[TF:TM] What exactly is Unicron up to?
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[TF:TM] What exactly is Unicron up to?
Right, I was watching TF:TM with Sar the other day [we watched Dark Awakening to balance out the rubbishness of it all, don't you worry], and something struck me - what the Hell is Unicron up to? I mean, he could have pottered around the universe, casually wiping out the Lithones of the, erm, universe, having a whale of a time, but instead he heads for the Matrix, gives the Autobots several huge tip-offs as to how bloody important the Matrix is, before telling his evil want-away boy Galvatron its precise purpose and getting all blown up! Think about that... It's like Angel going to Mercury or something.
- Ultimate Weapon
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Actually unicron has no choice in the matter. He is a Saturn sized ball of metal floating through space. In the beginning we see how he is able to transport himself through space like a slingshot using the stars gravitational field. According to his calculations he had no other choice but to hurl him self into the Lithone planet and then onto Cybertron in his orbit around the galaxy. Whatever came his way he attempted to use to his advantage, like Megatron. I don't really know how he tips off the Autobots, but perhaps he should not have trusted so easily an alliance with a group whose root word is deceptive.
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Originally posted by Ultimate Weapon
I don't really know how he tips off the Autobots
Galvatron: DIE AUTOBOTS!
Random Autobot: Who the hell are you?
Galvatron: I am Galvatron, Herald of the Chaos-Bringer Unicron! Prepare to be destroyed!
*raises cannon to destroy Autobot*
Oh, by the way. On a completely unrelated note, you wouldn't happen to know where I could find the Autobot Matrix of Leadership, would you?
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Originally posted by Ultimate Weapon
Actually unicron has no choice in the matter. He is a Saturn sized ball of metal floating through space. In the beginning we see how he is able to transport himself through space like a slingshot using the stars gravitational field. According to his calculations he had no other choice but to hurl him self into the Lithone planet and then onto Cybertron in his orbit around the galaxy. Whatever came his way he attempted to use to his advantage, like Megatron. I don't really know how he tips off the Autobots, but perhaps he should not have trusted so easily an alliance with a group whose root word is deceptive.
Bloody Hell that's good!
And yeh, until Galvatron turns up with the big Matrix mad-on, the Autobots blatantly have no clue what it's for...
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hmm... that anyone would need to much help on that one is strangeOriginally posted by fort_max
Galvatron: DIE AUTOBOTS!
Random Autobot: Who the hell are you?
Galvatron: I am Galvatron, Herald of the Chaos-Bringer Unicron! Prepare to be destroyed!
*raises cannon to destroy Autobot*
Oh, by the way. On a completely unrelated note, you wouldn't happen to know where I could find the Autobot Matrix of Leadership, would you?
and now to go along with his convo: "umm... you want optimus prime not me"
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To actually say which candidate has the better Iraq policy is like saying which Twinkie is more healthy. -Ultimate Weapon
I'd totally hit that Krystal chick...if she were real and sex with animals wasn't illegal. -Drspengler
Trying to accomplish too much too quickly, and being over-confident. Sending agents after a loose end whilst he destroys the TF homeworld (which, as far as the cartoon goes, could be the source of one, two or a dozen matrix-like devices) is pure hastiness.Originally posted by Cliffjumper
what the Hell is Unicron up to?
As for why the matrix is capable of destroying him... it would seem to suggest shared heritage, possibly an ancient Quintesson device gone rogue. That's assuming Primacron is delusional, or possibly distantly connected to the Quints and previously some kind of hugely influential being such as Zifnab (Deathgate Cycle) or the Doctor, but at the time we see him in Call Of The Primitives, aged and infirm or simply amnesiac.
edit: BTW, have you read Lungbarrow? The Beeb have a load of eBooks up on their Dr Who site now...
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That's the basic problem, isn't it? Everything goes all Truman Show so we have a nice, totally unfeasible timescale to fit into a filmOriginally posted by Denyer
Trying to accomplish too much too quickly, and being over-confident. Sending agents after a loose end whilst he destroys the TF homeworld (which, as far as the cartoon goes, could be the source of one, two or a dozen matrix-like devices) is pure hastiness.
edit: BTW, have you read Lungbarrow? The Beeb have a load of eBooks up on their Dr Who site now...
Not since it was out, which wouldn't been about '96? Marc Platt, wasn't it? Very interesting, very different. Good show by the Beeb for resurrecting Virgin scripts by the sounds of things... Blood Harvest, Blood Heat [not related, just the way me memory works ], Human Nature, Cold Fusion, Sky Pirates!, Death and Diplomacy and anything by Steve Lyons [Conundrum, Head Games, The Killing Grounds] are worth a nose. So Vile a sin would have been a masterpiece if they hadn't let Kate bloody Orman finish the thing [Ben must've been too busy on Corrie ] - steer clear of anything by her, Parasite or anything a much-too-self-conscious pretentious title [GodEngine, Christmas on a Rational Planet]. Oh, and Russell T. Davis' one was utter crap too, which bodes well, as if employing Mr. Monoactor himself hadn't knackered the thing. I'll watch it for Billie anyway
- Grandmaster Shockwaeve
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Well we see in the attack on Cybertron that he is perfectly able to stop and propel himself rather quickly however he likes. In the comics, he's out to destroy the work of his enemy, Primus. Maybe here, after he's crippled Primacron, he's going after the rest of his creations, i.e. the primitives and their associates. But then he has to go and claim he considered sparing Cybertron, but that could have just been to stick it to Galvatron. Maybe he just really wanted to destroy the Matrix: if it is indeed the remains or the creation of Primacron's assistant, he might be compelled to try to destroy it despite the fact that going near it may guarantee its use.
