Do you express yourself in art?

[Denyer]

Well, as a very rough working definition, I'd class 5-50 as a short story, 50-150 as a novella, and anything up as a novel. Novella is a useful (if imprecise) category.

Also, before I come back to the post you're currently typing, let me say that I'm perfectly aware that nothing I ever produce is likely to go beyond very limited press or self-publishing. Since I would be writing for myself and those close enough to me to be on the same wave-length, this really doesn't bother me. The number of people who make a living from writing books has never been great, and these days is confined to the lottery of whomever the publishing trade wants to manufacture as the next bestseller.

What's your stuff about, anyway? That pigeon-holing is going to dictate its ultimate length. Take it you've had no luck with an anthology publication of your ~50...what genre?

[Redstreak]

Originally posted by Stuart Denyer
Well, as a very rough working definition, I'd class 5-50 as a short story, 50-150 as a novella, and anything up as a novel. Novella is a useful (if imprecise) category.

Novella. I knew there was a term, but as I told Casper, people tend to forget it, myself included. I was racking my brain for that word and could not find it.

What's your stuff about, anyway? That pigeon-holing is going to dictate its ultimate length. Take it you've had no luck with an anthology publication of your ~50...what genre?

Depends which stuff ye are talking about; I write various genres. The 50-pager has too much material that is not totally original, plus it's about 6 years old. I wrote my first after starting and stopping on many before it about that time as well. That one is permanently shelved because it is simply not as good as I know I can do.

Anthologies and the like are not easily found in the Detroit area; it wasn't until I got to University that I even started getting directed properly in the publication aspect. No one took me seriously outside of my best friend until about then. My prof was a published author himself and gave me many pointers. I regret not having his email to keep in contact with him.

I'm rather protective of describing what my stuff is about, but I will say that sci-fi is the predominant genre for my writing, and it is also the hardest to get published in. I will say my 400+ pager is an alternate reality...there is a certain irony about it that only I can understand with reference to this...I'd be more apt to tell you if I could talk to you, because with oral communication, forgetfulness is a lot more likely...nothing against you, just my paranoia.

[Denyer]

Before I begin, random official bit: Please don't make excessively long block quotes.

Originally posted by Redstreak
I'm starting to see Auros' points much more clearly suddenly...ye are roundabouting your way into some interesting places; you brought up the qualifications, but when I mentioned mine, suddenly they mean nothing.

Did you have to make this disagreement personal?

I. Did. Not. Bring. Up. Qualifications. They are demonstrably different from spending a large amount of time reading around, which is the simple point I was making.

Originally posted by Redstreak
it was about him taking potshots at me without regard. Much as you are doing here.

Those are based on the apparent tone of what you're typing, as much as the discussion, and I'm really trying not to make any of what I'm saying a personal attack. You hit back at Cliffy when he wasn't even trying to be provocative, told him he was probably wasting his time, and besides which both of you can take care of yourself in an argument.

Originally posted by Redstreak
you get Casper angry at you fairly frequently, and he's one of the nicest guys I've run across round here.

Hmmm. Ghost, like Cliffy, myself and probably you is extremely affable provided the other person in question isn't being what he would feel was unreasonable. Cross that line, and there are sometimes fireworks.

Originally posted by Redstreak
As for me, the only people I disagree with are the ones with the abrasive personalities

I can think of a few more than you listed, but I would rather make this point: I very, very rarely get annoyed enough to resort to personal abuse, and only in response to someone having already crossed that line. I think you've crossed it already by bringing in unrelated discussions, and therefore am continuing to choose my words with reasonable care.

Originally posted by Redstreak
where do you get that statistic?

The fact that any do is proof that there are publishers prepared to publish a good book outside of the limits you described. I'm not saying that this probably doesn't require a certain amount of luck, I'm not saying that it is even a commonplace phenomenon...I'm saying that it's very pleasantly surprising that short novels continue to appear and that some of them go on to be (deserved, IMO) successes. In some cases, the film industry has helped enormously — they prefer shorter works, or cut whatever isn't pacey enough. In others, the continued success of slim past volumes (especially compediums) undoubtedly helps.

