The Doctor Who 2014/15 Thread

Skyquake87 · Post by **Skyquake87** » Fri Oct 02, 2015 4:32 pm

I don't think Coleman's going to be in it, she's off to be Queen Victoria next...

This is going to be Grange Hill with monsters, isn't it? Personally, I think they should bring back MI High. That was good. Although not Who related.

Brendocon 2.0 · Post by **Brendocon 2.0** » Fri Oct 02, 2015 4:33 pm

Skyquake87 wrote:I don't think Coleman's going to be in it, she's off to be Queen Victoria next...

Because there are no documented occurrences of an actor appearing in two programs in the same year.

Skyquake87 · Post by **Skyquake87** » Fri Oct 02, 2015 4:44 pm

No there hasn't and la la la la you can't make me see la la la la

Tetsuro · Post by **Tetsuro** » Fri Oct 02, 2015 4:59 pm

I'm guessing the Coal Hill Highschool spinoff will be a spiritual successor to Sarah Jane Adventures.

Skyquake87 · Post by **Skyquake87** » Fri Oct 02, 2015 5:18 pm

I think the success of SJA and also Wizards Vs Aliens has made them mindful there's a good audience for fantasy/sci-fi amongst kids. Not sure about Class though, although if they have thingy thing whom was in 'The Caretaker' and 'Kill The Moon', it might be worth watching (I forget the girls name Ellis George or something, I think..)

Rack 'n Ruin · Post by **Rack 'n Ruin** » Sat Oct 03, 2015 8:37 pm

Under The Lake

Well, I enjoyed that. Not a Dalek in sight, and creepy ghosts to boot. Horribly derivative, of course, but I can't help myself. A flooded village is a nice idea. Did the dam burst because the spaceship crashed into it?

Skyquake87 · Post by **Skyquake87** » Sun Oct 04, 2015 9:12 am

I also thought that this was very good

The base under siege is bread and butter to Who, which has probably done more of these sorts of stories than anything else, but I like that it keeps finding new things to do with them. I do like Toby Whithouse's stuff for Who, he's a good fit for the show. What I found interesting was how the softening of Twelve here worked a lot better than in the Dalek two-parter (One of things I really enjoyed about Series 8 was that we got to see the more curt, serious and alien side of the Doctor that we haven't seen since Six).

Likeable and convincing supporting cast too - as much as I liked The Satan Pit two parter, some of support in that weren't so hot on making me feel they actually did the jobs they were there for - with only Clara letting the side down. whilst Clara's has never been terribly well characterised, Jenna Coleman has worked very well with a very sketchy outline of a character. Here, reduced to 'what larks' dialogue and just asking questions, felt again that no one really knows how to write her or what to do with her. Like last week, its left her looking a bit rubbish and superfluous, which is a shame as at this rate, I wont be sorry when her eventual departure arrives.

Other things : loved the cards gag (and actually paused the telly to read them all - the first time I've bothered to do this), my favourite being the one that read 'No One's going to get exterminated / vapourised/ turned into jelly'

Michael Pickwoad's superb design work shines through on this too (you can barely tell its the reused Dalek set).

Summerhayes · Post by **Summerhayes** » Sun Oct 04, 2015 9:01 pm

That was a cracker! As I've not been keeping up, the cliffhanger was a real shocker. I didn't even know this was a two parter, and keeping the pre-drowning village for one episode feels really clever.

I did like the bit with the Doctor worrying about Clara becoming too much like him, but it doesn't really work, does it? She was like that when they met...

Brendocon 2.0 · Post by **Brendocon 2.0** » Sun Oct 04, 2015 9:43 pm

Thoroughly enjoyable little first-parter.

Elements of Aliens, Alien 3 and Red Dwarf's Justice World thrown in there. As a wise man once said, if you steal from one place it's plagiarism, if you steal from multiple places it's research.

Has Who genuinely never done "proper dead people ghosts" ghosts before?

Not that I believe that's what we've got here, but it's a bit of a surprise if that's the case. That said, the only occasions I can think of are Ghost Light (which I don't think was ghosts? I can't be expected to remember the plot of GL) and Unquiet Dead which had some technobabble stasis handwave iirc.

