Transformers: More than Meets the Eye season two discussion

Post by **inflatable dalek** » Wed Sep 17, 2014 7:16 am

Full review to come, but my initial no spoilers read through went like this:

"Well this is going pretty much how I was expecting, looks like I've finally outfoxed Roberts hehehehehehehehehehe...

Ohhhhh...

Wait...

What...

Ohhhhhhhhhhhh....

Hell".

*SHAKES FIST AT SKY*

"ROBERTS!"

I don't think Warcy will like it though.

Red Dave Prime · Post by **Red Dave Prime** » Wed Sep 17, 2014 11:12 am

I thought this was brilliant. Really well done. And...

SPOILER! (select to read)
A great way to have a reset that doesnt feel like a cop out. We end the issue still with the Knowledge that Brainstorm will have to be sorted. It answers questions while creating new ones. And that finally page was awesome looking.

Of course some (like me) will point to niggles. Like - how did the four DJD destroy the crew (looks like Brainstorms case may have been a big help, but that wouldnt explain the crew fighting back at some point). The panel of the DJD in combat was great though - Pipes is pulled apart, Red Alert is zapped by one of Helexs small hands, Tesarus seeming to just pull Cosmos arms off.

Or why did "our" brainstorm not contact the DJD as he was in on the Overlord conspiracy at some point as well.

I am also a little confused about the change in the message thats spoken of here. The original message in issue 1 is the message that the alternate rewind sends, correct? But there is talk here of that being changed but all I can remember form the data ghost was the scream bit. I think I am misunderstanding this but anyway it was still a gripping read and the most satisfying finish to a mini arc that Roberts has done yet (Shadowplay was great but if you take away the last page it lessens it a lot and there is no way anyone could have guessed that last page)

Also: the no briefcase rule - a nice payoff to what felt like a throwaway gag.

Rung - can there only ever be one rung? Does he only exsist in one place? Or, I remember back in issue 8 some people had a theory that Rung was the Necrobot. I never saw this myself but is it possible the quantum explosion created a slightly morbid version of Rung?

Do the DJD still think they killed overlord?

Skids speech against Megatron was excellent. But it put a thought into my head as to why all these recent issues of both MTMTE and RID are actually subtitled Dawn of the Autobots? There seems to be no specefic reason other than maybe Megatron switching sides and that doesnt seem enough.

To be honest the only thing I'm not loving is the swerve thing at the start. It just doesn't fit for me and actually takes me out of the story. Hope it stops but I get the feeling it's sticking around.

Still....

Yeah. Thumbs way up. Cant wait for the next few issues.

Red Dave Prime · Post by **Red Dave Prime** » Wed Sep 17, 2014 11:58 am

Not specifically to do with this issue as such but I am wondering about Tarn. Prowl implies that he is a phase six robot (or as powerful) and when they take down Black Shadow Tarn himself wonders why the phase sixers always rebel. So I'm thinking that when Megatron and Tarn finally go head to head will it be part of what breaks Tran that he himself, a phase sixer, is rebelling?

Also we still have the mystery of an inside agent of the DJD. This implies that either the undercover agent is one of the five and is far too convincing at their job (possible that they were the ones to kill Brain Storm?) or that there is a background of lesser staff to help the DJD.

Or its the sparkeater. Silly, I know but it makes some sense. Brainstorm did seem to have claw marks on him...

MikeB · Post by **MikeB** » Wed Sep 17, 2014 12:54 pm

Red Dave Prime wrote:I thought this was brilliant. Really well done. And...

SPOILER! (select to read)
I am also a little confused about the change in the message thats spoken of here. The original message in issue 1 is the message that the alternate rewind sends, correct? But there is talk here of that being changed but all I can remember form the data ghost was the scream bit.

SPOILER! (select to read)
I read it as the message from Rewind to Chromedome being edited, rather than the issue #1 message. AFAIK there's no confirmation yet who actually sent the message in #1 is there? Unless I've missed something somewhere (which is entirely possible!)

Also, I think Rewind's return was handled as well as possible, or at least if I'm reading between the lines correctly. If you can't have both copies in the same vicinity everyone else would presumably go back to normal, but "our" Rewind isn't on board any more so the new one doesn't have to be cancelled out. Could set up an interesting story for an Overlord return though, if he somehow managed to keep Rewind alive or even just with him. If all that is the case though, then you'd imagine there'll be a couple of dead bodies lying around post reintegration, from bots who were killed and jettisoned previously? Maybe?

