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Old 2008-03-24, 08:24 PM   #141
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cliffjumper View Post
if Hasbro were insane enough to make Optimus a tiny cameo character for a couple of series, his sales would drop.
Indeed, and I'd bet Machine Wars Optimus Prime sold a hell of a lot less well than that years Primal toy, or indeed any of the TV featured BW characters.
 
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Old 2008-03-24, 10:47 PM   #142
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That's really the point.. the 'cool toy' factor is going to be a decent second to the 'character I like' factor.

Which is why I said that FP shouldn't be pushing complete nobodies as if the toy offering is all that mattered. This was 3H's biggest problem. Anyone CARE about Fractyl, Cat Scan, etc anymore?
 
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Old 2008-03-25, 03:45 AM   #143
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So, basically, "names do affect sales". Period.
 
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Old 2008-03-25, 04:20 AM   #144
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Originally Posted by Treadshot A1 View Post
if the toy wasn't good, naming it after classic characters WILL help it sell.
Can you think of examples where this is the case and the names haven't been attached to characters in recent fiction?
 
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Old 2008-03-25, 09:47 AM   #145
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Originally Posted by Denyer View Post
Can you think of examples where this is the case and the names haven't been attached to characters in recent fiction?

Have Hasbro/Takara ever given specific sale date for indervidual toys? Or are our guesses on what's hot and what's not based on secondary "I tried all the Walmart's and couldn't find Energon Ultra Mangnus/"Energon Ultra Magnus is clogging up every British town" observation?
 
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Old 2008-03-25, 02:19 PM   #146
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Pretty much. There's no hard data beyond what does or doesn't seem to be selling, and with the distribution of the past few lines questionable, that's not a good measuring stick.

And I can think of a number of examples that contradict Treadshot A1
- Spychanger Magnus and Prime figures warmed the pegs over here for years, while Energon Ironhide clogged up the shelves for ages.

Treadshot's broad idiocy should be addressed without muddying the main issue here, as he's just leaping on out-of-context bits of other people's posts to justify his own points (talking of MW Prime, any luck finding the mouth on him? No chippy answer to that one, eh?) - there's nothing to prove that an Energon redeco named after one obscure (to those beyond the fandom who make up the lion's share of the market) G1 character would have been sales gold compared to an Energon redeco named after another obscure (to those beyond the fandom who make up the lion's share of the market) G1 character. Nothing whatsoever.

With regard to convention exclusives/fan club figures, they're a totally different kettle of fish, and I agree that whoever produces them is mad to try and sell the things on the back of their own limp ideas, instead of giving fans what they want (as the fans make up 100% of the target audience in this case).

For the earlier stuff, I'm guessing either a) Hasbro was a lot more guarded about 3H or whoever using their trademarks or b) the old guard had delusions of grandeur, thinking they could actually create lasting characters (only Shokaract seems to have caught on to any degree).

Lately there does seem to be a swing towards doing it right, what with pre-BW/Classics/Evilverse (the concept might be laughable, but they are classic characters, probably) - they are limited slightly by the moulds they're allowed to use (with Hasbro snaffling up Cliffjumper, and Hubcap in either scheme only being a minor change from the official versions, there wasn't too much else they could have done to avoid the turd that was Bug Bite, for example), but then my view is firmly that if they can't get a good exclusive figure out of something, just don't bother in the first place - the real fiascos tend to come in from their need to make four figures, and an attendee figure, and a special advance booking figure, and a "promised to treat our comic as part of official continuity" figure, and so on...
 
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Old 2008-03-25, 11:28 PM   #147
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cliffjumper
For the earlier stuff, I'm guessing either a) Hasbro was a lot more guarded about 3H or whoever using their trademarks or b) the old guard had delusions of grandeur, thinking they could actually create lasting characters (only Shokaract seems to have caught on to any degree).
I suspect they gave 3H trouble in a lot of areas that the current club doesn't have to deal with. The most laughable example that springs to mind is that Hasbro at one point refused to let them use a Predacon mold for a Maximal character and vice versa -- and so 3H had to release Sandstorm the heroic Predacon and Onyx Primal the evil Maximal.

I figure the current regime has a freer hand in these sort of things because they're a proper company and 3H was 'just' an organization run by fans.