[Halfshell]

I think this thread's the most entertaining thing I've read in days...

*grabs popcorn*

[Denyer]

Originally posted by Redstreak
Depends which stuff ye are talking about; I write various genres. The 50-pager has too much material that is not totally original, plus it's about 6 years old.

Ever considered sticking it on-line?

Originally posted by Redstreak
My prof was a published author himself and gave me many pointers. I regret not having his email to keep in contact with him.

Never too late to find it out! Anything I do manage to throw together in upcoming years I would definitely like to fire a copy in the direction of one or two of our staff members...Patricia would certainly give it a deserved savaging if it turned out to be rubbish...

Originally posted by Redstreak
sci-fi is the predominant genre for my writing, and it is also the hardest to get published in.

Yeah...major franchise and serial stuff for the most...have you considered taking a stab at a modern-setting novel to get yourself published, then going back with those credentials? Of course, then there's still the franchise opposition...tricky...

Originally posted by Redstreak
I'd be more apt to tell you if I could talk to you, because with oral communication, forgetfulness is a lot more likely...nothing against you, just my paranoia.

Well, stranger random meetings have happened...

I have a 2-3 month "hard-drive" memory, after which everything heads for CDs I'll probably fail to locate by next year, if it helps...

[Redstreak]

Originally posted by Stuart Denyer
Ever considered sticking it on-line?

Not really. I don't have the patience to keep a webpage updated; my fanfic site has recently gone down in flames.

Never too late to find it out! Anything I do manage to throw together in upcoming years I would definitely like to fire a copy in the direction of one or two of our staff members...Patricia would certainly give it a deserved savaging if it turned out to be rubbish...

Aye, he has seen snippets from my current major works. Thing is, I thought I had one of his syllabi hanging around someplace, but I was mistaken, and navigating the University site is not an easy thing...

Yeah...major franchise and serial stuff for the most...have you considered taking a stab at a modern-setting novel to get yourself published, then going back with those credentials? Of course, then there's still the franchise opposition...tricky...
[/B]

I do have a serial, the aforementioned 1k pager. After all that, mind you, it is merely a scraping of the surface, as there are a total of 12 in the saga. I have a modern-set novel in progress, it is the one that is cooling off while I do my editing, and it is also the start of a serial following the lead character. As with most beginnings, it is probably the weakest in the chain.

Well, stranger random meetings have happened...

I have a 2-3 month "hard-drive" memory, after which everything heads for CDs I'll probably fail to locate by next year, if it helps...

Even IM would be preferable than to telling the entire board, lemme add that. Certainly stranger things have happened, but short of my publication for some major dollars I don't see me meeting either you or any of the other Brits round here in the near future.

I'll say this too...for all that my RPG has done for me with all you guys, I think that in keeping it at the high standard it was at for so long hurt my writing and slowed my progress and my work. This is why I left it and why I only have 2 online writing projects right now, both of which being short and concise enough to not interfere with what matters most.

[Redstreak]

Originally posted by Stuart Denyer

Did you have to make this disagreement personal?

I. Did. Not. Bring. Up. Qualifications. They are demonstrably different from spending a large amount of time reading around, which is the simple point I was making.

I didn't make it personal...it was a dead issue as far as I was concerned until you brought it back with that dissection. As Quicky has been and gone a couple times since I posted, I figured he had nothing more to say and it was closed in my mind.

You brought up being an English student so I felt I had to remind you that there is commonality there. You interpreted that as though I was stating a qualification after I interpreted the same thing out of what you said.

Those are based on the apparent tone of what you're typing, as much as the discussion, and I'm really trying not to make any of what I'm saying a personal attack. You hit back at Cliffy when he wasn't even trying to be provocative, told him he was probably wasting his time, and besides which both of you can take care of yourself in an argument.

Cliffy doesn't have to try to be provocative, for one...

Beyond that, however, he started making remarks that I was not going to let slide without responding, and then basically told me to knock it off, something I was definitely not going to allow to sit there for the hypocrisy that I felt was involved.