Edit: Also also, the final twist, just... wow. WOW.

I need to read it again as I've basically done it in snatches whilst at work, but I'm doing a full series re-read at the mo anyway so may wait until I get through that (2/3 through Dark Cybertron and it's not holding up well at all), but first thoughts were that it was very good, if not at all what I was expecting.

Red Dave Prime · Post by **Red Dave Prime** » Wed Sep 17, 2014 1:13 pm

You may be right about the message - I'm a bit confused by it all and feel a re-read is in order. I feel you could be right about rewind but that wouldn't explain the briefcase. With Overlord... Maybe he is now dead in both versions so cant come back?

As a fan of the series I would prefer if he didn't. There is enough fish to fry and he has gotten too very good outings. We dont need the return of a Super Powered Bot (although I think he may return to help take out the DJD). Personally though, I am done with him.

MikeB · Post by **MikeB** » Wed Sep 17, 2014 2:41 pm

Yeah I hadn't considered the briefcase... I'm also struggling to see the connection between how the briefcase worked for Nightbeat and Nautica vs how it worked for Brainstorm at the end. Different briefcase?

I agree that we don't need another Overlord story (at least in the short term) as there are so many different loose ends out there (Pharma, the whole Luna 1 / cyberutopia business, DJD, Tyrest off the top of my head) as well as the possibility of new stories, but I have a feeling that he will come back.

Re: the DJD mole, I guess I'd always assumed Skids was part of that mix, what with Chromedome's memory read and so on, but I have no idea if the timelines fit. If it's a current member, and one of the big five then they've got one hell of a messed up moral compass. Unless it's the dog thing? When I get past Dark Cybertron I'll try and pay special attention to the flashback scenes of the DJD attacking the lost light in the last 2 issues, maybe one of them is conspicuous by their absence/lack of aggression?

So.... How long until #34 is out?

Post by **zigzagger** » Wed Sep 17, 2014 3:08 pm

Just some quick notes while on the run.

Fairly pleased with this conclusion, with a couple unexpected twists. And here I thought I had it all worked out. Had a couple minor quibble, but more on that later when I have a moment.

Chromedome and Duplicate Rewind's 'reunion'/meeting... Firstly, a brilliant use of art to convey emotion. Secondly... Awwwwwwwwwwww!!!

I can't stop grinning.

And I'm off. Will be back later with more 'detailed' thoughts.

Knightdramon · Post by **Knightdramon** » Wed Sep 17, 2014 6:23 pm

Very good issue that does not feel like a cop out with the reset button at the end.

Regarding the "alternate" Brainstorm--it appears he was killed by falling debris [possibly from an explosion] instead of being murdered.

It -does- feel like one of those last moment things, and the last page felt forced as well--never in any dialogue or movement of his did Brainstorm betray any "evil" like qualities.

Maybe they'll pull a Tarantulas for this one...have him playing both sides.

Definitely the best issue in S2 thus far.

It appears that the next 2 issues are a double-parter...and from 36 onwards we get a flashback for the Orion Pax trilogy.

Unicron · Post by **Unicron** » Wed Sep 17, 2014 6:35 pm

My money is on Brainstorm being Magnificus in disguise. Hence the Perceptor fetish.

That or much more likely he isn't a mole and this whole thing is misdirection. And the faceplate symbol is a fake membership card. "Hey random Decepticon, don't shoot me. I'm one of you, see?"

Post by **inflatable dalek** » Wed Sep 17, 2014 7:21 pm

[Remember folks: ALL= Alternate Lost Light, OLL= Our Lost Light. It's what all the cool kids are doing.]

Knightdramon wrote: It -does- feel like one of those last moment things, and the last page felt forced as well--never in any dialogue or movement of his did Brainstorm betray any "evil" like qualities.

Well, he wouldn't have been a very good double agent if he had been going around acting all evil would he (though he's always been the most cowardly of the regulars by a comfortable margin- I wonder if Megatron not putting himself forward for anything unless he has to was set up as a deliberate parallel?).

