Transformers: More than Meets the Eye season two discussion

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Post by Patapsco » Thu Mar 10, 2016 11:01 am

Hang on a second: the nudge guns are New Institute tech, right? But the one Getaway had only had two charges. Who's been making copies of the charges? Presumably someone on board must have the scientific know how and oh god it's Brainstorm, isn't it?
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Post by Red Dave Prime » Thu Mar 10, 2016 12:37 pm

Possibly perceptor. Brainstorm is on the rod pod (poor guy, he actually did try to kill megs)

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Post by Patapsco » Thu Mar 10, 2016 2:37 pm

Red Dave Prime wrote:Possibly perceptor. Brainstorm is on the rod pod (poor guy, he actually did try to kill megs)
Or Chromedome...
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Post by Death's Head » Thu Mar 10, 2016 3:20 pm

****ing Highbrow.
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Post by Patapsco » Thu Mar 10, 2016 4:27 pm

Red Dave Prime wrote:Possibly perceptor. Brainstorm is on the rod pod (poor guy, he actually did try to kill megs)
also, remember the Nudge Guns remove memories, so why couldn't Getaway have coerced someone to make more of them then simply use the gun on them to remove the memory of the coercion?
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Post by Warcry » Thu Mar 10, 2016 6:42 pm

I still think the nudge guns are a terrible plot device. Someone needs to use one on Roberts to make him forget he invented them.

That aside...
Red Dave Prime wrote:I'm not sure how I feel about the Getaway twist. I mean I really like the twist but I couldn't help but thnk that its a stretch that so much of the crew backs him - and what they effectively do to the Autobots who are trapped along with Megs is incredibly barbaric when you think about it. I'm amazed Hoist and Blaster go along with this. I think I might have bought it more if it had of been a character who was there from the start and had built bonds from the beginning. Certainly I could buy them wanting to sacrifice Megs but the idea that they would sell a fairly sizable party to the DJD is... hmm.
It does seem like a bit much, doesn't it? There hasn't been a word of dissent in two years from the crew, but apparently they're all super secretly pissed off that Megatron is there and are all (aside from the main characters) completely willing to go along with a mutiny? That seems like a leap. I mean, there's a wide spectrum of actions between "doing nothing" and "sending the entire command crew to die", particularly when the "to die" list includes popular crewmembers like Nautica, Skids, Rung, Velocity, etc... I mean, if 90% of the crew are on your side, surely there's a more productive, less dramatic way of resolving things? I mean they very nearly tossed out Rodimus from the captain's chair strictly by a vote. If you've got the support just do that again and have the new captain toss Megatron in the brig until he can be executed.

And like you say, there are way too many reasonable and/or decent Autobots left on the Lost Light for this to make any sense. Blaster, Hoist, Hound, Grapple, Huffer, Siren, bigshot diplomat Crosscut and many more. Which makes me assume...
inflatable dalek wrote:Or, is Getaway lying out his arse and the betrayal is the result of selective memory re-editing on his part? Will the memory triggering device on the Necrobots planet be used to put things right?

Let's hope not.
He probably is. And given some of the speculation we've had about his character in the past, I wouldn't be at all surprised if he was doing Tyrest's bidding in the process. After all, he very much wants to find Cyberutopia himself and would be very motivated to stop the Lost Light's quest in its tracks by feeding the command crew to the DJD. And considering Tarn's got an army of revanchist Decepticons in tow now, I'd expect the Lost Light itself to be in the crosshairs pretty quickly as well. I wouldn't be surprised if, however this arc ends, they need to rescue the rest of the crew either from Deathsaurus's clutches or Tyrest's before they continue on with the quest.

The biggest thing that jumped out at me from this issue hasn't actually gotten much attention I don't think: Velocity's suggestion that Megatron's "reform" is entirely the fault of the Autobots feeding him mind-altering drugs. The fact that neither Ratchet nor First Aid nor Rung ever even mentioned the possibility of side-effects to him implies pretty heavily that either they're incompetent (and we know that at least the first two aren't) or that they're complicit in something pretty awful, presumably at Optimus's behest.

A pretty good issue overall, though not nearly as action-packed as the hype made it seem. It's just the start of something, rather than a big event in its own right like I'd been expecting. Which all in all is probably a good thing.