Hmmm. Ghost, like Cliffy, myself and probably you is extremely affable provided the other person in question isn't being what he would feel was unreasonable. Cross that line, and there are sometimes fireworks.

True enough about Casper. However, I am not inclined to agree about Cliffy necessarily. He's hard to miss round here as you know. In that respect, I have seen some intelligent posts out of him, but also a lot of comments that insult intelligence and dismiss other peoples' opinions as though they were cannon fodder. He also gets easily riled at running gags and makes efforts to shoot them down because he perceives those that continue the gag as though they should not do such. When compared with Casper, seeing a similarity between the two aside from ability is difficult. I can get some thread links if you like, but I suspect you don't need them.

I can think of a few more than you listed, but I would rather make this point: I very, very rarely get annoyed enough to resort to personal abuse, and only in response to someone having already crossed that line. I think you've crossed it already by bringing in unrelated discussions, and therefore am continuing to choose my words with reasonable care.

Do tell.

I'm not spouting personal abuse...if I did that there would be a lot of asterisks, cuz when I'm really mad I curse. I was simply pointing out an observation and seeing another point of view that I had heard about but not seen for myself.

I've no wish to name names about people I've upset; I have made apologies to anyone that I know with certainty that I have wronged outright or has had a grievance with me and said something about it. But if you refer to Jinrai, the only person at this point that I KNOW is upset with me, I can show you some things via PMs and other information that would invaribly show you that he just went off on me; I never wronged him.

The fact that any do is proof that there are publishers prepared to publish a good book outside of the limits you described. I'm not saying that this probably doesn't require a certain amount of luck, I'm not saying that it is even a commonplace phenomenon...I'm saying that it's very pleasantly surprising that short novels continue to appear and that some of them go on to be (deserved, IMO) successes. In some cases, the film industry has helped enormously — they prefer shorter works, or cut whatever isn't pacey enough. In others, the continued success of slim past volumes (especially compediums) undoubtedly helps.

Something has to be exceptional in order to slip in under the requirements. But as shown with LOTR, it can be epic and easily made into film. So I don't think either of us can say that they prefer shorter or longer works when making novels into film, because there is no real consistency.

[Cliffjumper]

Right, a few context points which need to be made in regard to my rather botched attempt at the getting the Dr. Who novel book. The Dr. Who NAs peaked at sales of around 3000 in the UK, with negligable [sp?] sales elsewhere [I think they were only distributed in America via import in sci-fi/comic shops]. The general writers were a few who had scripted for the TV series who actually enjoyed the myhtos, rather than seeing it as a job [Andrew Cartmel (Dr. Who's Simon Furman), Ben Aaronovitch, Marc Platt], a couple who had previously novelised TV scripts [Terrance Dicks, one of the underrated novelists of all time; John Peel (no, not that one...). The rest were fanfic writers given their chance to do something semi-official about an idea they loved; Paul Cornell, Kate Ormond, Gareth Roberts, Jim Mortimore, Andy Lane, Steve Lyons (don't let the Completely Useless Encylopedia fool you), David A. McIntee, and other people. While I wouldn't be so arrogant as to put myself alongside most of them, I had the same basis, same experience and same naivety. Virgin's Dr. Who fiction wing was a mess - for example, the most pivotal book in the series, Aaronovitch's "So Vile a Sin" was delayed for a year when Ben left his laptop on a London Underground train. The point I'm trying to make is that these were fan works aimed at the hardcore fanbase, and it was amateur hour. I wasn't the only perosn caught out by the license change, and if someone who runs a publishing company gets caugt out, you can hardly expect a 16 year old who has to check his mails in lucnh hours at college to have his finger on the pulse.

Originally posted by Redstreak


As Quicky has been and gone a couple times since I posted, I figured he had nothing more to say and it was closed in my mind.

Actually I thought your posts were making my points for me...

Cliffy doesn't have to try to be provocative, for one...

That's a flame, Red. A baseless flame. Don't make me list all the information I've put people's way on this site, all the people who wouldn't know ****-all about the comics if it wasn't for me sitting there on my 56K modem hunting down stray issues. To say I'm always provotacive is a compliment though. I'd rather be pcative that blandly list which episodes I liked, whether I prefered Optimus or Rodimus and what my bloody age was. I post what I think, which makes me a damn sight more honest than 95% of people on this board.