I'm inclined to think double bluff with Brainstorm as well, but if not, the fact he was on Kimia at the same time as Skyfall found a way to pass on Gideon's Glue to the Decepticons is suggestive (it's also suggestive that place had a serious vetting problem).

Taken at face value the Decepticon symbol under the faceplate is ludicrous, sure it's a nice nod at Peace and is more visually interesting than if they'd just found him with the machine that summoned the DJD, but how would that work on a day to day level? What if it had been ripped off in battle or an accident? No wonder he's a coward.

So I would lean towards a plant. Considering the story was very quick to establish that ALL Rewind's recording was canned very quickly by Ultra Magnus so they only have his word for what happened after Rodimus' death, are we actually looking at him being the mole, blackmailed into it because the Decepticons have Dominus Ambus? Or is that way too obvious?

If it was Brainstorm, that means we have an answer as to why none of his super weapons were used in the crews defence, and having a man on the inside disabling the security systems would explain a lot about the ease of victory.

One other thing the issue seemed to go out of its way to establish was that the two Brainstorm's hadn't come up with the same weapons during their time on the ship. I will bet now this is foreshadowing for the two briefcases actually doing different things (though he had it before he came aboard he's been mucking about with it all this time, it could do all sorts of extra things by now), and the final solution will pit briefcase against briefcase.

I'm also assuming the Time Lock thingey on Overlord's cell was broken on OLL as well, the signal just never reached the DJD.

The highlight of the issue was the Chromedome/Rewind reunion, considering I was dead against it the slight of hand in making you think it had been a one off return before that beautifully done page really packed a wallop.

The rest of the issue was damn good as well, everything flowed neatly, Megatron and Ravage got more great material (as did Skids with his speech) and all the pieces fell into place with a satisfying clunk.

Only two minor niggles:

1: The "Oh, you never believed he was dead" bit in the recap felt like Roberts occasional tendency of having a go at things people don't like the series (along with the "Do I look like a Mary Sue?" and... well the whole resolution of the Circle of Light plot), considering how overwhelmingly loved the book it that has always felt a bit pointless and petty just to put Warcry in his place.

However fully deserved.

2: Still not liking how Nightbeat is being written (considering his cameo in Shadowplay was handled perfectly I'm not sure what Roberts is doing wrong here), bring back Bogart Nightbeat! It also continued the fine and long-standing tradition (going all the way back to The Big Shutdown where Siren just rides up and explains the plot to him before he has a chance) of the Autobot's greatest Detective not getting to do much detectoring, Rewind just tells him everything he needs to know.

The stuff with him working out what linked the vanishing people was a welcome break from this tradition, but was a subplot is an issue with a lot more going on in it. So before season 2 is out I'd really love a proper Nightbeat detective story where he works things out through investigation and smarts rather than people expositioning at him.

Post by **Denyer** » Wed Sep 17, 2014 7:43 pm

Came out wonderfully. In the hands of another (lesser) writer the conceit would've played out another twelve issues and not had any pace-shifting twist either.

Skyquake87 · Post by **Skyquake87** » Wed Sep 17, 2014 7:46 pm

What a smashing issue. I wasn't sure how this would be 'reset' , but I am pleased it was done in a smart way. I am still not sure what I make of Rewind's return - its that whole comics thing of an alternate version of a character replacing the original (although in this case, it isn't...I think I've just gone cross-eyed). Time will tell. I just don't like stuff that does away previous emotional climaxes that you've invested in just because. I'm sure Roberts has a plan.

And Brainstorm!

Didn't see that coming. Although it seems silly for someone to have their real insignia stamped on them somewhere - kind of defeats the object of being in deep cover. Unless the brands are like tattoos...

Unlike Dalek, I like Nightbeat's abrasive personality. He's Sheldon from The Big Bang Theory, isn't he? That said, I agree it would be good for him to do some proper detecting.

Lovely art this issue, and I am hoping Ravage sticks around. I like him - and I liked that scene of him getting annoyed and being pat on the head by Nautica

Post by **inflatable dalek** » Wed Sep 17, 2014 7:59 pm

Skyquake87 wrote: Unlike Dalek, I like Nightbeat's abrasive personality. He's Sheldon from The Big Bang Theory, isn't he? That said, I agree it would be good for him to do some proper detecting.