Summerhayes · Post by **Summerhayes** » Sun Oct 04, 2015 10:34 pm

This will, of course, be technobabbled away as well but I don't think we've ever had "as soon as someone dies" ghosts like this in anything other than Tom and Jerry, so it is interesting.

Also, how many times now since Moffat took over have we had a pre - ordained death for the Doctor to move towards? This is already the second one this season, we had the impossible astronaut and the wedding of River Song... any others?

Post by **inflatable dalek** » Mon Oct 05, 2015 7:51 pm

Havn't seen this week's yet so I'm ignoring the above posts for now but I thought it'd worth sharing that:

****ING HELL BIG FINISH HAVE GOT JOHN HURT.

No one expected that, people were assuming the big announcement today would be the Tennant/Tate audios that have been an open secret for a few weeks now.

Considering he seemed very much a one-off, getting more performed Hurt is lovely, especially as the books--did Engines of War not do very well?--now seem to be quietly ignoring him (not being featured in The Time Lord Letters or the short stories in the recent science book) despite prose being a really easy place to do him at any age.

Post by **inflatable dalek** » Tue Oct 06, 2015 8:08 pm

And now having seen the episode:

Good solid mean and potatoes Who, I suspect once it goes into rotation on Watch with the older episodes it'll blur into peoples minds with the aforementioned Impossible Planet (though of course, that was 9 years ago now), but it does it well and has a nice--Ghostwatch inspired?--look to the ghosts.

Mildly disappointed that the sonic glasses are actually a thing rather than a one off gag.

After both Rose and the Pandorica Opens danced around using the name it was odd to finally hear "Auton" said outloud in a new who episode when they're not in it.

I also didn't entirely buy that of all the "Gasp, is it ghosts?!?!" plots we've had (going back at least as far as Day of the Daleks) this is the one that makes the Doctor go "Yep, this is totally real". Though the season break made it a bit less obvious, it was slightly poorly timed as it's only been four episodes since the last "Ghosts!" story, something that the episode itself has to slightly awkwardly acknowledge without either the Doctor or Clara going "Yeah, remeber how quite recently we thought we'd found out what happened to you after you died but it turned out to be an elaborate trick?"

Rack 'n Ruin · Post by **Rack 'n Ruin** » Thu Oct 08, 2015 10:27 am

Crazy Clara speculation ahoy!

SPOILER! (select to read)
There are online rumours that Clara is, in fact a post-Simm, pre-Gomez iteration of the Master, chameleon arched to be disguised as a human. There are apparently clues to this, if you feel like looking for them.

Crazy thought: If the above proves true, it does make Clara picking up and examining a somewhat incongruously located G1 Galvatron toy waaaaay back towards the start of her tenure a clue/happy coincidence. Galvatron is, of course, the main hero's oldest foe, re-made in a new body, using a new name, etc. Galvatron was also in the employ of a higher power, intent on bigger things.

A hint at Missy now being in the employ of the Gallifreyan Time Lords again, with a mission related to the Doctor?

I'm over-thinking things again, aren't I?

Summerhayes · Post by **Summerhayes** » Thu Oct 08, 2015 5:09 pm

That would also explain the episode where she briefly turned into a big purple cannon. I always thought it was odd they never mentioned that...

Skyquake87 · Post by **Skyquake87** » Thu Oct 08, 2015 9:39 pm

...that whiffs of that fan theory that was doing the rounds back in '08 about Harriet Jones being so offended by The Doctor's undoing of her life that she end up becoming the Supreme Dalek.

Brendocon 2.0 · Post by **Brendocon 2.0** » Sun Oct 11, 2015 2:04 pm

Ah, so it wasn't the First Evil after all. It was a member of a Norwegian death metal band. My mistake.

Big fan of "let's fanny away the opening segment explaining what the bootstrap paradox is (despite telling people to just google it) so we can end the episode by going 'ah, but it's a bootstrap paradox' rather than just working out an explanation".

Other than that, was alright.

Are we two-parters for the entire series?

Skyquake87 · Post by **Skyquake87** » Sun Oct 11, 2015 9:15 pm

I think so, but I'm not sure...