Another possibility is that the Matrix energy can reach and harm him no matter where he is in the universe. In this case, it wouldn't be too out there to presume that, as he could see through time in the comics, he saw that in a possible future the hate plague would be unleashed and that the Matrix would be the cure, but also the death of him. Therefore he would have to be proactive in destroying it. Remember that it presumably cured the Sharkticons running around on whatever out-of-the-way corner of the universe the Quintessons were hiding in. But then his Primacron origin doesn't really mesh well with that.
Another possibility is that the Matrix energy can reach and harm him no matter where he is in the universe. In this case, it wouldn't be too out there to presume that, as he could see through time in the comics, he saw that in a possible future the hate plague would be unleashed and that the Matrix would be the cure, but also the death of him. Therefore he would have to be proactive in destroying it. Remember that it presumably cured the Sharkticons running around on whatever out-of-the-way corner of the universe the Quintessons were hiding in. But then his Primacron origin doesn't really mesh well with that.
This reminds me of point 49 of the Evil Overlord list which I just happened to re-read yesterday:
Why exactly does he send out Galavtron to bring the Matrix to him? What does he want to do with it? Eat it?
The best thing he could do would be telling Galvatron to "destroy Ultra Magnus and melt him and everything with him down to scrap metal". That would have been a lot more effective than "bring me the one thing I fear".
Besides, there's another problem I see with Unicron:If I learn the whereabouts of the one artifact which can destroy me, I will not send all my troops out to seize it. Instead I will send them out to seize something else and quietly put a Want-Ad in the local paper.
Why exactly does he send out Galavtron to bring the Matrix to him? What does he want to do with it? Eat it?
The best thing he could do would be telling Galvatron to "destroy Ultra Magnus and melt him and everything with him down to scrap metal". That would have been a lot more effective than "bring me the one thing I fear".
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Originally posted by Cliffjumper
So Vile a sin would have been a masterpiece if they hadn't let Kate bloody Orman finish the thing [Ben must've been too busy on Corrie ]
Apparently it was a combination of writters block and Ben accidently deleting everything he'd written from his hard drive...
The thing that most impressed me at the beebs site was the Shada remake... Considering Douglas Adams always claimed it was a bit substandard I was plesently suprised. Shame the budget couldn't stretch to proper animation mind....
Originally posted by Cliffjumper
Russell T. Davis' one was utter crap too, which bodes well, as if employing Mr. Monoactor himself hadn't knackered the thing. I'll watch it for Billie anyway
I'll be watching for Billie as well... In the hope they pull a Spooks and have an Auton drop her down a hole in the first episode...
As for the Unicron thing: The Lithonians were the galaxys biggest drug users, and after eating them it worked into his system resulting in him being out of his metal skull...
Incidently, is Primacons assistant supposed to be the Matrix or the blob of energy in the cave in COTP? And come to that, how much use as an assistant would either be to a scientist as they can't even hold a test tube...
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- Ultimate Weapon
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Originally posted by Nevermore
Besides, there's another problem I see with Unicron:
Why exactly does he send out Galavtron to bring the Matrix to him? What does he want to do with it? Eat it?
The best thing he could do would be telling Galvatron to "destroy Ultra Magnus and melt him and everything with him down to scrap metal". That would have been a lot more effective than "bring me the one thing I fear".
The matrix cannot be destroyed in such a fashion. Magnus was blown up holding it, therefore it did not die. Also Galvatron shoots at it when Rodimus is holding it at the end, with no effect. I think the only other time you can destroy it is at the end of TROOP. When its all worn out from saving the day.
That still doesn't explain why he orders Galvatron to bring it to him (with emphasis on "it is the only thing I fear").
Why not order him to throw it into a sun or hide it at the other end of the universe? And why tell Galvatron that he fears it? Tell him it would bestow Unicron with the ultimate power. That way, Galvatron would attempt to open it himself, or something... Probably far away from Unicron.
And why exactly did he wait for Galvatron to:
- Fly to Earth
- Attack Autobot city again
- Let the Autobots escape
- Attack the shuttles
- Track Ultra Magnus down to Junk
- Get the Matrix
- Return to Cybertron
before starting to devour Cybertron? It's not like it took him that long to munch the two moonbases...