True enough about Casper. However, I am not inclined to agree about Cliffy necessarily. He's hard to miss round here as you know. In that respect, I have seen some intelligent posts out of him, but also a lot of comments that insult intelligence and dismiss other peoples' opinions as though they were cannon fodder.

That's because they are. If people act stupid, they should expect it to be pointed out. If people make broad-brush, ill-informed claims, I'll blow them to bits. This is something I'm not ever going to stop doing, and if I get banned doing it, I go out with the knowledge I never, ever flinched from expressing myself. Well, except once, but I was a young, inexperienced Seeker at the time... No-one who I have any respect for has had a serious problem with my opinions, or the way I express them. I fail to see why you should change this.

He also gets easily riled at running gags and makes efforts to shoot them down because he perceives those that continue the gag as though they should not do such.

Becuase it's stale, and uncomfortable for new posters if we're pushing ou the same old tired injokes topic after topic. It suggests we're not funny or clever enough to come up with our own witticisms [sp?], instead running someone else's off-the-cuff or funny at the time comments into the ground.

When compared with Casper, seeing a similarity between the two aside from ability is difficult. I can get some thread links if you like, but I suspect you don't need them.

Well, while we're not twins or anything [loath as I am to admit it, he's about 15 grades of looks away from me for a start], we both stick by our preferred continuitues, his cartoon, mine comic, and are both prepared to argue to the death about it. Starscream's Ghost has been one of my favourite posters here right from the start, and while we have our little spats in various threads, the thing I enjoy with Ghosty is it's left in that thread. I don't think we've ever had any genuine animosity.

As you rather randomly raised the issue of flaming a bit earlier, I feel I must make a distinction in the way I do this. Generally, I will not flame someone for expressing a valid opinion. If someone can back an rgument with some facts, I'll listen and counter. A great example of this was the infamous battle with Cosmo. But if someone goes around randomly typing "STARSCREAM WAS THE GREATEST!!!!" I will pick them to bits. Another level is when people make a flame war perosnal, as in an attack on the perather than the poster. I have never, ever done this unprovoked. Without wanting to drag up old issues best forgotten, I'll mention Rock and Iki. The former did annoy me while a mod, but then took personally the unfortunate occurance that I was usually the first on the scene when he said something really stupid, and usually told him why this notion was wrong [notable Rock-ups were the Optimus Prime v Primal thread; the Cliffjumper dead in TF:TM? one, and one about the comics where he'd read half the issues and declared the story incomplete]... However, his replies tended to focus on how he perceived my personality to be, so I tore him to shreads. Iki was even more petty - when I was the first to give one of many rather nonchalant replies to his 'leaving', he decided to ridicule my personal appearance. But I never make it personal until someone else does. If someone wants to make it personal, I will not hold back on them. PLEASE NOTE ABOVE DISTINCTION BETWEEN POSTER AND PERSONAL

Not sure what any of that had to do with anything, but I can't have people talking about me in the third person all night, best give you some juicy soundbites...

[Starscreamsghost]

Originally posted by Quicksilver
To say I'm always provotacive is a compliment though...I post what I think, which makes me a damn sight more honest than 95% of people on this board.

And if there's one thing Quicky and I hold deeply in common, it's this. We may disagree on things, but we always stay true to what we think, whatever the consequences. Even if the consequences involve Flec thrashing us both with a stick.

Originally posted by Quicksilver
Starscream's Ghost has been one of my favourite posters here right from the start.

Why thank ye. Right back at you, ya over-opinionated egotist!

Originally posted by Quicksilver
we both stick by our preferred continuitues, his cartoon, mine comic, and are both prepared to argue to the death about it.

And if you ever need evidence of Quicky's value (and who am I kidding, all of us need to reassure ourselves on a regular basis that he does in fact offer us something more than sarcastic cigarette threads), just take a look at my thoughts on the comic between when I arrived here in December 2000 and now. I'll love the cartoon 'til I die just because it played such a big part in my childhood (just as the comic did in Quicky's), but I now appreciate the comic as the superior continuity, whereas I wasn't even aware there was such a thing two years ago.

