General IDW *NON-SPOILER* discussion

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Sir Auros
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General IDW *NON-SPOILER* discussion

Post by Sir Auros » Mon Aug 28, 2006 4:17 am

Denyer wrote:PLEASE TAG STORY SPOILERS IN THIS THREAD.

You can do this by enclosing the text with {spoiler}{/spoiler} but using [ ] brackets rather than { } ones. Or by using the toolbar icon.

SPOILER! (select to read)
Like so.

Thanks.
Since I bought the 6" War Within Prime, which is a toy BTW, I've been rereading my War Within books. I'm assuming IDW has commented on The War Within and what they can/might/will do with it or with a similar concept, so what has been said on the matter?

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Post by Denyer » Mon Aug 28, 2006 4:35 am

First off, Stormbringer has a few designs (not many, but a few) that
are similar to War Within, on account of Don drawing both series. Mostly just Prime, and of course WW was set millions of years in the past -- Stormbringer's "now" in IDW continuity.

Continuations of WW... Furman is said to be keen, but there's the twin issues of ongoing legal dispute over some DW material (not sure about the specifics) and IDW being more busy doing their own continuity/material.

My personal guess is that they'd do a completion straight-to-trade.

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Roadmap to current comics = brilliant

Post by Sir Auros » Sun Dec 17, 2006 5:54 am

I was going to be lazy and start a thread asking for people to help me fill in the holes in what I need (the comic shop that ships me comics has been shoddy), but that answered all my questions.

It seems I just need the two Spotlight features after Shockwave and the new miniseries. Damn nice of them to restart their numbering. Makes things easy and doesn't at all make it seem like their license holding is as transitory as Dreamwave's.

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Post by Denyer » Sun Dec 17, 2006 6:37 pm

Apart from the spotlights (which in theory can be read in any order, although the Nightbeat one is probably going to be fairly important in the long run) there's an overall continuity number next to the barcode, which should help a bit.

http://tfarchive.com/comics/idw/numbering.php

Retailers basically won't touch an ongoing after Dreamwave.

I'm currently being about as tactful as an electrified cattle prod in suggesting that an "issues in this continuity" guide be added to every issue of every title in it...

http://forums.idwpublishing.com/cgi-bin ... 567;st=220
http://forums.idwpublishing.com/cgi-bin ... =2553;st=0

In my view, it is a problem -- there's too much product out there for people to get a grip on what fits where without some hand-holding. Whereas most people were motivated enough and had time to follow things as kids, it's infeasible for a lot of people to do so now.

Mind if I move this into a public forum? More people might notice it and chime in.

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Post by Sir Auros » Mon Dec 18, 2006 12:13 am

Go ahead and shift this wherever you see fit.

I'm kind of worried because they really are shoving as much out as quickly as they possibly can and just skimming over the books (as a casual comics fan would be likely to do), I still needed to come here to figure out the continuity.

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Post by Nevermore » Mon Dec 18, 2006 11:50 am

I don't really understand what's so difficult about it.

The "main title" is a sequence of mini-series (Infiltration, Stormbringer, Escalation) with an internal numbering next to the barcode. The Spotlight one-shots (can anyone tell me why Shockwave was #1, Nightbeat #2 and then Hot Rod dropped any numbering?) are part of the same continuity. That's it.

Beast Wars: The Gathering was set in the BW cartoon continuity (or the IDW version of it), Evolutions: Hearts of Steel was its own continuity, Generations features reprints of old Marvel stories, and the Animated Movie Adaption should be self-explanatory.
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Post by Osku » Mon Dec 18, 2006 12:51 pm

Originally posted by Nevermore
I don't really understand what's so difficult about it.

The "main title" is a sequence of mini-series (Infiltration, Stormbringer, Escalation) with an internal numbering next to the barcode. The Spotlight one-shots (can anyone tell me why Shockwave was #1, Nightbeat #2 and then Hot Rod dropped any numbering?) are part of the same continuity. That's it.

Beast Wars: The Gathering was set in the BW cartoon continuity (or the IDW version of it), Evolutions: Hearts of Steel was its own continuity, Generations features reprints of old Marvel stories, and the Animated Movie Adaption should be self-explanatory.
It's clear if one has followed IDW comics from the beginning. If one wants to jump in now, that's quite a lot of stuff. I understand how it can be a bit difficult at first to put all in correct context.

