The next Encore reissue: Cassettes set 3 - Rumble, Frenzy, Laserbeak and Overkill

Nevermore · Post by **Nevermore** » Tue Jul 14, 2009 10:15 pm

http://www.bigbadtoystore.com/bbts/prod ... ode=retail

EDIT: Is that Buzzsaw or Laserbeak? Buzzsaw was already included in the first Cassette four-pack, but Laserbeak came with Encore Soundwave...

Rattrap's tail · Post by **Rattrap's tail** » Wed Jul 15, 2009 1:16 am

As far as I can see, it's Laserbeak.

Post by **Clay** » Wed Jul 15, 2009 1:22 am

Well, seems like Takara do still have the Rumble/Frenzy mold. Color me surprised.

burnitall · Post by **burnitall** » Wed Jul 15, 2009 1:35 am

I guess I could use a Frenzy and a Rumble. The dinosaur can sit in Soundwave's chest. Already have Laserbeak, so... I'll have a spare.

Savannahtron · Post by **Savannahtron** » Wed Jul 15, 2009 1:49 am

Don't know, looks cool.

Cliffjumper · Post by **Cliffjumper** » Wed Jul 15, 2009 4:44 am

Clay wrote:Well, seems like Takara do still have the Rumble/Frenzy mold. Color me surprised.

I wonder if Encore sales justified repair or something? Or are we just giving Takara too much credit to suggest they'd have had the sense to spread the recolours out? Maybe they pinched a set back off the bootleggers?

-Blackout- · Post by **-Blackout-** » Wed Jul 15, 2009 8:01 am

YES.

Oh, right, I have to get Soundwave first.

Nevermore · Post by **Nevermore** » Wed Jul 15, 2009 9:31 am

Story I've been told: A certain intern at Hasbro was asked to find out when each of the cassettes molds (for the Hasbro Toy Shop/SDCC esclusive Soundwave reissue) was used for the last time. Said intern then used the Transformers Wiki for reference and came up with a list of ALL cassette molds and their last uses.

That's what I've been told. It's speculated that Hasbro then shared the list with Takara, and Takara was able to find the molds.

Keep in mind the following: We're talking about several heavy blocks of steel here, stored in a warehouse full of nothing but heavy blocks of steel that are used for a large variety of different toylines. Also keep in mind that these blocks of steel all look the same from the outside, and they're probably not labeled "TRANSFORMERS 1984 RUMBLE HANDS AND FEET" in large, bright letters.

Presumably, not even all Transformers molds are stold in the same warehouse. Just keeping track of which mold is stored where exactly sounds like a full-time job.

So is it really a wonder that these things get misplaced on occasion? Might even just be that the "arms/head" mold for a toy gets misplaced, even though the "legs/torso" mold is still available.

Anyway. I assume that's just it. Takara didn't know where the molds were, intern gave Hasbro a hint where to look.

Halfshell · Post by **Halfshell** » Wed Jul 15, 2009 1:51 pm

Nevermore wrote:EDIT: Is that Buzzsaw or Laserbeak? Buzzsaw was already included in the first Cassette four-pack, but Laserbeak came with Encore Soundwave...

The condor is definitely Laserbeak... er, Condor. The cassette, however, at first glance, appears to be Buzzsaw. But don't hold me to that.

I remember about seven years ago putting them both next to each other on a scanner in order to settle a similar dispute, but no longer have either of them... can't recall if the coloured bits on Buzzsaw are orange or gold... if gold, then that's definitely Laserbeak in the pic.

[/in no way helpful]

Cliffjumper · Post by **Cliffjumper** » Wed Jul 15, 2009 2:20 pm

Nevermore wrote:Also keep in mind that these blocks of steel all look the same from the outside, and they're probably not labeled "TRANSFORMERS 1984 RUMBLE HANDS AND FEET" in large, bright letters.

Then that's a really, really stupid system. IIRC, Bandai keep them filed by an overall product number that was initially on a filing card system, then digitised later when the tech got there (apparently there were pictures of the Popy mould warehouses at the now-defunct Bandai museum). I'd say it's no harder than archiving just about anything else - mark it clearly and have a system as you go on.

Suppose the irony there is that Bandai hardly ever need to reuse old moulds, instead having the money to do new ones... I think there's only been one instance of possible mould damage come out from Bandai (Print Lightan), and that's unconfirmed. Compare that to a fair chunk of early TFs, several of which they seem to have lost relatively recently...

Halfshell · Post by **Halfshell** » Wed Jul 15, 2009 2:26 pm

Cliffjumper wrote:I'd say it's no harder than archiving just about anything else - mark it clearly and have a system as you go on.

Mmm. And when you consider that these people are in the business of professionally making toys, you'd expect them to have a reliable way of keeping tabs on their assets.

Even the BBC manage to run a coherent archive. Okay, it took them a while to cotton onto the notion that it might be a worthwhile practise, but they got there eventually.

Cliffjumper · Post by **Cliffjumper** » Wed Jul 15, 2009 2:42 pm

Well, from what I gather the BBC's paper archive was pretty impressive. It was the way they chucked out the corresponding rolls of film that let it down - IIRC, a lot of stuff was still being offered to overseas channels for a while after it had been dumped in a landfill.

The BBC are, arguably, not the sort of model you want to follow.

