Starscream v Ultra Magnus in alternate Season three

Starscreamer · Post by **Starscreamer** » Thu Jun 13, 2002 12:38 am

Imagine if Unicron had never been.....Starscream has finally desposed of Megatron and been crowned leader of all Decepticons! Meanwhile Autobot City lies in ruins, Optimus Prime is dead, and the matrix has been passed to Ultra Magnus! From a militaristic point of view and an OVERALL point of view how do you think the war would have progressed under these conditions. I will also add a poll asking who would win the Great War in the end without Unicron would the Autobots have been able to take over Cybertron???

Blaster_86 · Post by **Blaster_86** » Thu Jun 13, 2002 12:43 am

Yes the Autobots would have been able to, because either way you look at it, Hot Rod would have ended up with the Matrix and lit the Autobots Darkest hour to become Rodimus Prime. Because of the Matrix Autobots win either way. But military wise the Decepticons would win.

Dinobot · Post by **Dinobot** » Thu Jun 13, 2002 12:50 am

The Decepticons would win. Ultra Magnus just isn't a born leader and by that time the Autobots would have been too weak. Not only that but with Autobot City in ruins and the Decepticons having conquered Cybertron, the Autobots have no base! The only question is would Starscream be a good leader?

Dare · Post by **Dare** » Thu Jun 13, 2002 1:31 am

autobots have died but don't forget we never get the new decepticons so thundercracker, skywarp and the insecticons are dead too. the autobots have no opposition any more when you consider that in the movie the only threat came from the new decepticons.

nmathew · Post by **nmathew** » Thu Jun 13, 2002 6:31 pm

I think the Autobots would have pulled it off. While the Cons were in control of Cybertron, did they have any fuel? I don't know of anything that would have changed from the end of season 2 to the movie. Autobot city was in ruins, but Prime and the Autobots had routed the Decepticons.

I think Ultra Magnus is being judged harshly here. He did suckit up in the movie, but I think he would have quickly became a great leader. Starscream would have still needed to consolidate power. I don't know how many were firmly behind him at his coronation, but on Astrotrain, it was clear that several of the Cons wanted the leadership position.
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sprites touch · Post by **sprites touch** » Fri Jun 14, 2002 12:02 pm

The autobots were still demoralized due to optimus's death, and with autobot city in ruins, the only outposts they have are the 2 moonbases which can be easily taken (2 puny bots on each). I suspect starscream would make a quick recovery, since the gravely wounded were toused out to spce, so his troops are in good condition. We see him corenated so eventually he's excepted as the leader (at least untill the autobots are delt with).
Magnus is no leader, and without unicron I doubt rody would get a chance at the matrix (I wouldn't count the cons attack as a darkest hour, but who knows).
The cons might spare the bots (seeing them as insignificant and no longer a threat), and a resistance might arise in time, but ultimetly, the cons reign of the galaxy would be long and lasting.

Blitzwing · Post by **Blitzwing** » Fri Jun 14, 2002 10:01 pm

The Decepticons didn't have a leader. Starscream would have been usurped within twenty minutes of when he said, "My fellow Decepticons..."

There would have been chaos within the Decepticon ranks and the Autobots would be able to regroup and finish off what was left of the Decepticons after they had all sufficiantly beaten each other down.

ThunderCracker84 · Post by **ThunderCracker84** » Fri Jun 14, 2002 10:16 pm

first off, if you take away galvatron, you take away Cyclonus, Scourge and the Sweeps also, which is a major hit to decepticon military cause in season three none of them reallly did anything besides them. Secondly, Magnus would have wiped the floor with Starscream, that is if Starscream could stay in control which he wouldnt have cause either Soundwave or Shockwave would have taken rule from him. So basically Starscream would have failed as a leader, and the autobots would have won

sprites touch · Post by **sprites touch** » Sat Jun 15, 2002 2:14 am

I'm sure screamer had some plan to keep the conds loyale, after all he knows all to well about tretury, also if the cons followed Megs (which some like Devastator could dispose of) who was foolish enough to keep Screamer around all this time, they aren't exactly that brilliant and screamer would smooth talk them into following (like he did with Megs to pare him every single time).
All it comes down to is a race to regroup and recover from the battle at autobot city, who ever pulls it off first is the victor, the autobots have alot of their focus on the wounded and suvivors, while the cons have no such liability. As I recall Screamer was a good strategist (with or without a diploma from the cons war academy), while Magnus was a soldier not a general, and alot of the bots veterans died on that shuttles (corection- sloterd), the bots still have kup as strategy and the dinos as muscle.
here's a difrent idea, who'd win if after primes-megs battle, the cons didn't retreat and continued fighting?

Blaster_86 · Post by **Blaster_86** » Sat Jun 15, 2002 2:45 am

Originally posted by sprites touch
who'd win if after primes-megs battle, the cons didn't retreat and continued fighting?

Bots since eventully the Autobots at the Ark would have arrived with omega supreme and the rest.