It doesn't make it easier that IDW is reprinting Dreamwave's material. For example Dreamwave's first "War Within" mini-series is even made by same writer and penciler as IDW's "Stormbringer".

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Post by Cliffjumper » Mon Dec 18, 2006 3:42 pm

Yeh, it might not be confusing for someone who, say, spends a higher-than-average chunk of their time monitoring a TF news forum, but if you go into a comic shop and pick up some sequentially numbered TF comics, you could end up with bits of two different storylines. The DW comic numbering system is as plain as Jennifer Garner to me, as I got them all as they came out, followed the BB posts and wrote a bloody guide on the things. For some guy looking in the T section of Forbidden Planet? Not so.

Really, if you were to have Stormbringer #1 and Infiltration #2 in a rack together, what's to say it's not just a story title in Ye Olde Style, with these comics being TF #1 and TF #2? 'Impulse' buyers probably make a significant slice of the TF comic market, especially as the buzz about the film and Classics gathers a few lapsed fans to the book (which is, to be honest, the best bet for sustaining any sort of readership). Nah, sod the more casual buyers, you can understand the system if you read some web-pages or find some arcane system in the bar-codes (numbering comics is so passe, it's all in the barcodes now, how else will the market stay elitist and slowly collapse in on itself?), what are they whining about?

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Post by Halfshell » Mon Dec 18, 2006 4:12 pm

Originally posted by Cliffjumper
For some guy looking in the T section of Forbidden Planet? Not so.


I've seen it happen. Not even the FP operative seemed to know what was going on... she handed him the Shockwave spotlight safe in the knowledge that "this is new out, it's #1". Bloody Generations or whatever they're calling the reprint series doesn't help either.
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Post by Cliffjumper » Mon Dec 18, 2006 5:50 pm

I saw it in the DW days, too - Armada #1, G1 #2, WW #3, packed together as "Transformers 1-3" at a Forbidden Planet... Yeh, you (i.e. a vague "you", not Brend, who isn't doing so) can blame employees if you like, but that's missing the point a fair bit

The IDW stuff isn't even dated, is it? Hell, it doesn't help that the last two licencees have cover logos with only one letter's difference, I expect. I know that would be comparitively meaningless, what with it being pretty much accepted that a monthly comic can now appear at quarterly intervals, but it's another indicator gone (and one I remember, back in the day, being very helpful telling Heroes Reborn issues from Heroes Return issues).

I know the pros and cons of the obvious approach that would solve some problems (Infiltration #1.1, Escalation #2.1, etc.), and I don't have a solution (maybe maxi-series, so there's less chance of two #1s being on sale side by side in places with small back-issue stocks?), but to pretend there isn't a problem when intelligent people with no small amount of knowledge about modern comics and is a board regular finds it confusing? When someone finds it necessary to create a roadmap in the first place? That's a problem. To someone who's just got some Paramount DVDs having grown out of the stuff post-Movie, and has a gander next time they're in a comic store, even Beast Wars and Evolutions can sound like issue titles/taglines, and looking at cover scans, the Infiltration subtitle isn't even in the banner logo, it's along the bottom of the page, where traditionally comics often carry some random text.

Why exactly did the Spotlight comics need a number on the cover anyway if they're all #1? Seriously? I mean, looking at the one-shots I have from various other eras, I guess it's some sort of industry standard/requirement for it to be "Spotlight: Tailgate #1" on the little infobox inside the comic (you know, the one you have to find to work out which year your IDW comic is dated...), but why does this have to be on the cover?

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Post by Halfshell » Mon Dec 18, 2006 7:00 pm

Originally posted by Cliffjumper
Yeh, you (i.e. a vague "you", not Brend, who isn't doing so) can blame employees if you like, but that's missing the point a fair bit
I think anybody blaming employees is being unnecessarily harsh. I mean I dare say keeping track of the X-Men titles is a big enough chore, so why would they devote valuable brain time to memorising the run-order of a niche 80s nostalgia title?
The IDW stuff isn't even dated, is it?
Aye. It's tucked away in the barcode info - "ITEM CODE: MMMYY" As Nevermore noted, Stormbringer and Escalation have got a cumulative number next to the barcode, too... but without knowing what it means I'd be pretty stumped as to its significance.
Why exactly did the Spotlight comics need a number on the cover anyway if they're all #1?
Having a quick glance at my copies... Shockwave is #1, Nightbeat #2... then Hot Rod doesn't seem to be numbered at all. And seeing as it's the only series that has the Mini's title at the top, that makes it all the more strange. "Right, I can definitely tell that these are part of the same series... but the numbering stops after #2... sod it, I'll wait for the TPB."
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Post by Commander Shockwav » Tue Dec 19, 2006 7:34 pm