Originally posted by Quicksilver
the thing I enjoy with Ghosty is it's left in that thread. I don't think we've ever had any genuine animosity.

And if we had, I apologize now. I only wish some people who shall go nameless could leave disagreements, harmless or not, in the thread in which they occur...newbies are actually threatening to leave over simple subject-related conflicts of opinions, for God's sake...

Originally posted by Quicksilver
A great example of this was the infamous battle with Cosmo.

If there was ever a noun that needed to be plural...we need to have wars like that again...somebody bring back Rodimus Prime!!!

[Cliffjumper]

I don't think any apologies are needed Ghsoty. I think we were both lucky enough to undertand each other's senses of humour and views pretty much from the start...

I honestly thought the Cosmo/Cliffy Wars [TM] was just that one huge-ass thread... started out as ana Optimus/Rodimus thread and came down to the two of us batting points back and fore [I think it was the first appearance of me making up stupid dialogue to back up an argument, one for the history books! ], which ground down to me and Cosmo arguing whether Roddy made a bit of an arse of it in the post-Movie comics.. after a few raised voices, it was solved by some handy scans from "Wanted - Dead or Alive" and "Legacy"...

As for brining back Rodimus, go for it! He always united the board. Against him.

Ah, happy days...

[Redstreak]

Originally posted by Quicksilver

That's a flame, Red. A baseless flame. Don't make me list all the information I've put people's way on this site, all the people who wouldn't know ****-all about the comics if it wasn't for me sitting there on my 56K modem hunting down stray issues. To say I'm always provotacive is a compliment though. I'd rather be pcative that blandly list which episodes I liked, whether I prefered Optimus or Rodimus and what my bloody age was. I post what I think, which makes me a damn sight more honest than 95% of people on this board.

I'm lost; are you mad for me saying that or complimented? Cuz I think you just do it unconsciously; maybe it's the way you phrase things. In any case, the bulk of your posts seem to scream 'read me' cuz you have such strong opinions.

That's because they are. If people act stupid, they should expect it to be pointed out. If people make broad-brush, ill-informed claims, I'll blow them to bits. This is something I'm not ever going to stop doing, and if I get banned doing it, I go out with the knowledge I never, ever flinched from expressing myself. Well, except once, but I was a young, inexperienced Seeker at the time... No-one who I have any respect for has had a serious problem with my opinions, or the way I express them. I fail to see why you should change this.

I merely think it might be good to go easy on the newbies a bit...you have that kind of ability to scare people off from expressing themselves or posting entirely; Blitzwheel's first contention with anyone here was with you, and I would be willing to guess you have intimidated him. Not to say that's bad, mind...newbies do need to know their place...but do it with a smile(so they know they won't be killed...mostly)!

Becuase it's stale, and uncomfortable for new posters if we're pushing ou the same old tired injokes topic after topic. It suggests we're not funny or clever enough to come up with our own witticisms [sp?], instead running someone else's off-the-cuff or funny at the time comments into the ground.

M'eh, I can understand the point, but I'm usually of a mind to say 'let them have their fun'. It's not like you or I has to read every topic or anything, so if it bores me I just don't go in it anymore, no matter how bored I get, and boy do I ever get bored sometimes...

In the interest of shortening this post, I cut the last bit out, but reading that was most informative. The main difference between us, I think, is that while my stuff is usually witty and casual, yours is a lot more strongly worded(not to say you aren't witty), and a lot more prone to misinterpretation. When you get misinterpreted, you are thought to be flaming someone, when I get misinterpreted, I am thought to be patronizing. It is bizzare as hell, and I don't like it one bit...

Too many people take things personal around here, which is unfortunate. We've had a couple disagreements lately, but I've left both in their respective threads, although there is a bit of similarity. Just as I will leave this here.

I would pay money to know who holds a grudge on me, though...