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Post by Patapsco » Thu Mar 10, 2016 6:49 pm

Warcry wrote:He probably is. And given some of the speculation we've had about his character in the past, I wouldn't be at all surprised if he was doing Tyrest's bidding in the process. After all, he very much wants to find Cyberutopia himself and would be very motivated to stop the Lost Light's quest in its tracks by feeding the command crew to the DJD. And considering Tarn's got an army of revanchist Decepticons in tow now, I'd expect the Lost Light itself to be in the crosshairs pretty quickly as well. I wouldn't be surprised if, however this arc ends, they need to rescue the rest of the crew either from Deathsaurus's clutches or Tyrest's before they continue on with the quest.
Now this I can buy, and the point about the entire crew being off about Megatron and keeping it quiet feels too much like a long con.
Warcry wrote:The biggest thing that jumped out at me from this issue hasn't actually gotten much attention I don't think: Velocity's suggestion that Megatron's "reform" is entirely the fault of the Autobots feeding him mind-altering drugs. The fact that neither Ratchet nor First Aid nor Rung ever even mentioned the possibility of side-effects to him implies pretty heavily that either they're incompetent (and we know that at least the first two aren't) or that they're complicit in something pretty awful, presumably at Optimus's behest..
Megatron having a change of heart, picking up the Autobot sigil, his trial and desire to be redeemed all happened before he was given the captaincy of the Lost Light and as such was given a lifelong course of Fool's Energon to keep his strength in check. It could be argued, sort of, that his erratic behaviour after coming on board can be traced to the drugs, but not all that happened before (his actions in Dark Cyberton and issues 28-30
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Post by Warcry » Thu Mar 10, 2016 6:58 pm

Patapsco wrote:Megatron having a change of heart, picking up the Autobot sigil, his trial and desire to be redeemed all happened before he was given the captaincy of the Lost Light and as such was given a lifelong course of Fool's Energon to keep his strength in check. It could be argued, sort of, that his erratic behaviour after coming on board can be traced to the drugs, but not all that happened before (his actions in Dark Cyberton and issues 28-30
I was thinking more about the recent bout of pacifism, and the depression and self-doubt that came before that. The decisions that took him to the Lost Light were made before the Fool's Energon (I think? Maybe he was already on it when he was behind bars?) but his personality has shown more than one drastic change since then. He's barely the same person that he was at the end of Dark Cybertron, and you really do have to wonder...

It definitely makes me look back on the first conversation he had with Ravage and see it in a different light. Ravage seemed pretty certain that Megatron was acting completely out of character then. Maybe he had a point?

If nothing else it'll be a source of tension when he runs up against Tarn.

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Post by zigzagger » Thu Mar 10, 2016 10:02 pm

I don't have a lot to say at the moment, but consider my interest rekindled.

And hey, it may have taken 50 issues, but Rodimus' character arc finally reached its logical conclusion -- that being mutiny, of course ;)

Still, a nice swift kick in the status quo to shake off this arc fatigue that's been hanging over me for awhile now.

A few minor quibbles here and there, mostly towards some of the shown (or assumed) mutineers, but there's genuine tension here. Exciting stuff.

May weigh in later.

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Post by Patapsco » Thu Mar 10, 2016 10:31 pm

Also, is it possible for a book to become too narratively dense? Because I'm getting the sense that there's almost too much going on in the background that a real palate cleanser is needed
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Post by inflatable dalek » Fri Mar 11, 2016 5:49 pm

On the betrayal, it actually reminded me a lot of the mutiny two parter in season 4 of Battlestar Galactica (even down to the charismatic bullshitter leading the revolution being let out of jail by the supporting characters who've joined him).

In both cases the turning point is the Captain making the choice to form an alliance with the villain that has attempted (with a lot of success) genocide against the heroes, but there's also a cumulative factor of the quest not feeling like its getting anywhere and erratic leadership (Adama basically constantly does what he thinks is right and tried to overthrow both the President and Cain when he didn't agree with them, it's no wonder those below him think "Mutiny" is the default way of dealing with things)n which plays into it. And even though a lot of those secondary characters had been liable allies, their betrayal felt like it made sense in the wider context.

Plus of course, despite what Zarak tried to claim, not everyone was on his side, just enough of them. I suspect we'll see the counter-revolutionaries amidst the LL crew next issue.

Like Red Dave Prime I did wonder if Season 3 was going to be chasing the stolen Lost Light, but as Roberts doesn't like it when people point out Red Dwarf similarities, would he really be that blatant (the destruction of Starbug the Rod Pod does feel like a "We're not going to go down that road" statement).
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Post by Knightdramon » Sat Mar 12, 2016 10:03 am

Death's Head wrote:I want a Titan Wars Getaway! :D
I don't know if it's fully confirmed or not, but you are getting one. If I'm not mistaken it's a Chromedome [aka Dead End] retool/repaint.