Originally posted by Denyer

I'm currently being about as tactful as an electrified cattle prod in suggesting that an "issues in this continuity" guide be added to every issue of every title in it...


Hey, I'm with you on that.

I think IDW is making a mistake in not including some sort of timeline in the back of each issue.

Dark Horse got hundreds of dollars from my pocket for that very reason with their timeline in the back of their Star Wars series. Never would have bit if it weren't for that.

I think it's crucial in getting fans aboard. Now that the continuity is expanding, we need something like a timeline to keep things straight.

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Post by inflatable dalek » Tue Dec 19, 2006 8:39 pm

When I used to get the He-Man comics the constant renumbering deffinately buggered the hell out of me- I'd have to actually look inside the comic to make sure it was a new issue and not an old one in a cover I hadn't seen before, and theefore can feel sympathy for anyone baffled by it.

Aen't they droping the numbering from Generations after 12? I'm assuming they were worried about the implications of their longest running TF comic (any comic?) being a reprint of other people's stuff...
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Post by Cliffjumper » Sun Dec 31, 2006 7:04 pm

Either that or none of them can count higher than 12.

While it wouldn't help in terms of explaining which mini-series take place after which, making the numbering and the mini-series title a little more intertwined wouldn't hurt - Infiltration 3 of 6, Stormbringer 1 of 4, etc. It might sound a bit daft if you know this is Infiltration #3 of a 6-issue Infiltration mini-series, but beyond the odd bit of snobbishness I can't see the harm it would do.

Their other option would be to name the continuities a bit more plainly. It'd mean some clunky naming and the like, but it could work.

EDIT: Multiple covers create a hell of a problem, too.

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Post by optimusskids » Sun Dec 31, 2006 8:26 pm

I like the roadmap myself before getting into the IDW stuff the last time i'd got a comic was back in the Marvel days when 1 cover = 1 issue.

The clearer the better and the more likely you are to tempt nostalgic ex tf-fans back into the fold and keep them interested.
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Post by Halfshell » Mon Jan 01, 2007 1:24 pm

Originally posted by inflatable dalek
[BAen't they droping the numbering from Generations after 12? I'm assuming they were worried about the implications of their longest running TF comic (any comic?) being a reprint of other people's stuff... [/B]


More startling (I think) is the fact that we're getting a Generations TPB.

I mean what the ****? Or are the Titan trades discontinued now or something?
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Post by Aardvark » Mon Jan 01, 2007 2:37 pm

Originally posted by Brendocon
More startling (I think) is the fact that we're getting a Generations TPB.

I mean what the ****? Or are the Titan trades discontinued now or something?

And it contains the first six issues, IIRC -- so if you replace "Warrior School" with "I, Robot-Master", you get the Cybertron Redux TPB.

Well, it does make it a better collection of stories, I'll give it that, yet, I can't help but feel ":eyebrow:" about it.
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Post by Gouki » Tue Jan 02, 2007 11:35 am

Originally posted by Brendocon
More startling (I think) is the fact that we're getting a Generations TPB.

I mean what the ****? Or are the Titan trades discontinued now or something?


I thought they might be, considering how expensive they seem to be around my area.
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Post by Ozz » Tue Jan 02, 2007 12:15 pm

I believe I read somewhere Titan doesn't have the license to do another prints.

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Post by Denyer » Tue Jan 02, 2007 4:08 pm

Originally posted by Brendocon
I mean what the ****? Or are the Titan trades discontinued now or something?
They're definitely not in print, although there are a lot of copies in circulation. Titan's license was for three or four years and as far as I'm aware has expired -- but whereas they had their own agreements with Marvel, there are apparently problems with IDW reprinting stuff containing trademarks.

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