Why are there so few girl cons?

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Cliffjumper
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Post by Cliffjumper » Tue Apr 16, 2013 2:34 pm

She ran around and pulled some switches and beat up a Junkion who wasn't trying to kill her. Move over Jakita Wagner...

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calvin_0
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Post by calvin_0 » Tue Apr 16, 2013 2:42 pm

Cliffjumper wrote:She ran around and pulled some switches
pull some switches and survived until Optimus show up and got killed by megatron..

Rattrap aunt is awesome.

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Cliffjumper
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Post by Cliffjumper » Tue Apr 16, 2013 3:46 pm

calvin_0 wrote:pull some switches and survived until Optimus show up and got killed by megatron.
So "doesn't die" now means the same as "kicks butt".

Wow, Hound sure kicks butt in TF:TM!

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calvin_0
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Post by calvin_0 » Tue Apr 16, 2013 4:08 pm

Cliffjumper wrote:So "doesn't die" now means the same as "kicks butt".

Wow, Hound sure kicks butt in TF:TM!
autobot city became almost a ruin before optimus arrive and get killed. not to mention autobot city is in its fortress mode (thanks to arcee and pal), if that doesnt consider as kicks butt, i dont know what else count...

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Vin Ghostal
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Post by Vin Ghostal » Tue Apr 16, 2013 9:43 pm

Cooties have no place in Transformers, thank you very much.
Image

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Cliffjumper
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Post by Cliffjumper » Tue Apr 16, 2013 10:56 pm

calvin_0 wrote:autobot city became almost a ruin before optimus arrive and get killed. not to mention autobot city is in its fortress mode (thanks to arcee and pal), if that doesnt consider as kicks butt, i dont know what else count...
Actually kicking butt?

So your case is the city almost got destroyed so she must have kicked butt? That the city changed into fortress mode (making next to no difference) so she kicked butt? Compared to, say, Optimus Prime turning up and single-handedly beating up the entire Decepticon army?

It's cute that you want to defend the cartoon girl robot you fancy but you're pissing up the wrong rope here.

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calvin_0
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Post by calvin_0 » Wed Apr 17, 2013 1:32 pm

Cliffjumper wrote: So your case is the city almost got destroyed so she must have kicked butt? That the city changed into fortress mode (making next to no difference) so she kicked butt?
yeah, she manage to survived and hold off raid that almost destroyed the a fortress, how do you think she survived if she cant kick butt? hide behind that punk call Hot Rod?

ability to kick butt isnt solely measure the amount of time they did it in on screen. you have to count the number of battle they survived.

not only Arcee survived the initial wave of the decepticon attack that destroyed the autobot city, she also survived the junkbot ambush, inside of unicron, that ambush that got ultra magnus kidnap and many more... Arcee can kick butt, she might not be as good as some of the autobot, but a dazzle in distress she is not. (well maybe in animated, but she is brain dead...)

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Skyquake87
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Post by Skyquake87 » Wed Apr 17, 2013 2:21 pm

Hmm...Animated Arcee is different to Transformers Arcee though, she's an intelligence officer in Animated not a warrior and displays few combat skills.

I'd agree that Transformers Arcee is a capable warrior - her Universe profile clearly has her pegged as an efficient fighter - but there's not really anything in the original Marvel Comics (Prime's Rib being something of a p*ss take on the concept of female Transformers) or the original cartoon to back this up - she fires her gun a few times, but thats all we really see. I don't think there's enough in her fleeting appearances to make out she's Red Sonia or anything though. If anything, Moonracer, Elita-One and uh, the other one of those girl Autobots from S2 were more 'kick butt', being as they were, a small guerilla unit under the command of Alpha Trion.

It does make you wonder why, if boys don't identify with female characters in series like this, why Sunbow thought the need to introduce female robots at all? Mind you, this was from the same 'creative power house' that brought us Carnage In C Minor and other flippant nonsense under the Transformers banner, so who knows?

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calvin_0
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Post by calvin_0 » Wed Apr 17, 2013 3:21 pm

Skyquake87 wrote: It does make you wonder why, if boys don't identify with female characters in series like this, why Sunbow thought the need to introduce female robots at all?
maybe they got pressured into it? gender equality and all... after all that is one of the Arcee's origin >.>

its clear that Arcee wasnt there to sell toys..