The thing is just about any argument you can bring up to excuse Takara's slapdash behaviour ("It was just a toyline, how were they to know someone would still want the mould in 30 years' time?") can also be applied to Bandai, so you're led to the inevitable conclusion that Takara just do not give a shit and have zero pride in their work.

Of course, if you'd bought much of their output in the past decade or so, you'd know that anyway.

What is the current dead list? Mirage, Sunstreaker, Wheeljack, the Dinobots, Devastator, some possible Scramble City combiners (everyone but the Combaticons?)... And that's just what we know about - whether the mould for, say, Getaway or Skyhammer still survives isn't likely to be something we ever find out about. And I still maintain that whatever the bootleggers have is as good as the moulds used for Encore in terms of retaining detail and definition compared to the originals.

Post by **Clay** » Wed Jul 15, 2009 3:59 pm

Nevermore wrote:Presumably, not even all Transformers molds are stold in the same warehouse. Just keeping track of which mold is stored where exactly sounds like a full-time job.

So is it really a wonder that these things get misplaced on occasion? Might even just be that the "arms/head" mold for a toy gets misplaced, even though the "legs/torso" mold is still available.

The thing is, it should be someone's full time job to keep track of and maintain a current archive of where the molds are, given that the molds for their toys are the kernel of Takara's business.

Anyway. I assume that's just it. Takara didn't know where the molds were, intern gave Hasbro a hint where to look.

Unfortunately, that seems likely.

Nevermore · Post by **Nevermore** » Wed Jul 15, 2009 4:05 pm

I don't know what storage archiving system Hasbro use exactly. I do assume, however, that any "lost"/"MIA" molds probably disappeared in the mid-1990s, when Hasbro couldn't care less to keep track of all those toys from the line that had tanked in the USA. There were the G1 "Classic" reissues in Europe in the early 90s, the Chinese releases from the mid-90s (which are often comfused with the recent Chinese counterfeit bootlegs)... Some stuff might have just been misfiled after a warehose move or two.

Just look at how many molds Hasbro and Takara are still able to use. It shouldn't be a surprise that one or two of them have vanished off the radar.

Cliffjumper · Post by **Cliffjumper** » Wed Jul 15, 2009 4:20 pm

There's a difference between something being a surprise and something being acceptable - I'm not surprised because Takara are a two-bit operation, or that they have such contempt for their engineers' work as to lose a chunk of it - this might be a factor in why they can only attract the club-handed buffons who come up with Masterpiece Megatron, the Unicron Trilogy, Cat-Car and all the other shit we've had the past decade, while Bandai can attract the guys who can come up with Soul of Chogokin.

As long as you can come up with excuses for idiocy and mediocrity, idiocy and mediocrity are what you're going to have.

Actually, do we have a figure for how many moulds Hasbro/Takara do have? How many moulds from, say, the 1980s have been reused the past decade? Fifty-ish? 75? How's that as a percentage? Can we assume they only junked the earlier stuff? It also seems strange that either party neglected the moulds so soon after they'd just been reused (twice in some cases - Optimus Prime, Jazz, Inferno, Sideswipe, Slag, Grimlock, Snarl)... So they left the things there unused for, say, five years, dusted them off for 1990, put them back, dusted them off again in 1993, then Transformers went for two years without a TV series (having previously been off-air for, what... two years?) and they let some interns have at the things with pick-axes or whatever? Or where they stolen by farsighted Chinese ninjas who'd later prove that it's pretty easy to exceed Takara's engineering technology? How did, say, Ironhide survive where Sunstreaker didn't?

Cliffjumper · Post by **Cliffjumper** » Wed Jul 15, 2009 4:26 pm

Hah, never mind about any of that! The bootleggers are doing Sunstreaker! Takara can continue dropping unmarked moulds in a big pile in the middle of a lock-up in downtown Tokyo or wherever, thankfully there are some people out there who can do something about this. Best part? At no point in the cycle of me buying that thing when it hits will any money go to Takara.

Post by **Clay** » Wed Jul 15, 2009 7:26 pm

Cliffjumper wrote:Cat-Car

YOU TAKE THTA BACKK. I LOVE THE CARCAT

As for the rest of it, carry on...

Cliffjumper · Post by **Cliffjumper** » Wed Jul 15, 2009 7:47 pm

Clay wrote:YOU TAKE THTA BACKK. I LOVE THE CARCAT

Alright, fair enough, it was the best thing in the M.A.S.K. toyline by far. We'll riff on Catbot instead.

"Hmm, I think our first Ravage figure was maybe a bit silly, what with it being a robot with a cat head. How's about a car with a cat head?"

"Brilliant! And when that fails, we'll just put Masterpiece Convoy"

Which I actually kinda want now I've seen this picture. Hopefully that's just the forest scene in ROTF talking...

Post by **inflatable dalek** » Thu Jul 16, 2009 6:30 am

Personally I'm looking forward to the E Hobby cartoon accurate repaints.

Nevermore · Post by **Nevermore** » Thu Jul 16, 2009 7:36 am

inflatable dalek wrote:Personally I'm looking forward to the E Hobby cartoon accurate repaints.

Rumble and Frenzy? The Japanese dub actually made them toy-accurate. The problem doesn't exist in Japan.