On the issue itself, I do believe that much like RID 50, it was a taaaad overhyped. Unlike RID 50, where that was the culmination of a story, this one is a clean slate; this is the set-up for the upcoming issues.

On a personal level, I can't help but feel sorry for Megatron; as soon as he has made peace with the world and is happy, BAM, he's reminded that nobody really likes him and bad people are out to get him. If anything, I am curious as to how this did not happen earlier, considering his legacy.

Lots of mysteries on this one; what happened with Censere; who sent the signal, and who sent the second signal? I don't believe that he was set up by Getaway as well.

If anything, it would make sense for the DJD to be waiting in the only building on the planet, instead of wandering around nowhere. Surely they would have left at least one person with all the high-tech stuff there.

Megatron also insisted that Tarn would not harm or bother with neutrals, and they even saved Nickel. So perhaps the outpost was attacked by the Galactic Council, and that's who Getaway sold our bots to, and Tarn just beat them to the ground moments before our bots got there?

I am also wondering about the mutiny of the crew; I do not think that the crew know that the team is in danger. Considering that Bluestreak [and pretty much everybody else] risked their lives to save Swerve a few issues ago, I'm not sure that they know [or even Getaway knows] they're sold off to the DJD.

Convenient Ultra Magnus injury; can't use the teleport switch to Tyrest.

I wonder if he'll get "withdrawal" symptoms just as they're about to be executed, and brutally murder the DJD, swiping Tarn's cannons, sparing the Autobots due to his connection with them, and then leave on solo.

Is this going to be a 6-parter?
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Post by Death's Head » Sat Mar 12, 2016 6:16 pm

I don't know if it's fully confirmed or not, but you are getting one. If I'm not mistaken it's a Chromedome [aka Dead End] retool/repaint.
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Post by inflatable dalek » Sun Mar 13, 2016 8:55 pm

So people on twitter have found about three instances of characters having headaches around Getaway.

And the Necrobot calling his gaff a shell of a world...
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Post by Patapsco » Sun Mar 13, 2016 9:03 pm

I still think Chromedome's got something to do with this. In fact the more I think about it, the more I'm convinced that Getaway got to him... somehow
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Post by Auntie Slag » Wed Mar 16, 2016 10:47 pm

Totally agree with Patapsco about Getaway’s logic. Could you imagine the Autobots giving Tarn the same freedom after everything he’s done, even if you did put him on poison fuel?

Really interested in whose ‘gun shadow’ Red identifies. It has to be someone that Max would also identify. I don’t know if there’s evidence Max has ever met the DJD, so perhaps its Megatron or (long shot) Overlord? That may also help explain why they haven’t had their T-cogs and brains ripped out.

One tiny thing that made me wonder the moment I saw it, was that Milne has drawn Blaster’s ears pointing forwards. He’s always drawn then pointing backwards, and I’m sure, looking at his meticulous artwork that he would never get such a thing wrong. I wonder if it means something to someone?

I also wonder if the Galactic Council will somehow save Rodimus and Co, due in part to the latter saving the organics from the Rust Giants, and because they respect Magnus. Assuming that respect didn’t ebb away in the 2012 annual.

Its an incredibly dangerous move that Getaway should leave Megatron and the others to the fate of Tarn and the DJD. Isn’t he giving the DJD their most revered hero on a plate? Isn’t there a chance they could get Megatron off the poison fuel and see him regain who he once was, an inspiring figurehead? If there was any chance of that, then Getaway and every other Autobot would be in a far more dangerous situation.

But Getaway isn’t that silly, so perhaps he knows Tarn, and who Tarn really is. And by extension so Skids knows, and Magnus and Tarn both love the Empyrean Suite, and when you add Chromedome and Brainstorm (and Rewind), you have a select set of people all linked to the New Institute who will now be in the same issue, sharing the same panels. This must surely lead to some cool revelations!

I agree with Warcry too, about a link between Getaway and Tyrest (or whoever’s controlling Tyrest). The imaginative freaky freakster that is Tyrest... and all he could think to do was torture Getaway? I doubt it. And Knightdramon’s fantastic comment about Magnus’ right arm! Shocked when I read that! It must suggest that Tyrest has a part to play in this!