Confess! Confess! Cardinal, bring out the comfy chair! [/Monty Python]

[RCOSD]

Originally posted by Starscreamsghost


Flec thrashing us both with a stick.

I didn't know Flec was into Bondage

[Cliffjumper]

Originally posted by Redstreak


I'm lost; are you mad for me saying that or complimented? Cuz I think you just do it unconsciously; maybe it's the way you phrase things. In any case, the bulk of your posts seem to scream 'read me' cuz you have such strong opinions.

Well, it was a bit written-as-I-thought, but the central point was sorta that we all flame, and that there's nothing wrong with it from time to time as long as it doesn't get out of hand. And I'd rather my posts screamed "read me!" that "skip me"!

I merely think it might be good to go easy on the newbies a bit...you have that kind of ability to scare people off from expressing themselves or posting entirely; Blitzwheel's first contention with anyone here was with you, and I would be willing to guess you have intimidated him. Not to say that's bad, mind...newbies do need to know their place...but do it with a smile(so they know they won't be killed...mostly)!

Ah, but I treat all posters as equals. If, say, Brend or Denyer had backed up a point so weakly, and ignored two possible dissections of said point simply because it disproves their argument, I'd have been exactly the same. I will admit that my first reply was slightly lacking in tact, mainly due to a personal reason [that isn't an excuse, just a little bit of context], and maybe I should have constructed a fictional argument first before foucsing on the absurdity of aanlysing the good and bad in Transformers when one set are deigned to be good, and another bad, and I was a little narked at the cartoon only thing, as it gave a strong bias towards Blitzwheel's argument - in a Saturday morning cartoon, the 'Cons weren't going to be shown blowing up San Fransisco. Did I spell that right? Erm, Washington. Basically, if someone dismisses as valid point from an argument because it doesn't fit with what they think, I have little time for them

M'eh, I can understand the point, but I'm usually of a mind to say 'let them have their fun'. It's not like you or I has to read every topic or anything, so if it bores me I just don't go in it anymore, no matter how bored I get, and boy do I ever get bored sometimes...

I tend to prowl most topics in G1, Japanese, Toys, GD, the comic ones in non-tf cartoons and sport... but the thing I dislike is they don't stay confined to one thread. I mean, a few months ago Kickback couldn't post anywhere without someone making a Mook joke, and the fact that Kickback had to speak up to show just how much it was annoying him really showed a joke gone too far. Plus there are a handful of posters [no names, this thread's got enough spice in it for a while! ] who don't seem to do a lot else...

No real damage done in the end, I think... just some, erm, heated debate!

[Starscreamsghost]

Afraid you and Flec might have more in common than you think, RC?

Originally posted by Redstreak
the bulk of your posts seem to scream 'read me' cuz you have such strong opinions.

Surely that's not a bad thing?

Originally posted by Redstreak
I merely think it might be good to go easy on the newbies a bit...you have that kind of ability to scare people off from expressing themselves or posting entirely

Now this might be a valid point. Maybe it's just the fading parts of my memory thanks to all the heavy narcotics use since freshman year, but I do remember Cliffy being a bit more patient with the commonfolk back in the day. Quicky, you might take these comments to heart...had some of us not been merciful at the outset, people like Cosmo might not still be with us...

[sprites touch]

it seems this thred turned into an intelectual pissing contest
a simple question was asked, and a very intercet and complexed multileyered multi posted answer was provided.
lucky for me, that i stoped after about 2 posts

[Halfshell]

Originally posted by Starscreamsghost
Afraid you and Flec might have more in common than you think, RC?

Will you stop calling him that? Please? The phoenetic is kinda disturbing...

had some of us not been merciful at the outset, people like Cosmo might not still be with us...

Exactly why mercy is a bad thing...

...

...

what?

[BigMaki]

Though the topic seems to have been derailed completely from the original intent, I'm going to post anyway and add my two cents as far as a few things that struck me...