There's nothing wrong with his personality as such (though it's fairly stock Lost Light), it's just not Nightbeat's personality. Can anyone seriously imagine this guy having a friendly drink outside a space pub with Quark?

I want the guy back who had a wry cynical edge but had a love of mystery driven by a sense of inquisitive fun rather than being a dick.

Fair enough if Dark Cybertron is supposed to have changed him, but it's odd no one else on the ship has noticed or cared (especially in Dark Cybertron where it should have been a major clue something was wrong).

Lovely art this issue, and I am hoping Ravage sticks around. I like him - and I liked that scene of him getting annoyed and being pat on the head by Nautica

It took less than six months before we had a fembot petting a pussy. The perverted fanboys have taken over!

Skyquake87 · Post by **Skyquake87** » Wed Sep 17, 2014 8:09 pm

inflatable dalek wrote:The perverted fanboys have taken over!

..takes one to know one etc etc

Post by **Warcry** » Thu Sep 18, 2014 3:53 am

inflatable dalek wrote:I don't think Warcy will like it though.

Eh. Rewind was never going to stay dead. Everyone knew that from the get-go, as much as we might have hoped otherwise. Not much point being upset with the inevitable. What will really be telling is if Roberts actually does anything with Rewind now or if it's just feels-bait. But since Rewind's return is, for now, the only lasting consequence of opening the coffin, I think it's safe to say that there's a bigger plan in play for him. I don't think he's evil or a DJD spy, but I do think that his presence will bring something big and negative down on them.

I agree with you that Nightbeat being an antisocial jerk feels totally wrong, though.

The issue mostly avoided pointless, masterbatory bigging up of the DJD, gave Megatron, Ravage and Nautica some added depth, and wrapped up the quantum duplicate storyline in a satisfactory way. The quantum mechanics jokes even worked this time. I liked it!

Curious to see where the Brainstorm thing is going. Given that this isn't pro wrestling, I'm going to assume there's way more to the story than "Haha, I was evil all along even though it makes very little sense!"

Also curious to know what's in the briefcase, since it had a totally different effect last issue compared to the one we saw at the end of this one. Are their multiple briefcases? Or is the briefcase not actually related to either the time-shuffling or the knockout power?

My insane theory is that the briefcase itself (or who/whatever is inside it) is malevolent, and somehow controlling Brainstorm. Especially if he actually crammed that Point-One-Percenter spark into it like he implied he might.

Post by **zigzagger** » Thu Sep 18, 2014 5:25 am

Just some more thoughts:

Chromedome and ALL Rewind's reunion still has me grinning.

Anyway, I'm fairly confident that Roberts has something planned with Rewind, if thecover for issue #35 is anything to go by. We shall see.

Love that Megatron seems to be at odds with his past Decepticon self and the so-called Autobot. He's adjusting, little by little, and gets more and more easier to empathize with, which seemed nigh-****ing-impossible just a few issues ago. It's some damn satisfying character growth.

Ravage gets to be Megatron's companion! And I'm so all for that. Two issues in and I love him.

Skids seems to be Megatron's moral compass. It's a role I wouldn't have pegged him for, so I'm pleasantly surprised. Good on him for telling off Megatron, too.

Re: Nightbeat -- I'm with Skyquake on this one. With the IDW-verse, I've long accepted that characters not matching up with earlier incarnations comes with the territory. Then again, I've always kind of appreciated that about this continuity. Mind, I agree that Marvel Nightbeat is a far more memorable character, likable even, but I like Roberts' take all the same.... errr, even if it is inconsistent with the one from the -Ations era.

Also agree that I would like to see Nightbeat do some more detective-ing and go on a silly caper with Nautica ala Matrix Quest style. He's got the Sherlock-esque snark and the whole deductive reasoning thing down -- which makes him Nightbeat enough for me -- but yeah, it'd be nice to see him actually walk the talk.

Death's Head · Post by **Death's Head** » Thu Sep 18, 2014 9:20 am

Anyway, I'm fairly confident that Roberts has something planned with Rewind, if the cover for issue #35 is anything to go by. We shall se

That is an interesting cover - something to do with Rewind's old flame, Dominus Ambus, perhaps?

Summerhayes · Post by **Summerhayes** » Thu Sep 18, 2014 11:22 am

Hey, I only got this a day late for once! And I still didn't manage to read it before we were on the second page of chat...