GeneralObsidian · Post by **GeneralObsidian** » Sat Jun 15, 2002 9:14 am

Originally posted by Galvatron84
The Decepticons would win. Ultra Magnus just isn't a born leader and by that time the Autobots would have been too weak. Not only that but with Autobot City in ruins and the Decepticons having conquered Cybertron, the Autobots have no base! The only question is would Starscream be a good leader?

No base? There were the two moon bases (would stil be there without Unicron), and the Ark. The City may have been in ruins, but it wasn't completely wiped out. The Autobots were even in the midsts of rebuilding when Galvatron attacked. Starscream would have been assassinated, or at the very least ousted. Depending upon who later took up the Decepticon leadership mantel, Magnus would have led the Autobots to victory or to ruin. But I'm sure Starscream would have been eliminated at some point or another.

Lord Zarak · Post by **Lord Zarak** » Sat Jun 15, 2002 9:48 am

Starscream wouldnt have been able to hold as leader of the Deceps. Someone would dispose of him, and take over. But theyd still lose to Magnus

BlueBlaster · Post by **BlueBlaster** » Sat Jun 15, 2002 11:32 am

I think Autobots would win and the Decepticons would destroy Starscream for bringing up the defeat.

Dinobot · Post by **Dinobot** » Sat Jun 15, 2002 11:54 am

No base? There were the two moon bases (would stil be there without Unicron), and the Ark.

The Moon Bases aren't much are they? Which Autobots are guarding them? Bumblebee and Spike on one and Jazz and Cliffjumper on the other. Not the most fierce of Autobots are they? As for the Ark, how do we know it still exists at this point? If memory serves me correctly it isn't even mentioned in TF:TM. Do we see it in Season 3? I can't remember.

Blaster_86 · Post by **Blaster_86** » Sat Jun 15, 2002 6:42 pm

Originally posted by Galvatron84

The Moon Bases aren't much are they? Which Autobots are guarding them? Bumblebee and Spike on one and Jazz and Cliffjumper on the other. Not the most fierce of Autobots are they? As for the Ark, how do we know it still exists at this point? If memory serves me correctly it isn't even mentioned in TF:TM. Do we see it in Season 3? I can't remember.

Okay, we only See those Autobots on the moonbase because they are incharge who knows how many other Autobots are on them, And Yes The Ark is there in season three It gets destroyed by Trypticon in FFoD.

Dinobot · Post by **Dinobot** » Sat Jun 15, 2002 7:16 pm

Originally posted by Blaster_86

Okay, we only See those Autobots on the moonbase because they are incharge who knows how many other Autobots are on them, And Yes The Ark is there in season three It gets destroyed by Trypticon in FFoD.

I'm watching all the episodes in order and so far I've only reached the middle of Season 2 so I didn't know if the Ark was still there. And I never thought that there might be more Autobots on the Moon Bases but when Unicron is destroying the Moon Bases, if there are other Autobots, they don't don't make much of an attempt to get away do they?

Blaster_86 · Post by **Blaster_86** » Sat Jun 15, 2002 7:18 pm

Originally posted by Galvatron84

I'm watching all the episodes in order and so far I've only reached the middle of Season 2 so I didn't know if the Ark was still there. And I never thought that there might be more Autobots on the Moon Bases but when Unicron is destroying the Moon Bases, if there are other Autobots, they don't don't make much of an attempt to get away do they?

How do we know there was only one shuttle per moonbase?

Dinobot · Post by **Dinobot** » Sat Jun 15, 2002 7:26 pm

Originally posted by Blaster_86
How do we know there was only one shuttle per moonbase?

We don't but we don't see any other shuttles attempting to get away. The Autobots we see on the Moon Bases also make no attempt to warn any other Autobots who may be on the Moon Bases but they do make contact with Earth. Also at the end of the movie we see the Autobots who we know were on the Moon Bases (Jazz, Bumblebee, Cliffjumper and Spike) being saved by Daniel from the acid pool. If there were other Autobots on the Moon Bases surely they too would have been consumed by Unicron? Then again, maybe they had already been dropped into the acid pool, explaining why some Autobots disappeared after TF:TM.

Blaster_86 · Post by **Blaster_86** » Sat Jun 15, 2002 7:58 pm

Originally posted by Galvatron84

We don't but we don't see any other shuttles attempting to get away. The Autobots we see on the Moon Bases also make no attempt to warn any other Autobots who may be on the Moon Bases but they do make contact with Earth. Also at the end of the movie we see the Autobots who we know were on the Moon Bases (Jazz, Bumblebee, Cliffjumper and Spike) being saved by Daniel from the acid pool. If there were other Autobots on the Moon Bases surely they too would have been consumed by Unicron? Then again, maybe they had already been dropped into the acid pool, explaining why some Autobots disappeared after TF:TM.

Or their shuttle was lcuky like Kranix and got away and made their way to earth immdeatly to explain what was going on.
There are alot of possibilites. Remember Jazz and Cliffjumpers stuck around to contact earth while the others could have taken off.

Dinobot · Post by **Dinobot** » Sat Jun 15, 2002 8:35 pm

Originally posted by Blaster_86
Remember Jazz and Cliffjumpers stuck around to contact earth while the others could have taken off.

They could, but who knows?

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