Thought Calpadi's theme tune was improved by a bit of metal guitar. Episode itself was good and a solid follow up to last week's effort. As ever, proclamations of the Doctor's death were wildly exaggerated (again) and I would have felt clever about working out The Doctor was in the coffin if I'd called that last week. Clara wasn't much use in this two-parter was she? I think this has been the first time her lack of characterization has bugged me, as she was just a bit whiny and annoying, which is a shame.

Next week: Space Vikings! And Maisie Williams (who could she be?)

Summerhayes · Post by **Summerhayes** » Mon Oct 12, 2015 11:39 am

I'd quite like it if they were all two-parters, as long as that means good cliffhangers and less rushed endings.

Before the Flood... it was alright. I liked the bootstrap paradox stuff at the bookends, I liked the guitar intro, but the bulk of it was pretty much generic Who. Not bad, not great, just... alright.

Next week though: Vikings! And Arya! Yay!

Post by **inflatable dalek** » Fri Oct 16, 2015 12:41 pm

Like the first part, solid workmanlike Who. Only this time with a monster that looked like a vagina from the front and a penis hanging out of an anus from the back. Either someone won a bet about what they can sneak through or they really need to think a bit more carefully about what they're creating.

I'm not sure why now, after a decade of Moffat time paradox stories the show suddenly felt a need to have the Doctor deliver a lecture to camera explaining them. It would have made sense in Blink for the Doctor to go "I'm acting in this way because you told me I told you I did it, but who had the idea first?", doing it now just makes him look a bit slow in realising it.

I listened to the Lisa Bowerman read audiobook of the original Human Nature at work this week. After eight years of the "Honestly, everything is canon, everything fits!" people going "The Doctor could totally have done this twice, I mean, the book's not even that similar to the TV version!" I was surprised how faithful an adaptation the Tennant version.

It's leaner and more focused (to it's benefit, even if you lose some nice stuff), but all the plot beats and all the major moments--including what often sounds like alternate drafts of the TV scripts' dialogue--but it is very much the same beast.

MILD SPOILERS FOR 20 YEAR OLD BOOK (and 8 year old TV show that, if you've seen it, will spoil most of the 20 year old book) FOLLOW:

SPOILER! (select to read)
The main way the TV show improves on the book is the villains are far more distinct and memorable (though ironically less powerful. Incidentally, did I miss something or was neither Bernice or the Doctor not worried at all by the radiation from the nuked school at the end?), other than balloon girl, wisely the only one carried directly over, I found it hard to keep track of which one was which.

The main way the book improves on the TV show is Bernice is actually competent and it's as much her story as it is the Doctor, a far cry from poor old "I'm from the future!" Martha. How they both react to finding out one of their friends (their only real friend in Martha's case) has been killed and replaced is very telling. Bernice is horrified, pissed off and then even more determined. Martha barely seems to notice (and considering the TV version makes much more of a thing of all the death being the Doctor's fault, oddly something Bernice and Joan are keen to assure him isn't the case in the book, you'd think she'd be really ****ed off with him about that at least).

Interestingly, the casting of the characters who have analogies in both versions is completely spot on in the telly version, there's nothing jarring about picturing the guest actors when reading the book.

And I mean, seriously, what sort of person reads the scene of the Doctor standing in the Tardis console room crying and goes "He'd totally do this again in a few bodies time"? It's clearly an experience he can only go through once, the TV and book versions really aren't in the same continuity even if it wasn't such a faithful adaptation.

I was amused Steven Moffat is actually a character in the book, getting to mock McCoy's "Unconvincing" Scottish accent. Considering "Mr. Moffat" is also the Bursar I suspect a nod at the very heavy debt to Reaper Man as well.

It's a shame the text used in the BBC website ebook version with the "N" word edited out. Not that I'm against the choice, but they cut out Joan being racist but leave in Bernice thinking what a horrible racist she is, which just makes her look a bit overly jealous.

But all in all, a fantastic book, well worth listening to/reading if anyone hasn't.

Brendocon 2.0 · Post by **Brendocon 2.0** » Fri Oct 16, 2015 1:46 pm

Maybe he wanted to do it in Blink, but RTD slapped him down on the grounds that it's ****ing inane.

[make your own "RTD / inane" jokes at home]