Bloody good issue, as always. I still feel it was a little too happy an ending re: Rewind, but it worked well enough and i'm sure there's much more to come. Megatron comforting him at the end was a great moment. I'm getting the impression that Megs isn't necessarily bad, but maybe is a big ol' space racist. Hopefully he'll work through that.

A few thoughts on Brainstorm; According to Rodimus' conversations with Drift, the Decepticon Initiation Ceremony involves cutting off a piece of spark casing to make the insignia, so it makes sense he'd keep it. I'm sure (or at least, hopeful) that there will turn out to be more to it than Brainstorm being an out-and-out buddy, though. Too bad we've probably got a two - parter and a three - parter before we find out!

Terome · Post by **Terome** » Thu Sep 18, 2014 3:02 pm

I have read this now!

Pretty satisfying. It sold me the Rewind comeback I'd been dreading, went a long way towards futher selling the logic of having Megatron onboard and had a good display of the sort of attention-to-detail that I like. Plus, Ravage was lots of fun and we've got some tasty mysteries to chew on with Brainstorm and Rewind.

I think the Tarn-is-Ambus lobby is becoming more convincing with every issue, don't you?

Quite liking this Nightbeat, in contrast to you lot. I'd actually forgotten he was in the early -ations and can't recall much of what made him stand out other than being lobostomised and shot. Here he serves a valuable function as a know-it-all and, along with Skids, seems to elicit some hints of admiration or respect from Megatron. 'There's a type' indeed.

So the ALL briefcase is some sort of undo button and the OLL briefcase is a big knock-you-all-out spell. How did the ALL briefcase get so far away from Brainstorm's body? Was ALL Brainstorm shot in the back?

Art seemed a bit deadline-towing in the last few pages. I imagine the poor art team were bushed after the last issue.

It'll be nice to spend time with Magnus, Rodimus, Perceptor and all the rest next month. I like these new additions but none of them seem to like each other much, Nightbeat and Nautica excluded. Does Skids remember being best buddies with Getaway now? He doesn't seem to really interact with him much.

So we only have Rewind's word that Chromedome is dead but the Necrobot definitely witnessed the death of a Chromedome somewhere. Presumably the DJD did not bother to report on their slaughter of Autobots or put Rewind's recording to propaganda use as Megatron wasn't surprised to see any of these cats alive. Must have confused whoever was taking those reports from the mole.

Last observation: on colour. It's been talked about before but it really seems as though purple=Decepticon to Transformers who went through the war. I wonder if anyone's made that clear to Nautica the way they do to Cyclonus. I also wonder if there's a reason why Decepticons gravitate towards that colour. Some mythic or cultural connection? Is it the same reason that Cyclonus is purple? I like the implication that Transformers attach a lot of significance to colour. It makes sense as they are all brightly-coloured children's toys.

Post by **Warcry** » Thu Sep 18, 2014 3:07 pm

zigzagger wrote:Re: Nightbeat -- I'm with Skyquake on this one. With the IDW-verse, I've long accepted that characters not matching up with earlier incarnations comes with the territory. Then again, I've always kind of appreciated that about this continuity. Mind, I agree that Marvel Nightbeat is a far more memorable character, likable even, but I like Roberts' take all the same.... errr, even if it is inconsistent with the one from the -Ations era.

That's the main thing for me -- IDW Nightbeat used to be the likeable hardboiled detective that we all know and love. Changing him into a less-likeable character without any of the other cast noticing or caring, for no particularly good reason other than that the writer wants to (and apparently loves some random BBC show?), is kind of annoying. Especially when Roberts has shown such skill in the past at giving utter nobodies new personalities -- if he wanted to write a character like BBC Sherlock, then it'd make more sense to use Streetwise or Stakeout or someone.

And it's not like Nightbeat is the only time that people have been annoyed by such a change -- Costa did the same thing with Prowl and the fanbase flipped out on him. People actually like Roberts, so the reaction is closer to mild annoyance, but I think it's perfectly reasonable to be irked by it.

Death's Head wrote:That is an interesting cover - something to do with Rewind's old flame, Dominus Ambus, perhaps?

I'm probably wrong, but for me the pile of dead "disposables", the propaganda-like message right above them and the title of the story all point towards this being set back in the days of Chaos Theory/Shadowplay.