As far as getting a book published goes, I believe it was Chuck Palahniuk who said, and I paraphrase quite a bit since it's off the top of my head, "90% of books purchased are bought and read by women between the age of 30 and 50. I like to write for that other 10%." While the argument of getting published vs. getting passed over isn't what he was referring to, I think he makes a good point. On the majority, men under 30 are not really readers. Look at some of the Who's Who Profiles in that forum and you'll see a lot of people who say that they don't like to read. I know that if I ever got around to writing a novel, it would be written for men my age to appreciate. They would likely be the only ones who "get it." And what would happen? Publishers would never even pick it up, since they only want what they can sell. It works the same way with music and films. Fantastic bands toil in obscurity while ear sewage like Creed gets to sell millions of albums by remaking the same song over and over. You get **** films with good looking, young stars and they make millions (example: Scooby Doo.) These businesses are no longer concerned with artistic value. They are concerned only with profit. Yeesh, didn't mean to write this much...

As far as Archive "in-jokes" go, I understand completely why Quicky (or should I call him Cliffy? ) tends to attempt to cut them off so often. It's fun for those writing them, but I find myself rolling my eyes when somebody is assigned a room, somebody tells them not to feed the mods, not to flush the toilet, etc. I don't read the "Hi, I'm new here!" threads any more. I never find out anything new about who's shown up, and I've read all of it before. I'm kind of glad I didn't ever post one, since I probably wouldn't have stuck around. Who wants to show up to the party and be the only one not in on the joke everyone else is laughing at? I like the Who's Who forum better, I think it's a much better (though more time consuming) way to find out about the other denizens of the board.

With that said, I like it here. I may be pretty much a newbie, but it's been quite fun for the 3+ months since I've signed up, and these boards have become a part of my daily ritual.

Might as well say it, this thread has been a great one to follow (as Brend has said already.) Never knew there were so many aspiring authors here...

[Denyer]

Originally posted by Redstreak
I'm not spouting personal abuse...

Nope...line referred to is mainly raising of other unrelated disagreements, which is where character assassinations usually begin to be batted back and forth. If I didn't avoid history as much as I do, I'd end up tearing some people to shreds (including myself on several occasions), and it wouldn't serve any useful purpose because it's opinions I'm disagreeing with rather than people.

Originally posted by Redstreak
if you refer to Jinrai

I honestly didn't even know that...I've stayed out of appointment matters, since they really have nowt to do with me.

Originally posted by Redstreak
Something has to be exceptional in order to slip in under the requirements.

Oh yes...but if it isn't great, why read it except to dissect it, is usually my argument...and I've had enough of overt textual dissection for a while. Only the books that you can't reductively assess, or which you can but still love are worth the time...

Originally posted by Redstreak
But as shown with LOTR, it can be epic and easily made into film.

I think if Tolkien hadn't divided the text well three ways there would have been problems...as it is, they seem not to have cut too much, which is always preferable.

Queen Of The Damned, on the other hand, should IMO be viewed as a completely separate entity from the book...it's very nice music video with decent cast and effects, but it has not even the vaguely inkling of a plot...it's instantly obvious why Anne Rice won't be giving out any more film rights like that for a long time (if ever)...

Originally posted by Redstreak
So I don't think either of us can say that they prefer shorter or longer works when making novels into film, because there is no real consistency.

I've yet to see many epics which weren't severely cut.

Incidentally, anyone know if a UK "Fear And Loathing In Las Vegas" DVD is on the cards for the next year or so, or should I simply save up for the US one? Drawback is I can't take it round to as many people's houses then...damned region codes...

[Cliffjumper]

A mate of mine who reads Empire confidently says there's one out in August. But as it was printed in Empire, I doubt it...

I wasn't too keen on Fear & Loathing myself, thought it was.... ehm... like being sober in a room full of drunk people. You seen Gilliam's Brazil, Denyer?

[Starscreamsghost]

Originally posted by Brendocon
Will you stop calling him that? Please? The phoenetic is kinda disturbing...

Nyet...if you find it disturbing, that's an A-list reason to do it more often, you hack...

Originally posted by sprites touch
it seems this thred turned into an intelectual pissing contest

If we're going by distance, it's sorta unfair since I get such a head-start.....

...ah, intellectual, I see. Are we giving the O'Con a half-handicap, or what?