[BW,BM] question about bw

lord rayden · Post by **lord rayden** » Mon Mar 10, 2003 3:58 am

i know that this might sound a litttle stupid or something like that but thats ok

ok.. being that i have seen and read almost everything transformer and beea fan since 84. i was watching my eps of beast wars...the agenda part 1 to be exact and i noticed cybertron had a sun that had no been there before.. now in the ultimate doom it gets movies closer to earth then in rebirth it is right at the earth near the sun... well since bw happens appretnly thousands or millions of years from rebirth.. since there was no real mention of where the humans were in the bw time...
is it possible earth was destroyed during the ending of the great war and onl cybertron remained... ? even thugh beast machines had cybertron as being organic..... it couldnt of been earth since "iocon" was seen as being built over by new things on cybertron.. and of course no golden age so i guess the planet lost its power or something cause in bwand b, there seems to be no golden age left.... cybertron seems to be in the orbit of earth.. ... so what happened to earth and the humans.. where did they go ????? did cybertron get moved to a different orbit ? any thoughts.....

axio · Post by **axio** » Mon Mar 10, 2003 4:17 am

You could see Cybertron, therefore there had to be some light source... ergo a sun of some sort, I rest my case. Just because you never saw it before BW didn't mean it didn't exist.

Sixswitch · Post by **Sixswitch** » Mon Mar 10, 2003 12:21 pm

Perhaps the view of Earth was being blocked by Cybertron, or maybe it was in an opposite orbit (hidden by the sun).

But since Beast Wars doesn't follow on from a specific continuity (it makes reference to both comic and cartoon on occasions), who's to say that the events of rebirth actually happened in this timeline?

-Ss

lord rayden · Post by **lord rayden** » Mon Mar 10, 2003 3:34 pm

u have a point on that one. both replies so far do..There could of been a sun there... it could be any timeline.. in beast wars though.. the maximals didn't know about earth.. they refered to what was on the golden disk as a major energy source in beast wars part 1.. so who knows.. that is why a gap series between bw and 1 would of been nice

if rebirth happened in this timeline or not.. though with the way things are mentioned most of g1 seems to have happened....and since they reference unicron in possesion.. then at least up to the movie was in the timeline... and since rat trap mentions "rc".. u would think that everything up to rebirth happened... it might of stoped at the return of optimus prime.. if that one even happened in this time. line.. makes u think huh...

Death's Head · Post by **Death's Head** » Mon Mar 10, 2003 9:03 pm

In the original comic Cybertron was in orbit around Alpha Centauri before the war threw it out of orbit.

Of course, Globequake readers know that BW Cybertron *is* Earth anyway...

lord rayden · Post by **lord rayden** » Tue Mar 11, 2003 5:16 am

never read that one.. i might need to check it out.. but of course the comics usualy differ from the g1 tv timeline and bw tv timeline.. my question on that would be.. that since megatron figures out that the golden disk can lead them to a energy source "earth" why wouldnt they know if cybertron was earth millions of years later meaning something had to happen to the original cybertron now we have the whole transwarp plot which goes through time and space.. and since in bw u see the autobots on earth in the ark... and iin bm u see iocon where the autobots launched from in more then meets the eye.. how would that of been moved to earth.. i know the comics explain it well as far as after g1 and the final great war.. but if u were gonna explain it for the tc timeline going from beast wars.. to bm having cybertron being organic and having grass and stuff....

there is alot of stuff that the timeline away from the comics needs to be addressed. it would be nice to see a series happen to explain everything instead of continuing al these new spinoffs of alternative universes......even if they skip a million years or so to start the series but to at least bridge the gap and answer some questions " though i really don't see bm as being valid in the timeline.. but that is just perosnal opinion"

Computron · Post by **Computron** » Tue Mar 11, 2003 6:39 pm

Originally posted by lord rayden
never read that one.. i might need to check it out.. but of course the comics usualy differ from the g1 tv timeline and bw tv timeline.. my question on that would be.. that since megatron figures out that the golden disk can lead them to a energy source "earth" why wouldnt they know if cybertron was earth millions of years later meaning something had to happen to the original cybertron now we have the whole transwarp plot which goes through time and space.. and since in bw u see the autobots on earth in the ark

Globescape answers a lot of your questions, and if not Globescape then various other parts of the Transmasters universe

E Nice · Post by **E Nice** » Wed Mar 12, 2003 3:09 am

Originally posted by lord rayden
... in beast wars though.. the maximals didn't know about earth.. they refered to what was on the golden disk as a major energy source in beast wars part 1.. so who knows...

...my question on that would be.. that since megatron figures out that the golden disk can lead them to a energy source "earth" why wouldnt they know if cybertron was earth millions of years later meaning something had to happen to the original cybertron now we have the whole transwarp plot which goes through time and space..

Maybe they just forgot. The Transformers seem to have dodgy memories for robots with computers for brains.

They didn't seem to know the Quintessons were their creators or that they were ruled by them. Kup didn't recognize them and Blitzwing must have been stoned at the time as he couldn't place them either, only that they felt familiar to him.