Quote:
with Hasbro snaffling up Cliffjumper, and Hubcap in either scheme only being a minor change from the official versions, there wasn't too much else they could have done to avoid the turd that was Bug Bite, for example
Goldbug, maybe? Remold the head and slap a less-cheerful colour scheme on the guy (maybe even the gold chrome that made G2 Bumblebee so cool) and you'd have something twice as cool as Bug Bite.

It wouldn't take much work to turn Classics Bumblebee into the IDW versions of Runamuck and Runabout, either, and I suspect most fans would rather have those two than an ugly guy named after a Gobot that he doesn't look a thing like.

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the real fiascos tend to come in from their need to make four figures, and an attendee figure, and a special advance booking figure, and a "promised to treat our comic as part of official continuity" figure, and so on...
I can't disagree with that. Even last year's figures, which are probably the most popular set of convention exclusives ever, weren't all as good as you might have hoped. The seekers were top-notch and Huffer was a very good choice, but rest of the set was a bit questionable. Weirdwolf and Springer had their names attached to figures that looked nothing like them (even if they were fairly cool), Dreadwind and Alpha Trion made two good molds look bad, and Bug Bite was just kinda...there. And then you had the clear Mirage that I've never, ever heard anyone talk about. Now, if they'd cut that down to four or five toys they could have had a lineup full of hits, but as it is...lots of misses in there too.

I suppose they figure they have to put out so many exclusives so that the price-gouging looks less offensive...
 
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Old 2008-03-25, 11:50 PM   #148
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Originally Posted by Warcry View Post
I know they gave 3H trouble in a lot of areas that the current club doesn't have to deal with. The most laughable example that springs to mind is that Hasbro at one point refused to let them use a Predacon mold for a Maximal character and vice versa -- and so 3H had to release Sandstorm the heroic Predacon and Onyx Primal the evil Maximal.
Well, keep in mind that you're hearing about this stuff from Glen Hallit, and I can't comfortably take him at his word. After all, 3H had nothing to do with Onyx Primal.

Quote:
Now, if they'd cut that down to four or five toys they could have had a lineup full of hits, but as it is...lots of misses in there too.
Last year, I would only really consider 'Clear Mirage' to be a waste, particularly considering the attention they were giving the non-existant Elita-One. Still, I would rather that some of the figures (say, Springer, Huffer, etc) be part of the Collector's Club, which has woefully little to actually collect, rather than convention exclusives.
 
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Old 2008-03-26, 04:16 AM   #149
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Originally Posted by TFVanguard View Post
Well, keep in mind that you're hearing about this stuff from Glen Hallit, and I can't comfortably take him at his word.
Actually, I'm not even doing that. I heard about if (IIRC) on the TFWiki, which is even less reliable in some ways. Hence my minor edit above -- I suspect it's true and what we saw back in those days suggests that it is, but I can't prove it.

Quote:
Last year, I would only really consider 'Clear Mirage' to be a waste, particularly considering the attention they were giving the non-existant Elita-One. Still, I would rather that some of the figures (say, Springer, Huffer, etc) be part of the Collector's Club, which has woefully little to actually collect, rather than convention exclusives.
That's actually not a bad idea, you know. Aside from the pointless clear Energon gestalt pieces, how many non-convention exclusives have they actually had? There's this Nightbeat, the Armada Jetfire repaint...and those are the only ones I can remember.
 
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Old 2008-03-26, 04:46 AM   #150
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Originally Posted by Warcry View Post
Actually, I'm not even doing that. I heard about if (IIRC) on the TFWiki, which is even less reliable in some ways. Hence my minor edit above -- I suspect it's true and what we saw back in those days suggests that it is, but I can't prove it.
Onyx Primal became a Maximal later, but that was 3H's 'retcon' for their Wreckers stuff, which made no sense to me. Hasbro didn't really seem to mind when MIB made him a Predacon originally, so I don't know what's up with that.

As far as I can tell, given 3H's story, Sandstorm was always a Predacon... the 'heroic' bit was because they were teamed up with Maximals fighting the new enemy, either Shockaract or the Vehicons. (And this actually was an issue with a Beast Machines toy, Buzzsaw, who was supposed to be the same Buzzsaw as Beast Wars...)

Quote:
That's actually not a bad idea, you know. Aside from the pointless clear Energon gestalt pieces, how many non-convention exclusives have they actually had? There's this Nightbeat, the Armada Jetfire repaint...and those are the only ones I can remember.
Let's see...
Anonymous Maximus (4 members so far)
Airazor
Astrotrain w Minicons
Nightbeat

...