And it turn that must be backed up by the comment the Our Lost Light crew made when they found Magnus’ body on the Alternate Lost Light during the Slaughterhouse story, that someone knew exactly how to kill him and rip him out of his armour. If Tarn did that it, suggests he is linked to Tyrest, who may in turn be working with the New Institute (though that’s just my guess and its groundless).

In the backup strip, in one panel Swerve has a sign above his bar which is half out of shot. I’m guessing it was supposed to read ‘**** OFF MEGATRON’. Very amusing :-)

Loved Tailgate’s Powerpuff Girls impersonation when taking down the Giganto-giant Rust guy.

And found it interesting that in the final panel where Megatron and the others have come out to face the music, that way off in the background is Nightbeat facing the other way, like he’s found something or is simply too busy to come out and get mangled with the others. Definitely up to something!
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Post by Patapsco » Wed Mar 16, 2016 11:13 pm

Everyone is so hung up on what Getaway did to the "fan favourites", and to give them their stupid social media name #teamrodimus (jesus fricking christ) they're ignoring the very real, very true and completely logical points about Megatron, Rodimus and the frankly pathetic state of their quest as it stands. I'd like to imagine Roberts wrote it that way as a direct f*** you to sections of the fandom - the characters you love are terrible, I've made them terrible and here's why they're terrible. It's not the first time Roberts has made sly digs about the people who read the book (Dalek's comment about what Roberts said about Grimlock at the signing, the second season quip in the back-up strip)

The final panel is framed strangely, but I don't think the DJD and chums are that close to the Necrobot's Fortress Of Robotic Registry Services. Another thing I like about the panel is the little details - Velocity fixing Nautica's leg while Skids is comforting her, Ten holding a lot of the sparkflowers, Cyclonus patting the heads of Swerve and Tailgate

And yes, the banner in Swerve's is meant to say exactly what you think it's meant to say
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Post by Auntie Slag » Wed Mar 16, 2016 11:31 pm

Another odd thing in that final panel; Whirl also in the background is looking down like he's ashamed (that's very un-Whirl), and he's got nothing to be ashamed about yet. Or does he also have an interesting past with the DJD?

Rung was good again. Not so much about the disassembling comment, but the 'extremely uncomfortable' thing he heard. If Brainstorm's briefcase offers up glimpses into the past, will the parallel continuities also offer up something which reveals Rungs true purpose before our Rung is ready? Because its starting to feel like Rung is actually aware what his alt-mode is for in our Universe, as well as the Rung from the final page of Elegant Chaos.

With just a single panel the Scavengers were great yet again. Krok's body imprint on the wall from some issues back is brilliant. And Grimlock looks like a giant, incredibly dangerous cat sitting with them. Which he is.

Nightbeat made a specific hand gesture when he says they only have six hours left. It kinda looks like he's shading his eyes from the light, but recon it could also be a signal to someone.

My personal wish is that Delta Magnus pops up in this arc somehow. Whilst I'm trying to think who would be the perfect actor to do Getaway's charming voice. That guy who plays Jaime Lannister, perhaps?

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Post by Red Dave Prime » Thu Mar 17, 2016 7:12 am

I'm more ed Norton for getaway.

Just on the point of megatron being let off, don't forget that this was somewhat imposed on optimus and the autobots. The trial was being viewed by all the neutrals and possibly the other races. They had to show they could follow their own laws. And don't forget, a key point of much of the last five years of idw, especially Roberts stuff is that the autobots are just as guilty as the cons in the eyes of those outside the war.

Also in real life terms, its not unusual for one time terrorists to evolve to legit polticians in the pursuit of peace - martin McGuinness of Sinn Fein being the most close to home example. Getaway, for all his rightful justification, isn't looking at the bigger picture.

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Post by Patapsco » Thu Mar 17, 2016 9:22 am

If Optimus had, upon hearing Megatron declaring the legal loophool that he can only tried by the Knights Of Cyberton, decided to look up Megatron in a maximum security prison indefinitely until the Knights (who may or may nor exist) then that would have been perfectly acceptable. But I'm sure that Megatron was counting on Prime's "need for redemption going beyond the inane" and that Prime would do whatever it took to not imprison Megatron, let alone execute him.

And of course Getaway's not looking at the bigger picture, he's also conveniently forgetting that he owes his very existence to Megatron and the war, as do a lot of other Autobots. Anyway, I'm sure at some point, someone is going to turn around to Getaway and at "What have you done?" Also, Roberts has already stated that Getaway's voice is from New Zealand
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