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Jaynz
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Post by Jaynz » Wed Apr 17, 2013 3:33 pm

calvin_0 wrote:maybe they got pressured into it? gender equality and all... after all that is one of the Arcee's origin >.>

its clear that Arcee wasnt there to sell toys..
Arcee's inclusion in 1985 was a mix of both union casting rules for TF:TM and that Sunbow was just seriously aping Star Wars and needed their Princess Leia.

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Cliffjumper
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Post by Cliffjumper » Wed Apr 17, 2013 4:33 pm

calvin_0 wrote:yeah, she manage to survived and hold off raid that almost destroyed the a fortress, how do you think she survived if she cant kick butt? hide behind that punk call Hot Rod?
Well, yes. There's nothing to suggest she did anything but hide and/or run away in those situations. The idea that she somehow held off the raid is wishful thinking.

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calvin_0
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Post by calvin_0 » Wed Apr 17, 2013 5:02 pm

Cliffjumper wrote:Well, yes. There's nothing to suggest she did anything but hide and/or run away in those situations. The idea that she somehow held off the raid is wishful thinking.
so fighting an off screen battle must mean they are hiding and nothing more, right?

going by that logic, i guess hot rod, springer and the rest of the autobot in autobot city run away and hide while ultra magnus, percepsion and blaster fought megatron and devastator until optimus arrive. then hot rod run off to get optimus prime killed.

how is it hod rod end up being the chosen one again?

if Arcee isnt capable of kicking butt, she would.

1. dies during the decepticon attacks
2. getting caught by the junkbot
3. getting drag off by unicron tentacles.

so Arcee capable surviving all that, either mean, she can kick butt or she is the luckiest autobot ever.

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Warcry
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Post by Warcry » Wed Apr 17, 2013 5:03 pm

Jaynz wrote:Arcee's inclusion in 1985 was a mix of both union casting rules
I've never heard that tidbit before. What exactly do you mean?

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Jaynz
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Post by Jaynz » Wed Apr 17, 2013 6:43 pm

Warcry wrote:I've never heard that tidbit before. What exactly do you mean?
Going from my old man's memory from a Susan Blu interview, without Arcee the casting for TF:TM would have been 100-percent male, which was an absolute no-no. (To back this up a little bit, I've also heard from some Hollywood directors this is one reason war movies often have love interests, etc., shoe-horned into them, even if they're set in the Pacific theater in WWII... )
Cliffjumper wrote:Well, yes. There's nothing to suggest she did anything but hide and/or run away in those situations. The idea that she somehow held off the raid is wishful thinking.
Actually, in all fairness, there's nothing to really suggest that Arcee was anything other than a typical Autobot in skill and power. She didn't seem to fare better or worse than most of the other newcomers (aside from the obvious Magnus and Rodimus). It's an Autobot who happened to be female...

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Post by Thunderwave » Thu Apr 18, 2013 3:10 am

Jaynz wrote:Arcee's inclusion in 1985 was a mix of both union casting rules for TF:TM and that Sunbow was just seriously aping Star Wars and needed their Princess Leia.
Except, of course, that Princess Leia was about 1000x more "kick ass" then Arcee. iirc Leia has a higher shot:hit ratio then Han and Luke during the film and managed to resist two types of torture. Arcee just kinda fired a few shots, ran around, and kept Daniel alive.

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calvin_0
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Post by calvin_0 » Thu Apr 18, 2013 7:11 am

Thunderwave wrote:Except, of course, that Princess Leia was about 1000x more "kick ass" then Arcee. iirc Leia has a higher shot:hit ratio then Han and Luke during the film and managed to resist two types of torture. Arcee just kinda fired a few shots, ran around, and kept Daniel alive.
no objection there, but to be fair, Arcee and Princess Leia is in a complete differ level. Arcee is just a support character (even in her debut movie) while Princess Leia is a main character.

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Jaynz
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Post by Jaynz » Thu Apr 18, 2013 2:49 pm

Thunderwave wrote:Except, of course, that Princess Leia was about 1000x more "kick ass" then Arcee. iirc Leia has a higher shot:hit ratio then Han and Luke during the film and managed to resist two types of torture. Arcee just kinda fired a few shots, ran around, and kept Daniel alive.
Well, to be fair to Arcee's character, that's more a result of about 1/2 of the movie spending time 'showing off the new toys' rather than building up any of the characters other than Hot Rod. In hindsight, I would have rather gotten rid of the Odessa arc completely and used that time to add more character depth.. but, selling toys has never been a big motivator from my writer's approach. :)

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