Wow, oddly, I thought there was more than that. Does seem rather anemic, considering.
 
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Old 2008-03-26, 05:20 AM   #151
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Originally Posted by TFVanguard View Post
Movie Ratchet's G1 scheme actually sold out very quickly.. and 'Green' Ratchet was nearly a non-entity in the movie. So, you tell me where your logic lies.
In contrast, Movie Jazz is the biggest shelf warmer I've ever seen.

Quote:
I dismiss your opinion because it's based in wrong fact. Fact that has been repeatedly established by nearly every Hasbro interview given since they STARTED given interviews on the franchise.
Can you link these? I've not read anything other than occasional News Releases on their website.
 
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Old 2008-03-26, 04:01 PM   #152
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Originally Posted by Clay View Post
In contrast, Movie Jazz is the biggest shelf warmer I've ever seen.
I've got about 500 Camshafts around here that say otherwise. Jazz seems to be the weak figure of the actual movie characters, but he easily outsold Swindle, Camshaft, etc, as far as I can tell.

Quote:
Can you link these? I've not read anything other than occasional News Releases on their website.
This usually comes up in the BotCon panel interviews, when they discuss trademarks and character names, etc. I imagine that they'll be asked and answered again at next month's BotCon as well.
 
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Old 2008-03-26, 04:37 PM   #153
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I'm a bit confused, and I'm also this has already been addressed - I just didn't have time to read all 8 pages

I understand the mirrorverse thing, but why is Starscream still sporting a Decepticon head? He has Jetfire's paint, so it's absolutely perfect for an Autobot badge!

I like the Grimlock and Goldbug paint-jobs, and absolutely love the Prime - possibly only because the " 'til all are gone" quote...I find this amazing for some reason. I'm a little disappointed in the lack of originality in the Jazz paint-job though, I know it has switched-faction badging but they could have at least added some more black or purple or something.

::Edit:: I'm a moron...they just swapped the colors on all the badges, not the designs...(whistling very innocently) Ignore the question - the other comments still stand though!
 

Last edited by Springer145; 2008-03-26 at 04:41 PM. Reason: Stupidity
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Old 2008-03-26, 05:17 PM   #154
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TFVanguard View Post
I've got about 500 Camshafts around here that say otherwise.
The rest of the world seemed to get all of the Energon Magnuses, and there are no shortage of other distribution skewings... until you get a large enough sample of areas, anecdotal data's of very little value one way or another.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TFVanguard View Post
Movie Ratchet's G1 scheme actually sold out very quickly
And how many were produced, versus the movie toy? How many of a later wave does a store order, when they still have stock of other figures? Etc.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TFVanguard View Post
This usually comes up in the BotCon panel interviews, when they discuss trademarks and character names, etc.
Again, you seem to be conflating two data points -- names and character exposure/development in media.
 
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Old 2008-03-26, 05:37 PM   #155
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I'd also wonder if that data could even be calculated. Doesn't Hasbro use the same product number for all figures in a given size's wave (ie Deluxe Wave 1 uses a given number that's unique from deluxe wave 2 and voyager wave 1, but isn't unique for each individual figure)?
 

Last edited by RID Scourge; 2008-03-26 at 05:39 PM.
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Old 2008-04-02, 09:28 AM   #156
Nevermore
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Default Two more BotCon exclusive Mini-Cons: Rampage and Divebomb (names unconfirmed)

From an auction site:

Divebomb

Rampage
 
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Old 2008-04-04, 04:01 PM   #157
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Default Botcon 2008 Evil Rodimus Figure First Image

http://www.tfw2005.com/transformers-...t-look-164573/

Image taken from an auction site, mirrored below for your convenience.


 
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Old 2008-04-04, 04:18 PM   #158
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But where's the gratuitous beard shot?
 
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Old 2008-04-04, 05:38 PM   #159
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I do like.

But, shall never own.

At least one good figure seems to be coming out of this year's otherwise dire lineup.
 
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Old 2008-04-04, 06:16 PM   #160
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Thumbs up

Hopefully they'll have a few left on their website after the con, or I'll be able to swoop in on theifbay before anyone knows they're up. Got Weirdwolf for a decent price [for a Botcon Exclusive-also I like Cyb Snarl and Weirdwolf's G1 fig. So I was totally gaga over the prospect of an update] last year because of it.
 
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