The Autobots have no idea that A-3 is Alpha Trion.

The Autobots seem to have forgotten about their brethren, who fled Cybertron during one of its civil wars, and founded Paradron.

Optimus has no idea what the Matrix is supposed to do other than some passed down leader to leader legend that one day a chosen one will use it to light their darkest hour, not even knowing what that darkest hour threat might be.

The Insecticons have no idea who Megatron or the Decepticons are, other than they feel familiar, a kinship to them.

Megatron, seemingly forgetful or foolish, constantly keeps Starscream around no matter how many times he tried to usurp power, believing he's learned his lesson the last time.

Ultra Magnus doesn't even know his own birthday!

The Autobots seem to have forgotten their ability to fly.

One moment Starscream is a scientist the next he's getting lectured by Megatron on scientific discoveries.

The Autobots don't remember anything about the Hate plague.

No one seems to remember the Constructicons origins.

I'm sure there are even more examples.

lord rayden · Post by **lord rayden** » Wed Mar 12, 2003 12:59 pm

thats true..this is why discussion is fun... though to follow more on that.. since it is apparent that the matrix dosn't get held by the leaser of the maximals unless the maximal elders have it.."what happened to it.. since it is all around.. did it get released.. has it become supernatural.?" AS FAR as the bw timeline...

an intersting note.. even though the bw timeline is supposed to be after what happened in rebirth over millions of years..if u look at the japenese tf's the matrix just disapears.. now true rodimus takes it with him when he goes out to find a new homeworld.. and leaves fortres maximas incharge... and we never hear from them again really... (could rodimus kup and blur who go out looking for a new place be the maxiaml elders ?

also in zone.. the powered masters buildt zone... could zone of been the new cybertron ? since it had organic stuff on it... plus we know when victory saber puts dal atlias (or how ever u spell it) in charge there is no matrix.. ((( however the have the zodiak which is what they say created the earth and the universe...which is kinda intersting since that kills a god thery...

now of couse the japense series dosn't fit in most ways as far as tv timeline in beast wars.. or even bm,, stioll the cybertron has iocon in it in beat machines.. so i still see it as being the original..and if u think about it.. maybe bw timesline dosn't have what happened in rebirth in it.. it would make more sense...

just a thought

replies welcome

dan

joempn · Post by **joempn** » Sun Mar 16, 2003 12:40 pm

where can i read more about this Globescape?

Death's Head · Post by **Death's Head** » Sun Mar 16, 2003 2:36 pm

Globequake: http://www.warwithoutend.com

Go to the text stories section. It's freakin' great.

As for the Matrix - according to the writers of Beast Wars, on Cybertron there are two large factories which constructs protoforms and grants them life. The Maximals have 'The Matrix factory' and the Predacons have 'The Pit'.

Presumably, both factories tap into the Matrix in order to grant life.

Cliffjumper · Post by **Cliffjumper** » Sun Mar 16, 2003 7:00 pm

Matrix factory :/ Sound idea, though - some kind of 'holy' area where sparks fall to Cybertron, and are then put into bodies...

Optimus_Type-R · Post by **Optimus_Type-R** » Fri Mar 21, 2003 4:56 am

... (could rodimus kup and blur who go out looking for a new place be the maxiaml elders ?

Interesting point, I could see Kup being an elder, as he's already old enough, and maybe Blur althought he might be the old guy who nobody ever understands, but Rodimus? I don't know, he'd stil in his Elder chair and them complaine that maybe he's not good enough to sit there or that maybe he was wrond in leaving, yada yada.

Presumably, both factories tap into the Matrix in order to grant life.

Hold on.. so they're saying that the Preds can tap into the Matrix?? But doesn't that defeat the whole Idea of an Autobot matrix of leadership?

Death's Head · Post by **Death's Head** » Fri Mar 21, 2003 9:23 am

I suspect the writers were picking up on the comic idea of the Matrix, where it was not specific to Autobots (as in the past, even Decepticons were Autobots until they rebelled) and was the source of all life.

If it exists in the BW future, and the Maximals and Predacons have a peace agreement (Pax Cybertronia) then it stands to reason that they too would be allowed to procreate as much as any Maximal.

Cliffjumper · Post by **Cliffjumper** » Wed Mar 26, 2003 4:49 pm

Yeh, Primus was a God to all the Transformers... I would think the 'Cons just had different interpretations of him, like they did for The Last Autobot, aka Gary.

Cyberman · Post by **Cyberman** » Fri Apr 11, 2003 10:00 am

Originally posted by Optimus_Type-R
...Hold on.. so they're saying that the Preds can tap into the Matrix?? But doesn't that defeat the whole Idea of an Autobot matrix of leadership?

You´re mixing up "The Autobot Matrix of Leadership" and "The Creation Matrix".
The former´s just the collected knowledge of Autobot leaders, the latter´s the essence of Primus.
Also, the former´s cartoon, and the latter´s comic.

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[BW,BM] question about bw

question about bw

good points :)

hmmm

Re: hmmm

great reply :)--maximal elders