Why not order him to throw it into a sun or hide it at the other end of the universe? And why tell Galvatron that he fears it? Tell him it would bestow Unicron with the ultimate power. That way, Galvatron would attempt to open it himself, or something... Probably far away from Unicron.
And why exactly did he wait for Galvatron to:
- Fly to Earth
- Attack Autobot city again
- Let the Autobots escape
- Attack the shuttles
- Track Ultra Magnus down to Junk
- Get the Matrix
- Return to Cybertron
before starting to devour Cybertron? It's not like it took him that long to munch the two moonbases...
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- Ultimate Weapon
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Please read my first post. Unicron does not strut through the cosmos as if taking a stroll through a park. He is bound by the gravitational forces of the galaxy. The destruction of the Lithone home world could have been years before 2005, when his orbit would have eclipsed Cybertrons solar system.
I don't remember Unicron saying any of those things. He basically says it stands in my way, bring it to me say that I may keep it. Also hurling it into a star would provide the Autobots with a recovering attempt. The only logical conclusion is to keep it safe with his body. Though he had not calculated his eye being popped out by a ship load of Autobots.
I don't remember Unicron saying any of those things. He basically says it stands in my way, bring it to me say that I may keep it. Also hurling it into a star would provide the Autobots with a recovering attempt. The only logical conclusion is to keep it safe with his body. Though he had not calculated his eye being popped out by a ship load of Autobots.
Xref comment about overconfidence—Unicron believes he can control Megatron entirely.Originally posted by Nevermore
Why not order him to throw it into a sun or hide it at the other end of the universe? And why tell Galvatron that he fears it?
I think it's just laconic sadism, personally, unless he knows that the matrix is a unique artifact.Originally posted by Grandmaster Shockwaeve
he has to go and claim he considered sparing Cybertron, but that could have just been to stick it to Galvatron. Maybe he just really wanted to destroy the Matrix:
It isn't destroyed—just dissipated. Prime uses the shell to link to Vector Sigma in Rebirth.Originally posted by Ultimate Weapon
I think the only other time you can destroy it is at the end of TROOP. When its all worn out from saving the day.
The Matrix is a multi-purpose tool, whichever continuity you're in—it could be compared to an AD&D artifact, with minor and major powers. It's a receptacle of communicable wisdom, for one thing, so that data/energy can be refilled. In the movie, we saw it emit energy rather than dissipate, which was quite probably a different form of energy. We also know it can physically reshape Transformers to a limited degree.
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Originally posted by Nevermore
The best thing he could do would be telling Galvatron to "destroy Ultra Magnus and melt him and everything with him down to scrap metal". That would have been a lot more effective than "bring me the one thing I fear".
It could have survived that.
Besides, wouldn´t that show how afraid he is? Saying "Destroy it but don´t dare to come near me with it" seems rather weak IMO.
Maybe he thought that the safest place for it would be inside him.
Didn´t Unicron only realize it´s existence when it was passed from Prime to Magnus?
So perhaps it´s radiation has been shielded till then, and he suddenly became aware that there is something that could hurt him.
In a perfect world, this would be a signature. As it stands, it's just the lack of.
Originally posted by Cliffjumper Not since it was out, which wouldn't been about '96? Marc Platt, wasn't it? Very interesting, very different. Good show by the Beeb for resurrecting Virgin scripts by the sounds of things... Blood Harvest, Blood Heat [not related, just the way me memory works ], Human Nature, Cold Fusion, Sky Pirates!, Death and Diplomacy and anything by Steve Lyons [Conundrum, Head Games, The Killing Grounds] are worth a nose. So Vile a sin would have been a masterpiece if they hadn't let Kate bloody Orman finish the thing [Ben must've been too busy on Corrie ] - steer clear of anything by her, Parasite or anything a much-too-self-conscious pretentious title [GodEngine, Christmas on a Rational Planet]. Oh, and Russell T. Davis' one was utter crap too, which bodes well, as if employing Mr. Monoactor himself hadn't knackered the thing. I'll watch it for Billie anyway
You mostly have good taste in Doctor Who stuff. However, Kate Orman is a really good writer. One of her who books won some Australian Science Fiction prize, and I've not failed to enjoy any of hers. I liked Russell T. Davis's one, though I can see how it's not everyone's taste. Lance Parkin, Paul Cornell, Gareth Roberts and Jonathan Morris are other Who authors whose books are all exceptional.
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i hope this hasn't been said before
he should have gotten a hold of the evil overlord list
wasn't one of them that if you realize something can destroy your power, go after something else and put a want ad in the paper?
wasn't one of them that if you realize something can destroy your power, go after something else and put a want ad in the paper?
Words suck. Down with words! -saysadie
To actually say which candidate has the better Iraq policy is like saying which Twinkie is more healthy. -Ultimate Weapon
I'd totally hit that Krystal chick...if she were real and sex with animals wasn't illegal. -Drspengler
To actually say which candidate has the better Iraq policy is like saying which Twinkie is more healthy. -Ultimate Weapon
I'd totally hit that Krystal chick...if she were real and sex with animals wasn't illegal. -Drspengler