea even though it had already been in production when they met and Gerrold told him this repeatedly when he kept saying "You should do a Tribbles episode").

Whether people are out to make a quick buck or genuinely don't realise there are only so many ideas out there (especially in franchises where the obvious thing is always going to be to bring back character or concept X) writers and creators need to protect themselves against the possibility, because if nothing else it gets tedious real fast. Plus it's fairer for anyone who might have a legitimate case not to have to be surrounded by cranks all the time.
 
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Old 2012-04-20, 06:08 PM   #44
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Yeh, the big problem is that it could well not be their idea. If James Roberts was planning to - I dunno - unveil Jetfire as one of the 13 and I PM'd him a message with the same idea, should he credit me? Should he ****, and more power to him.

I would suspect a lot of pro writers value their craft more highly than lifting ideas from fans anyway. And can you imagine the emails, letters, PMs and posts writers would get pitched the second one "Inspired by [some fan]" credit appeared in one of IDW's comics?
 
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Old 2012-04-20, 06:43 PM   #45
Cyberstrike nTo
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Originally Posted by inflatable dalek View Post
But this hypothetical fan wouldn't be credited or paid, the entire source of their complaint would be that they'd had their idea stolen. It happens a lot, especially to anyone who has money (Spielberg, Rowling and Stephen King have all been accused at various times. David Gerrold talks on the More Tribbles, More Troubles commentary for the Animated Trek episode how a fan he'd met on a studio tour tried to sue him for stealing the idea even though it had already been in production when they met and Gerrold told him this repeatedly when he kept saying "You should do a Tribbles episode").

Whether people are out to make a quick buck or genuinely don't realise there are only so many ideas out there (especially in franchises where the obvious thing is always going to be to bring back character or concept X) writers and creators need to protect themselves against the possibility, because if nothing else it gets tedious real fast. Plus it's fairer for anyone who might have a legitimate case not to have to be surrounded by cranks all the time.
The legendary sci-fi author Harlan Ellison successfully sued James Cameron for plageism (I think it was that or copyright infringment) over the first Terminator movie. He claimed that Cameron ripped the idea off a couple of episodes of The Outer Limits that Ellison wrote. That is why before the end credits in T-1 it says "we acknowledge the works of Harlan Ellison" (or something to that effect) because that was part of the settlement.
 
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Old 2012-04-21, 01:01 AM   #46
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Originally Posted by inflatable dalek View Post
But this hypothetical fan wouldn't be credited or paid, the entire source of their complaint would be that they'd had their idea stolen. It happens a lot, especially to anyone who has money (Spielberg, Rowling and Stephen King have all been accused at various times. David Gerrold talks on the More Tribbles, More Troubles commentary for the Animated Trek episode how a fan he'd met on a studio tour tried to sue him for stealing the idea even though it had already been in production when they met and Gerrold told him this repeatedly when he kept saying "You should do a Tribbles episode").

Whether people are out to make a quick buck or genuinely don't realise there are only so many ideas out there (especially in franchises where the obvious thing is always going to be to bring back character or concept X) writers and creators need to protect themselves against the possibility, because if nothing else it gets tedious real fast. Plus it's fairer for anyone who might have a legitimate case not to have to be surrounded by cranks all the time.
PRECISELY they not credited hence why they go for a lawsuit

Quote:
The legendary sci-fi author Harlan Ellison successfully sued James Cameron for plageism (I think it was that or copyright infringment) over the first Terminator movie. He claimed that Cameron ripped the idea off a couple of episodes of The Outer Limits that Ellison wrote. That is why before the end credits in T-1 it says "we acknowledge the works of Harlan Ellison"
Doesnt this kinda prove that a small credit acknowledgement is enough?
If they had credited him from the start, there wouldnt be need for a lawsuit.

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Yeh, the big problem is that it could well not be their idea. If James Roberts was planning to - I dunno - unveil Jetfire as one of the 13 and I PM'd him a message with the same idea, should he credit me? Should he ****, and more power to him.
Depends on who came up with that idea first and how much of the ideas are similar.

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And can you imagine the emails, letters, PMs and posts writers would get pitched the second one "Inspired by [some fan]" credit appeared in one of IDW's comics?
as if they're not already.
 
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Old 2012-04-21, 09:29 AM   #47
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PRECISELY they not credited hence why they go for a lawsuit
So...err I'm not sure what your point is. The no reading solicitations thing is to protect them for unfair lawsuits so actual paid contributions have nothing to do with it. And if the resemblance is a coincidence no one is going to want to solve the problem by giving them money on a credit on a story they had nothing to do with,

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Doesnt this kinda prove that a small credit acknowledgement is enough?
If they had credited him from the start, there wouldnt be need for a lawsuit.[
A big pot of cash was involved with the Ellison lawsuit as well. And, whilst I respect his desire to protect his rights he's very litigation happy. The Terminator is inspired by all sorts of older SF works (much like Star Wars or The Matrix), most obviously the Philip K. Dick short story Second Variety, where instead of Arnie there's a little girl robot with a nuclear teddy bear. It's so similar to the future scenes in Terminator that part of the reason the film version Scanners (with Robocop as the lead) is so bad is it's jumping through hoops to be less like the Cameron film.

But Ellison was the only one to take action against the film, which Cameron partly brought upon himself by mentioning the inspiration that Outer Limits episode had on him. IRRC Ellison recently took action against a film he hadn't even seen because he decided it was ripping him off from the synopsis, though he did admit he was wrong in the end.
 
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Old 2012-04-22, 12:43 AM   #48
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Originally Posted by inflatable dalek View Post
So...err I'm not sure what your point is. The no reading solicitations thing is to protect them for unfair lawsuits so actual paid contributions have nothing to do with it. And if the resemblance is a coincidence no one is going to want to solve the problem by giving them money on a credit on a story they had nothing to do with,



A big pot of cash was involved with the Ellison lawsuit as well. And, whilst I respect his desire to protect his rights he's very litigation happy. The Terminator is inspired by all sorts of older SF works (much like Star Wars or The Matrix), most obviously the Philip K. Dick short story Second Variety, where instead of Arnie there's a little girl robot with a nuclear teddy bear. It's so similar to the future scenes in Terminator that part of the reason the film version Scanners (with Robocop as the lead) is so bad is it's jumping through hoops to be less like the Cameron film.

But Ellison was the only one to take action against the film, which Cameron partly brought upon himself by mentioning the inspiration that Outer Limits episode had on him. IRRC Ellison recently took action against a film he hadn't even seen because he decided it was ripping him off from the synopsis, though he did admit he was wrong in the end.
The screen writers of the orginal Alien ripped off of a 50s sci-fi film It! The Terror From Beyond Space supposedly when the screenwriter for It was asked why he didn't sue the writers of Alien he said: "Why should I? I ripped off the plots of other stories for It."
 
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